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The ATS Issues Thread

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posted on May, 21 2008 @ 08:57 PM
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reply to post by SkepticOverlord
 


Forget John Lear look at that picture of you with that tie on. I mean that SCREAMS CIA agent right there. You a field agent or analyst?




posted on May, 21 2008 @ 09:30 PM
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reply to post by MrdDstrbr
 


Well I would guess it could easily be used against someone in a court case. If someone would be talking about an illegal act on the site and was apprehended for it. The posts that that person made on the site could be used against them in a court of law.

A lot of people (me included) use one user name for nearly every website they frequent. This could be construed as an alias. Thus whatever that alias posted on the site would be well documented and available for the prosecution to use.

Especially if one planned on committing a crime and planed it out using a message board. The authorities could use the information that the person posted to in essence make a confession of sorts.



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 11:00 PM
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Well, I hope ATS has learnt a valuable lesson in all this drama. Never back an attention seeker.

Especially one, who can't shut up.



posted on May, 21 2008 @ 11:04 PM
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reply to post by whatukno
 


Absolutely. If emails can be used as proof in court (and they have), then obviously a post could.

This is a computer program that cops can use to extract information from cellphones, smartphones, and pretty much most other portable devices.
www.forensicfocus.com...

So these activities like instant messaging, etc. on a mobile device can be used in court just depending on what is in that information and whether or not the judge allows it.

Forum posts are popular in child custody cases from what I understand and this explains a couple of instances in which forum posts were allowed in as evidence in court (whether or not it was actually helpful is a totally different question):
forums.plentyoffish.com...

-ChriS



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 06:42 AM
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Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
For all those who doubt that "they" are monitoring ATS, just try rallying support for big-name ET Contactees and new energy technologies, see how much super-fun psychological warfare ensues


Could you please give us an example of this supposed psychological warefare?



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 06:43 AM
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The notion that ATS is CIA front is reflective of Lear ideas in general . Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof and as per usual with the people that make such claims no proof is offered what so ever . Aside from the lack of evidence there is no logic to his claim . From what was made public concerning Lear leaving ATS he strikes me as being very childish and immature. His latest bogus claims seem to reinforce this view .

One of the side effects of ATS growing popularity is that elements of the anti establishment crowd will perceive(SP?) the boards as being a part of the establishment . IMO that is why we will see more rubbish topics such as "ATS is Contelpro " and " ATS is a CIA front. "

[edit on 22-5-2008 by xpert11]



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 07:20 AM
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I'm quite saddened by all of this.

Whilst JL may be a very nice person, all I ever thought about his threads (although interesting to read) is that they were self-serving fantasy in many cases.

Frankly, I don't believe for a moment that ATS is a CIA front - or any other alphabet agency for that matter.

If CIA IS monitoring this site, I would take that as a huge compliment to the writing and theories presented by the truly awesome members who put in the time and effort to produce great material.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 10:19 AM
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John Lear's problem is not so much suppositions without facts...we see that often enough hereabouts, it's not that much of a much. It's his arrogance and digital ego.

It's about him, him, him. No one else need apply.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:14 PM
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Originally posted by whatukno
Well I would guess it could easily be used against someone in a court case. If someone would be talking about an illegal act on the site and was apprehended for it. The posts that that person made on the site could be used against them in a court of law.


"Your honor, this man posts on this site 'Above Top Secret.com', he believes in aliens and this secret Satanic cult called the 'Illuminati' - I move to have him put in a strait-jacket and locked away forever, immediately!"



In all seriousness, I highly doubt ATS posts will ever be used in a court case. Unless someone's actually stupid enough to confess to murder or something like that in a post



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by SaviorComplex
Could you please give us an example of this supposed psychological warefare?


I already have. I've had creepy dudes lurking around my family home uttering veiled threats, and I believe it had to do with my activities on here. Plus a lot of other weirdness that I don't want to discuss.

No I can't prove anything so don't ask.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by MrdDstrbr
and I believe it had to do with my activities on here.

...um...

No I can't prove anything so don't ask.

Oh really? Sorry, but if you're going to try and connect real-life dots to your ATS activities, I'm going to ask! So what makes you think the two are related?



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:33 PM
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reply to post by SkepticOverlord
 


I'm the guy who's always trying to organize investigations into Greer and Gilliland.

Greer and Gilliland are the big-name [alleged] ET Contactees.

ET Contactees fall under "Galactic Cointelpro". See the work of Michael Salla, Alfred Webre etc.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:42 PM
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reply to post by MrdDstrbr
 


That still doesn't explain why you believe your ATS activity is leading to real-life harassment.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:51 PM
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reply to post by xpert11
 


Actually i don't see it as any kind of anti-establishment concept.

