The ATS Issues Thread

Originally posted by Amaterasu

truth is, the u2u exchange between Nomadrush and myself is quite the opposite of what he claims. His response to the automated u2u one gets from an offtopic tag was childish and rude and I responded with a single line offering to return his points since the offtopic post was then deleted by a higher up. his response was more of the same and then I explained the issue regarding his offtopic post and told him I was going to overlook the snide remarks in the previous u2u's.

Was all this before or after the "legalese" U2U he posted on his blog that informed him of a deal that precluded the continuation of the then present arrangement?

I suspect it was after... And I can assure you that from the moment that original U2U was received, all behavior was driven by pain and, though poor, as I have said, still understandable.

suspect wrong.

my exchange with him was several days before the issues he is complaining about. my exchange with him took place maybe a week before he had the falling out and, as I mentioned, all that other stuff, the WMA discussion etc came after we talked. Again, my exchange with him was over his going off topic, repeatedly, in one thread and I explained why it was off topic and why he needed to stop posting the same questions and no, the reason wasn't related to his show, the suggestion from WMA or anything of the sort. It was entirely unrelated. This is why I was a bit shocked to see him calling me out and implying that I was the one dropping the WMA issue on him. I'm guessing that, given my position here, and given my "reputation" amongs some of our detractors, he felt it would suit him better to make me the bad guy and to let me take more heat for being, what was it he called me....oh, yeah, I know. can't say it here.


what's even funnier is that shortly after we had our exchange he shot me a u2u about something totally unrelated. he wanted to share a funny thing that happened to him. something that he was proud of and something that he found funny.

odd that someone who was so upset with me would u2u me and let me in on this little private slice of life. more so since he said it was private and not to be shared with anyone. and I didn't share it with anyone, even though it was very cool and very funny. I said I wouldn't and I didn't.

very trusting of him to drop a little bit of his personal life on a guy he's comparing to the exit portion of the human anatomy.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by Crakeur
what was it he called me....oh, yeah, I know. can't say it here.

Oooo....Oooooh......I know!!!


The ATS Issues Thread can be summed up in three short words.....


Get over it.

Every thread on this site is supposed to be about "issues". So go start some.

Originally posted by Amaterasu
I agree that his choice of behavior was poor. But I also think that in boiling it down, one must also include the fact that ATS failed to act on a personal level, terminating the arrangement with nomadrush abruptly and with no sensitivity for his point of view.

Are you refusing to read what I post?

The loose agreement was in no way "terminated abruptly." As soon as the nature of the exclusivity in our deal was apparent, we informed Ross we needed to gracefully curtail his forum within 14 days. How on earth can you consider such a thing abrupt?

Both sides chose poorly.

Not true, see above... we had every desire for a graceful and amenable closure. Prior to the message, I was even investigating a solution to export all the threads in his forum to whatever forum software he would use... which is something we were fully prepared to do.

Agreed, but when one feels hurt by what appears to be cavalier dismissal, this is not an unexpected behavior. Poor choice, yes. Unexpected, no.

Absolutely unexpected. He received the benefit of our high search engine ranking, dedicated staff, and superior forum software for nearly three years. You seem to be refusing to comprehend the complete situation.

Originally posted by dodgygeeza
Are you even talking about the right person? I believe my questions and proposals were perfectly rational.

Well, although I responded to your point about community, I was kinda referring generally to a few different posters here, sorry to make it seem like I was singling you out.

I was only responding to your obvious arse-kissing and offering a sensible perspective, rather than being the 'teachers pet'.

Sure, you're right. I have SO much to gain being a 'teachers pet'. Couldn't have been that I am sincere in my appreciation of this site. I couldn't care less if you think I'm brown nosing.

Either way, this no longer concerns me.

K.



[edit on 20-9-2008 by 27jd]

As an update to my original concern over a potential privacy violation within ATS, the return response from TrustE was the following:

" We have carefully reviewed your Watchdog and the additional requested information. Because the information posted on the site (a list of the domains from which the highest number of connections were made) is not defined as personally-identifiable information, we see no violation of our program. "

Case closed. You are not in violation.

