Why is everyone making me feel guilty for NOT liking our new president (elect), page 5

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reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 10:37 AM by Epinephrine

reply to post by Open_Minded Skeptic

I'd be much more inclined to believe this if the media weren't making a big deal about the "historic achievement" of our first black president after months of saying that people who voted against Obama were racists(even implying at times that the only reason for an Obama loss would have been racism) and if Obama supporters were not so quick to accuse those who are not supportive of Obama as racists and bigots.

Accusations of racism and bigotry, as overused as they are, are still an effective means of silencing criticism. If Obama supporters and the media are so quick to accuse those who are critical or unsupportive of Obama of racism and also believe such accusations, how can Obama be criticized? Anyone who attempts it will be labeled a racist and a nazi so long as the labels are still distasteful in public opinion.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 10:39 AM by Lokey13

reply to post by cognoscente

The reason a large number of the populus is behind this man is because that for once Americans have hope. We again have been reminded that in the USA anything can happen, even a black guy can become president; which if this were just 10 years ago that subject would be absurd. The American dream has been brought back to life, pulled from the ashes where Bush left it. The people now can dream again be optimistic and actual believe that there is a future and that maybe just maybe some dreams can come true.

[edit on 6-11-2008 by Lokey13]

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 10:45 AM by Lokey13

reply to post by Epinephrine

Well why don't we go to McCain's little known war on Obama of filling his supporters with the fear and doubt that Obama is 1. Not a Christian 2. Possibly a Terrorist 3. Has friends who are currently Terrorists. Now to me that seems a little bit like racism and yeah thank god it didn't work. McCain's campaign was filled with more racism and doubt then Obama's campaign ever had.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 10:54 AM by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by ghostlandseller
I should be able to not like Obama and not feel pressured or guilty.

That's not true. People have the right to express themselves to you. Especially if you put your opinion out there for others to respond to.

No one "makes" you feel anything. If you feel guilty, it's your choice. And if you refuse to feel guilty, that's your choice, too. Forget about how others want you to feel. That's my advice.

If you don't like or trust Obama, you don't like or trust him. And you're free to express it. What's NOT in your control (and at the crux of this thread) is what other people are going to say or think. Sorry, that's life.

Frankly, your complaining in your first post sounds a lot like whining. People are going to tell you to give him a chance, they may pressure you, or say you're a fool or whatever. That's THEIR choice. Buck up. Everyone has opinions. And if you're going to share yours, you're probably going to hear theirs.

But you are "allowed" to like and not like anyone you want. I love Obama. But I don't care how you feel about him.

Everyone says "Give him a chance before you hate him!" isn't it supposed to be the other way around? Let him prove himself then love him? Im pretty sure this is how the world works. You don't get married to someone then see if you like them.

We aren't marrying Obama. Electing someone to office is different than marriage. That's for sure. I don't plan on choosing someone new to marry every 4 years...

There is no one way that the world works. Some people have him judged and convicted even before he does ANYTHING, much less something wrong. And the other extreme isn't going to say anything bad about him even when he royally screws up. Think of all the people who still love Bush.

I will wait to judge his performance until he actually does something. He isn't in office yet. I have no idea how you could judge him yet, but that's YOUR thing, not mine. I will give him a good 2 years before I make the judgment as to whether we made the right decision or not and I will be critical of his movements until then. And I will speak out when I think he's screwing up. But that's just me.

So... You don't like Obama? Good! Shout it out. But don't whine and complain when people tell you what they think... Or go ahead and complain. But you'll probably hear about it from someone like me.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 10:55 AM by Open_Minded Skeptic

reply to post by Epinephrine

You raise a good point, and we must all be on watch for inappropriate racism claims.

However, many of the 'criticisms' levelled at Obama so far are, I believe, vulnerable to being interpreted as euphamisms for racist attacks.

For instance that he is Muslim, that he is not a US-born citizen and that he is a Socialist, just to name a few.

None of these claims is anywhere even remotely true, yet they persist. Look at the near-frantic insistance that Obama provide his birth certificate. That demand has been placed on no other presidential candidate of which I am aware. Only on the one black candidate who had a real shot at success.

The mere fact of this kind of attack being present does not by any means prove it is racially based, but it is vulnerable to that interpretation.

I'd like to see the guy judged based on actual results. And we need to keep in mind the mess he is inheriting... to expect everything to be all sunshine and lollipops any time soon is absurd (I'm not saying you have this expectation).