It's actually quite easy to imagine. If all of these secrets we discuss and talk about really truly are government secrets then wouldn't the government have a vested interest in ensuring we don't get too much evidence to prove they are lying? Sites like this are ground zero for open discussion, presenting of evidence, discussion of that evidence, etc.. for all these different conspiracy topics (not just UFO's). If any one of these conspiracies are truly government-withheld secrets then that same governent must take measures to make sure we don't find the truth. This could include disinformation, it could also mean just that they are watching over the information here like a hawk.

If UFO's are real (and I have seen them with my own eyes) then it isn't too far of a stretch to imagine our discussions being watched closely. All of this information is freely accessible over the net so it's not like the government would even need to somehow set up inside sources within ATS. Everyone's board posts go in the board. An intelligence agent would not need to even register unless they wanted to spread disinformation on the boards.

Extraordinary claims may require extraordinary evidence but that's the point. The government would want to ensure we don't get too much evidence to completely disprove their lies if any one of these conspiracy theories involving the government is real.

-ChriS



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 04:51 PM
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reply to post by SkepticOverlord
 


You guys have the #1 site on the internet.

You are leaders, you have credibility, people look up to you and respect you and believe you.

If, say, you and Mark and Dave and Johnny were to go to the Sanctuary and have an incredible Contact experience there, and come back with copies of James' footage of Greer and CSETI vectoring in ships there..........

Well that could make big, big waves.....



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 05:06 PM
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reply to post by SkepticOverlord
 


I dont think there really is a way to know for sure that chating on ATS has a direct effect on your personal life. It really cant be proved. Lets say I am dogging on the IRS and FED like I always do then a month from now get my first audit Ive ever had is that ATS or pure coincidence? Hmmmm. If someone here can absolutely without a doubt prove it Id like to see the evidence but there really is no way to know for sure. I do know this though that suit and tie look really fishy to me though especially the stripes. Actually you know you do look like you could be in the CIA.



posted on May, 22 2008 @ 06:06 PM
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So you have people breaking every rule laid out in the Terms & Conditions of the site, then they get banned, and then they weave some sort of conspiracy-theory as to the reasons they got banned?



If the CIA made a site where even the most provocative theory is welcomed with open arms, then the CIA must be the good guys.



posted on May, 23 2008 @ 05:26 AM
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Originally posted by BlasteR
It's actually quite easy to imagine. If all of these secrets we discuss and talk about really truly are government secrets then wouldn't the government have a vested interest in ensuring we don't get too much evidence to prove they are lying?


None of which excuses a lack of rational thinking or logic . Even when government put documents under lock and key for a long period of time there is often claims of a conspiracy that have some credence because of rational thinking and alleged evidence. For example I have book somewhere entitled the Murder of Rudolf Hess by Hugo Thomas(SP?) . Now aside from the fact there is only author word to go on the case he presents is based on medical evidence and logic . Of course having more then one source for a claim is preferable .

I haven't seen such solid evidence from Lear when it came to his ideas.




If any one of these conspiracies are truly government-withheld secrets then that same governent must take measures to make sure we don't find the truth.


My experience on ATS points to the fact that some people look to fit a conspiracy into a situation rather then examine each topic on a case by case basis. People sometimes read to much into a situation or read something that isnt there .



posted on May, 23 2008 @ 05:36 AM
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reply to post by xpert11
 



My experience on ATS points to the fact that some people look to fit a conspiracy into a situation...


I read this and it struck me as such a profound statement, I felt the need to quote it.
A simple observation, yet put to words can be like a smack in the forehead.
I wish many members would consider this, when reading some outrageous claims in any given forum.

Your statement would make a killer signature.
My 2 pennies.



posted on May, 23 2008 @ 06:48 AM
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reply to post by MrdDstrbr
 


Hmm lemme think, what kind of activities discussed on this site if say a person would actually do them would get them arrested? And after the arrest would the government be able to go back and find a record for the plan already posted? Gee I wonder?

How about those ridiculous threads that pop up about breaking into a secured military instillation? Area 51?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

What if someone that actually thought this was a good idea would actually try this nonsense? If perhaps they came to this site and posted in any of the myriad of threads like the above, wouldnt their posts be like a confession of sorts? Thus proving malice of forethought and premeditation?

If someone were to do the plans outlined above this would of course be at least a felony trespass charge. If not a breach of national security. In some of these threads people have even gone as far as to suggest murder as an alternative proposed method for infiltration. Actually talking about killing the guards of the installation in order to get inside and look around. Yes these are completely ridiculous claims and I seriously doubt anyone would be dumb enough to try it. But what would happen if someone who posted their plan were to try it out? At the least they would be arrested. At worst they would be killed, and certainly if the person posted on this forum about it it could get found out during the investigation of that person's hard drive and plainly show premeditation.



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