My apology.

It still however does puzzle me that an attachment to the GOP was made if non personally identifiable information wasn't submitted.

Peace


[edit on 20-9-2008 by HIFIGUY]

Dear Amigos and Staff:

Ain't it grand fun trying to run a website which consists of 9,000 or so suspicious and semi-paranoid conspiracy theorists, malcontents, and alternative thinkers from a fishbowl?

I swear some of these people could turn over a rock, find 3 centipedes, and wonder whether they'd stumbled upon a meeting of alien insectoid spybots.

Gotta love us though. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, and some people are paranoid because someone really is after them.

I can bet that your lives are never boring or dull, and I really do hope that, overall, you enjoy what you're doing. It'd be a real tragedy if you didn't.

You guys are great. ATS is great. I haven't found any other place like it where I can come and present all of my minority opinions and crazy ideas and have other people actually think about them and discuss them with me. Not to mention all the stuff I can learn about that I wouldn't find most places. It's way cool! But you know that; that's part of why you're doing it.

Just remember that for every member who's in here trying to find nefarious schemes and sinister plots behind everything you do, there are a few hundred members out on the boards happily indulging their addiction to ATS but not taking the time to stop in and tell you how great it is. And that's just human nature, you know. Every business that has customers or members gets way more complaints than compliments no matter how great a job they're doing.

Have a great day and don't let a few thorns make you forget about the roses.

*** Reminder ***

This thread is about ATS issues.

Please remain on topic.

Thank You.

Originally posted by dodgygeeza
reply to post by Gemwolf

 

Ok, in that case can my thread be re-opened.

As it stands at the moment, "Everyone has their price, don't they ATS" is front page and has been flagged 70 times since yesterday. They see my post, asking for the thread not to be closed (which it quickly is) and to top it off there is no explaination or rebuttal from the staff. So instead, this appears to other ATS members that I was infact correct and that my thread has been censored (look at its popularity). In short, it doesn't help you guys at all.

In my opinion it should be reopended so this can be put to bed in a public fashion, rather than in the 'back rooms' of ATS.

I hope you understand what I mean.

I agree, your topic should have been left open, this section here (to a certain degree) is too hidden away to be of much use in this situation.

Really my point is this, the site owners/managers e.c.t keep telling us that ''members come first'' and that without members ATS wouldn't exist yet we are not allowed to have any say about anything here, it's obvious that Dodgygeezer's thread is wanted by us members so management/mods e.c.t should re-open it. The flags and stars show proof that it should be open. I'm not saying there shouldn't be rules here, no one wants anarchy, but each case should be judged on it's own merit.

ATS, I personally don't care how much money you make to be honest, in fact why not get some payback after the hard work put in? but give us members a say in certain things is all I'm asking.

In fact, I have just noticed that the ''Everyone has their price, don't they ATS'' thread has been moved to BTS? Is this because of how popular it had gotten? Ah well, next best thing to censorship I suppose.

One last thing site owners/mods/management, don't think people (including me) do not respect how you have built this community and appreciate the hard work put in, credit where credit is due.

Originally posted by Corum

Really my point is this, the site owners/managers e.c.t keep telling us that ''members come first'' and that without members ATS wouldn't exist yet we are not allowed to have any say about anything here

The fact you did just say this and were allowed to say this,proves yourself wrong.


and your whole post has been addressed by the admin in this thread.

Maybe if this topic is of interest to you,you should read it?

Because the concerns members have had, have been answered.

Unless people just want to get their jollies off on board pajama party drama threads against ATS all in their very own forum and the site owners should allow that to happen and your complaining thats unfair that they disagree when they say "got an issue regarding ATS bring it up here?.


Analogy...
The customer is not always right simply because they are a customer.

Which is what I was hearing in your post.

Though by all means think of me as a brown nose if you so choose as well,as other members have labeled like minded people as myself, when its made clear that they are wrong.

Heck if you look up the page a bit,you`ll find someone who admits now that the admin is being very clear and its now understood,yet still called the member a brown nose.,for what being right all along?.