I for one fully expected him to lose the election, from a combination of GOP shenanigans at the polls and reluctance of white people to vote for a black man for president. I was totally wrong on the second count, and from what I've heard from independent observers, there was not as many shenanigans as we've seen before, either.

So I'm going to continue to wait and see. He is no more considered a Messiah by many of his supporters than Bush was by his (and no less, btw).

I don't have a problem with people disagreeing with Obama's stated policies and ideas... that's part of our culture and way of doing things.

I do have a problem with people getting all bent out of shape over stuff that is just plain not true. Although I still support the right of these folks to get so bent. I just judge it a waste of time and energy...

As for claims of racism being a means to silence criticism... I'll wait on that, as well. If he blows it in my estimation, I will absolutely start criticizing him. And if someone claims those criticism are due to Obama's race, I'll expect them to back up those claims. Until then, they are so much broken wind, not to be taken seriously.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:00 AM by Oreyeon

Originally posted by Mozzy
it's because obama being president stands for what a lot of this site stands for. it's about revolution and the fact that a simple man can make it that far.

why does that count for more than when previous presidents were elected after being farmers? you're right it doesn't it's stupid. but the point is people recognize an upheavel when they see one, and this "appears" to be one.

i would never vote for either of those AHs in a million years, no one with a brain would. i just saw a lady on tv saying " i voted for mc cain but i didn't vote because of race, i made a philosophical decision based on the TWO candidates."

and she was the "wise" person on the news interview. it's just sick, that lady was twice as old as i am and doesn't have a friggin clue.

What I don't get and find hilarious and SAD, is that everyone has this "Lesser of Two Evils Logic" believing the hypnotic brainwashing that was spoonfed to them, suggesting that there were only TWO candidates. There were more than two candidates, and plenty of opportunity to save this country from disaster. I voted McKinney, Green Party. You all get what you deserve the next 4 years. Good complacent little sheeples.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:05 AM by n2neee

reply to post by CreeWolf

lol hey remember the movie... Head Of State featuring Chris Rock running for pres .... almost similar to what happen ey ;]

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:13 AM by jsobecky

reply to post by ghostlandseller

I have said before that I didn't trust Obama. His past associations have been pooh-poohed by the MSM and his supporters here as not relevant.

Then what is the first thing he does after being elected? Names Rahm Emanuel as his Chief of Staff.

You know, the Rahm Emanuel that repeatedly stuck a kitchen knife into a table and screaming "DEAD! DEAD!" as he named off his opponents.

nymag.com...

Don't feel guilty or ashamed because you don't like Obama. You have good reason not to.

[edit on 6-11-2008 by jsobecky]

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:19 AM by wylekat

reply to post by Lokey13

We again have been reminded that in the USA anything can happen, even a black guy can become president

Bah. No- only a RICH black guy (or white or anyone else) can be president. Impress me- find a POOR person who makes it in to the white house.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:20 AM by MetatronCubensis

Don't let anyone make you feel guilty. It's your right (and duty) as an American to question and hold your government accountable. The Obaaaaaaama sheeple have been deceived. Stand up for yourself and your opinions.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:22 AM by Anonymous ATS

Don't feel guilty. You have the same right to express your feelings as any other American. Freedom of Speech is still a right (until Obama takes it away-at least on the Internet; look out!)

And I'll express my feelings. I hate the guy. I hate him for all of the misogynistic behavior that he, his campaign staff and his followers waged against women in general from the beginning of his campaign until now. He is a liar and a cheat who bought his way into an election. I hate liars and cheats and men who abuse women and women's rights. Doesn't matter whether they are white, black, yellow, brown or purple. On top of that, I think he is a dangerous man who is out to destroy this country for his own gain, and I have a lot of fear that our American way of life is about to come to an abrupt halt. I will never recognize him as my president. Ever. I am an Independent voter who voted Gore, Kerry, McCain in the last three elections, just in case you want to accuse me of being a Republican.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:23 AM by sos37

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

And then YOU will hear back from someone like me.

I do not like Obama. He is a thief, a liar, a criminal and one of the most wicked men in politics, aside from Dick Cheney in my opinion.