Credit and respect where its due is all it is,but if that makes someone a brown nose,then I suggest.......... an ATS kneel pad to be sold in the store,because there are many of us and we could develop callouses,which may turn out to be a very large revenue raiser and stop further contract issues in the future.

Ya know? just a thought




[edit on 20-9-2008 by gps777]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Amaterasu
I agree that his choice of behavior was poor. But I also think that in boiling it down, one must also include the fact that ATS failed to act on a personal level, terminating the arrangement with nomadrush abruptly and with no sensitivity for his point of view.

Are you refusing to read what I post?

The loose agreement was in no way "terminated abruptly." As soon as the nature of the exclusivity in our deal was apparent, we informed Ross we needed to gracefully curtail his forum within 14 days. How on earth can you consider such a thing abrupt?

when i fit my anti-spin doctor glasses i read it as

"as soon as a cash cow decided to take up residence here we booted out the longer term supporters section because he offers no revenue.. and the cow wants all the hay for its own fat stomach"

ka-ching!

new cash deal...or.... long term member and ATS supporter....
hmmmm

CASH.....or a dedicated supporter..

aah we'll take the cash!
clearly ATS isnt about the members or you would have looked after your dedicated supporters instead of accepting "exclusivity"

exclusivity means what... to exlude others?

except robbie, since celebrity worship syndrome isnt so bad for the coffers after all.


[edit on 20/9/08 by Obliv_au]

[edit on 20/9/08 by Obliv_au]

I did not mean to stir up trouble. It was just late and I started off on one topic and ended up on another. I apologize for that. I’ll try to be brief and to the point here about what I was trying to say. I was actually trying to understand something about the Ross Incident myself as well as possibly helping other people

Hobbies
Hobbies can be terrible businesses. It is easier in the tech world to turn a hobby into a successful business than many other traditional hobbies. Model airplanes, for instance, are a terrible business to get into. People who take traditional hobbies such as country crafts, sewing, flowers, model airplanes, comic books, and leather work that attempt to start successful business based upon those hobbies have a poor success record.

The reason that I brought up hobbies though was that many people who start a business based upon a hobby usually have to alter their business plan considerably from their original ideas in order to break even with expenses or, God help them, actually make a profit from their activities. I was trying to get a response in regard to the idea that perhaps ATS has strayed from its original intent due to the needs of business and profiting. I was assuming that the Ross Incident was directly related to this idea.

Ross Incident
I was trying to state the opinion that I felt that it was Ross himself, and not ATS, that did the members of the forum a great disservice by abruptly quitting the forum altogether in the manner of a spoiled child who didn’t get his way. The members were quick to cast ATS as an uncaring corporate entity who only used Ross and his content to gain publicity and then threw him away when he was no longer needed. I don’t believe this to be the case at all and I was hoping that the site admins could better present their side of the issue.

Why I bothered to bring any of this up
I used to work as a graphic designer for a small newspaper. I was going to venture into the world of multimedia and I wanted to learn more about what members need to do in order to post more multimedia content to the site. I know that this isn’t the place to get that kind of information, but I haven’t yet found out where else to go. If I make my own conspiracy videos, sound bites, or whatnot, can I post them here? How would I go about doing so? What are the rules for multimedia content?

The fact that Ross had multimedia content that was posted on the site is what intrigued me more than his childish actions and responses. Site owners and admins have stated many times that they want ATS to be a media outlet for everyone. I think that’s great. But how do we go about providing that content in light of new corporate agreements? I don’t want to create multimedia content and feel mislead or used and dumped as people are suggesting that Ross was. I don’t think that Ross was given the shaft, but I do admit that I don’t know what the deal is as far as posting multimedia content.

Where can I go to learn more about all this?

Thank you

[edit on 20-9-2008 by Hot_Wings]

Originally posted by Crakeur

Originally posted by Amaterasu

truth is, the u2u exchange between Nomadrush and myself is quite the opposite of what he claims. His response to the automated u2u one gets from an offtopic tag was childish and rude and I responded with a single line offering to return his points since the offtopic post was then deleted by a higher up. his response was more of the same and then I explained the issue regarding his offtopic post and told him I was going to overlook the snide remarks in the previous u2u's.