I WILL NOT give the man or his racist wife a chance. I WILL NOT acknowledge him as MY president. I WILL NOT compromise MY principals to make the masses look favorably upon me. I will NOT give up my love for this country and the freedoms given to me by soldiers who gave their lives so that I might make my own decisions just so the Democrats in office can TAKE AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS and turn this country into a socialist cesspool.

You Obama supporters can label me whatever you want, call me whatever names you want for not kissing the hand of your "messiah". You know where you can shove your criticisms. But this is the time when patriots and martyrs are born. It's not the time for cowardice among the true conservatives. You take this anger and you hold onto it and use it in constructive ways - myself, I am constructing a website that will go live within a month. This site will catalog EVERY DAY of Obama's administration. I plan to show this evil man for the liar that he is by watching and hawking his EVERY move and his EVERY decision. Every waffle, every flip-flop, every disappointment of the American people will be documented for everyone to see. This is what I mean by taking that anger and doing something constructive with it. Don't do anything stupid, that only serves to make the conservatives look worse than the media unfairly portrayed us this year.

Let Obama and his Democratic minions in Congress have rule of this country for the next two years - it will be a huge eye opener to Obama's supporters and they will be disappointed beyond belief once these two years are over.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:25 AM by wylekat

reply to post by Lokey13

Well why don't we go to McCain's little known war on Obama of filling his supporters with the fear and doubt that Obama is 1. Not a Christian 2. Possibly a Terrorist 3. Has friends who are currently Terrorists. Now to me that seems a little bit like racism and yeah thank god it didn't work.

I think it worked exactly as it was supposed to. A puppeteer makes his puppet move by yanking the strings. And all the racially motivated voters got their strings yanked but good. Everyone else- the ones who thought he would be actually changing America for the good or the ones who don't have a clue who or what he is, much less what planet they live on, just filled in the gaps.

Like I said- I think both of them are crooks. The proof will be in the smelly brown substance some will call 'pudding' and others will call *something else*. Too bad we'll all be up to our necks in it, and each of us will have to take a BIIIG mouthful.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:31 AM by seagull

reply to post by Open_Minded Skeptic

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

More people will be watching because he's a democrat, than because he's black...in my view anyway. He's a very inexperianced politician playing in waters he's never ever ventured into. In that we agree.

To those who think all criticism leveled against him is racially driven, how in the world was he elected then? He shouldn't have recieved the nomination, muchless won the election.

Whilst racism, and it's older brother bigotry, still most certainly still exist, this election would seem to bolster the case that it's not near the boogeyman some would have us believe. Would a blackman have been elected to the White House even 10 years ago? You know the answer as well as I do, not too likely.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:33 AM by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by sos37
And then YOU will hear back from someone like me.

Exactly. That's how it works. Glad to see you got the point of my post.

I WILL NOT give the man or his racist wife a chance. I WILL NOT acknowledge him as MY president. I WILL NOT compromise MY principals to make the masses look favorably upon me. I will NOT give up my love for this country and the freedoms given to me by soldiers who gave their lives so that I might make my own decisions just so the Democrats in office can TAKE AWAY MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS and turn this country into a socialist cesspool.

That's the spirit!

The election's over. I don't care what you do or say or if you stomp and turn red and throw a little tantrum.

Same for the OP. He should say what's on his mind and get it out there. Other people's opinions and criticisms are not his (or her) problem. There are those who hate Obama and those who love him.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:35 AM by 27jd

reply to post by ghostlandseller

Are you for real? I dislike both parties, and I am a white person who has never felt guilty about slavery, and a white man who does acknowledge that we're not all the same, we are different. However, I do not HATE anybody because they are different. I only hate people who hate me. But this election has brought out an ugly side of alot of people that I never knew existed to such a degree in this day and age. You are some very insecure individuals, who seem to be afraid of all the "mud people" banding together and forcing you to marry someone of the same sex. It's mostly rural Christians I've noticed, who are the bigots in this day and age, and it's just funny how so many of you tried to hide it until their your backs were against the wall and you started to see there were many more who share your ignorance. But the most cowardly thing in my mind, is somebody who hides who they are. If you're a bigot, you're a bigot. Be YOU.

Sorry bigots, just calling a spade a spade. Pun intended.

[edit on 6-11-2008 by 27jd]

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:43 AM by sirbikesalot06

Originally posted by ghostlandseller
This is odd! Since when am i not allowed to dislike our president. Everyone is just all over me when i say, I do NOT Like BARACK OBAMA.