Was all this before or after the "legalese" U2U he posted on his blog that informed him of a deal that precluded the continuation of the then present arrangement?

I suspect it was after... And I can assure you that from the moment that original U2U was received, all behavior was driven by pain and, though poor, as I have said, still understandable.

suspect wrong.

Well then, I would suspect Ross of having issues with maturity. Thank you for clarifying the state of things.

And given that he "nudge, nudge, wink, winked" you subsequently... I don't know what to think of his behavior but to say that his anger, though no more justified, is all the more understandable, in that stability does not appear to be his strong point based on what you have related.

Well. It's a mess for now. Let it settle.

Thanks again.

Originally posted by Obliv_au
when i fit my anti-spin doctor glasses i read it as

I would classify your input as more "cynic doctor," as it does not reflect reality, and I think you know it.

new cash deal...or.... long term member and ATS supporter....

As has been stated many times... WE were a supporter of Now That's Weird, not the other way around. WE provided free technology, free forum, free moderation, free promotion and asked nothing in return.

As has also been said, it's no secret that we have been pursuing deals in broadcast mediums for several years. Our successful culmination of that effort should come as a surprise to no one.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


SO, I would think it was abrupt, and even insulting perhaps, if I was cruising along, with no inkling, and then got a message, impersonally written at that, that said the deal was done and this was my two week notice.

If the situation was other than that, I retract my assessment, but I have been lead to believe that's exactly what happened.

Regardless, I am not here to nitpick. I have made my position and the facts I have to base that position on clear enough. I believe there were mistakes on both sides.

With this, I gracefully bow out of this thread.

Originally posted by Hot_Wings
I think that’s great. But how do we go about providing that content in light of new corporate agreements? I don’t want to create multimedia content and feel mislead or used and dumped as people are suggesting that Ross was. I don’t think that Ross was given the shaft, but I do admit that I don’t know what the deal is as far as posting multimedia content.

Where can I go to learn more about all this?

You likely missed our gala event at the Hotel Gansevort in Manhattan, last year on November 5th.

You can see the "reveal" video here: www.rememberthe5thofnovember.com... -- it played after our presentation, hosted by Richard Belzer.

And you can review the teaser videos here:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Also, some of the grand vision is available on our corporate site, here:
www.theabovenetwork.com...


The short version -->

The core idea we developed is a "user-generated content ecosystem" where a well-managed social content community (such as ATS) sits at the center, and is germinated by the ideas and postings of its members.

Various projects spring forth from the ecosystem of content, inspired by the material posted by members, and would include books, magazines, radio, television, editorial, news, etc.

All projects in all media encourage the content consumers (book buyers, TV audience, etc.) to participate in the content germination process by joining the core site (ATS) and contribute to the content ecosystem to assist in shaping future or ongoing projects.

This is what we call "A continually evolving self-feeding content ideation, creation, and publishing ecosystem."

Our first project has been ATS MIX, one of the Internet's most successful podcasts with more than 4 million unique subscribers to the RSS podcast feeds in the past year.

Our second project is the soon to be released book by the New York Times best-selling author, Jim Marrs.

Our third project is alluded to in this thread, television.

More are being developed.


The hope is to create a bottom-up media company that directly expresses the thoughts and desires of its users... and relies on on the audience to give editorial direction.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by SkepticOverlord]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

new cash deal...or.... long term member and ATS supporter....

As has been stated many times... WE were a supporter of Now That's Weird, not the other way around. WE provided free technology, free forum, free moderation, free promotion and asked nothing in return.

it was mutual, you supported him.. .he supported ATS.
aint nothin wrong with that at all, till you sell em out for the almighty greenback!

another loss, combined with JL and a few others.
oh but we got a book to buy now and RW's opinion.
fair deal.... not

[edit on 21/9/08 by Obliv_au]

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
You likely missed our gala event at the Hotel Gansevort in Manhattan, last year on November 5th.

So here's what I want to know: was this a one-off, or will there be future galas? I'll start saving for a plate now if so, because I think that would just be a blast