I know this election has been so strangely different than past elections. People are so aggressive and passionate. But i don't like people saying i am ignorant and that i should feel ashamed because i do not love Barack Obama. i know WHY i do not like him and it is largely economically and character based.

I mean i just don't see a lot of reason to proclaim this guy our savior yet. he has no proven track record! he does not have a fool proof financial plan. I am not anti democrat, i actually like the alternation, it keeps things balanced. i feel like he has an almost dangerous amount of power with his oratory skills. he can influence people to a stunning degree. its impressive but only if used for good. and i don't exactly trust him YET. I just do not like the guy. But this isn't about why i do or don't like Obama.

I hear ya, I hear ya. I understand completely. He's still a human being, but if your like me and voted for Bush in the past, you'll understand that these same people don't understand why you voted for Bush in the first place.
I don't feel like he's our savor, but I am convinced that the American People choose correctly for they have always chosen correctly in the past. In my opinion the worse two presidents, (names not known to me) was the one before Lincoln, and that guy who served one term during the 1920's Only time will tell if Bush is in the same league as these guys.

As A matter of fact, I am tired of hearing news story's about Obama. the media is having a orgasim over his victory. And I'm tired of hearing it. For once I wish I never listen to NPR or Glenn yesterday. But I am glad I listen to Rush.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:48 AM by rapinbatsisaltherage

I don’t care if you dislike Obama, though I’d prefer it was for reasonable reasons and not race or unfounded rumors about him being some Muslim Marxist (I’m not saying you subscribe to either group).

We need to question our President and sometimes supporters just can not do it like the opposition does. We now realize the pitfalls of allowing a President to get away with almost everything with out being questioned by the people or the media.

I welcome scrutiny of President-elect Obama. Some members here who disagree with his economic policies I think ask very good questions of him. I just wish people could do so with the same respect they showed their previous candidate and I wish they would at least be open to giving Obama a chance.

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:48 AM by burdman30ott6

Originally posted by conspiracy nut
the least you could do is congratulate the obama fans for the fact that obama won. be sportsmanslike. maybe you can offer something that you like about him while mentioning the things you dont.
it does not reflect well if you act like a sore loser. if you have not been actin like a sore loser then they should just respect your views and call it a day. debates on politics and religion can get very nasty with some people.

Sore loser? Sportsmanlike? This isn't the damned SUper Bowl, man, it's the freaking LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD! It isn't like we watched our hated rival hit a grand slam in the ninth inning of game 7 of the World Series to beat our team. It isn't like Duke getting beat in the Final Four by UNC. Sportsmanship only applies when you're dealing with things that, at the end of the day, really have no tangible value to the supporting parties aside from feeling good when your guys win and feeling bad when they lose, in other words: sports. This is different in so many ways it's ridiculous for you to even attempt to apply sports behaviors to it.

If the Braves, Broncos. Suns, Avs, etc tank, I mope for a couple days then look forward with high expectations to next season. When we elect a president who's policies scare the bejesus out of me and who I believe will leave this nation in even more tatters than it's currently in, I prepare to do a little more than just "moping."

reply posted on 6-11-2008 @ 11:50 AM by Epinephrine

Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
reply to post by Epinephrine

You raise a good point, and we must all be on watch for inappropriate racism claims.

However, many of the 'criticisms' levelled at Obama so far are, I believe, vulnerable to being interpreted as euphamisms for racist attacks.

For instance that he is Muslim, that he is not a US-born citizen and that he is a Socialist, just to name a few.

I think there is valid concern to question the legitimacy of his citizenship, having read some information about this, if only because he should have lost his U.S. citizenship when he moved to and became a citizen of Indonesia. There was also a lawsuit which claimed that Obama's birth certificate was identified as a forgery by independent document forensic experts. That he has family members who are illegal aliens doesn't help him one bit. But since the validity of McCain's right to run based on where he was born had also been in the new I do not see how anyone could think that Obama was being unfairly singled out, especially for his race.

Obama's "spread the wealth" comment and his connections with the Democratic Socialists of America give some credence to claims that Obama is a socialist. Thus it is not racist to accuse Obama of being a socialist.

I think that in suggesting that non-racial criticisms could be euphemisms for racism shows a willingness on your part and is a nod of approval of a sorts to, as mentioned, shut down any criticism or argument against Obama through accusations of racism. In this case, it's not overt racism but "secret" racism that must be shut down.