NEEDED: everyones theories, beliefs, facts on the bible...post here

Hi. I'm glad to see that you're seeking answers. We are called to stand firm in our faith, not to cling to it in weakness. By testing your faith, you will find Christ's Word proved genuine, and your faith will become unshakable.

I should stress above everything else, that prayer is important. If you pray to Christ Jesus and ask Him to reveal His Truth to you, it will be done. Pray to God honestly, tell Him your struggles and doubts, and then commit yourself to reading His Word. See where it takes you.

Christ Jesus died on the cross so that your sins could be forgiven. He endured the wrath that our sins deserved. By His sacrifice we can become Children of God. He calls us friends and sons.

All you have to do is say 'yes' to it.

If you seek with an open heart you will find Christ. There is no other way, and there is no mistaking Him. Seek and you'll find.

I'll pray for you.

My view of the bible is it is a book written by man and claimed to be the word of Yahweh.

It is filled with contradictions and loop holes and depicts a very vengeful, hateful, jealous deity in the Old Testaments.

It makes women out to be the cause of the fall of man, to be unclean and incapable of learning as men do. Women were told to be silent and subserviant and were not allowed to ask questions in the temples.

It states that to kill is a sin, yet the Old Testament is filled with stories of Yahweh sending out the Israelites to slaughter entire nations so they could have the Promised Land.

The New Testament seems to be lost in much of the preachings of the christian religion, at least in the fact that Jesus' message seems to have gotten lost somewhere.

I seriously doubt many can name what the one commandment Jesus gave in the New Testament, and that is a sad thing for it is the most important one of all.

The followers of christianity, not all but a good portion, are quick to judge and condemn, they believe they are better than everyone else, they are hypocritical and they fail to see that they do not live the life that Jesus tried to teach.

The fact is, the bible was put together by the Council of Nicea and not all of the gospels were included. Why not? Shouldn't all of them been put in the bible? Why were some considered important and others weren't? Like the Gospel of Mary Magdalene. Or the Gospel of Judas.

How do you explain that these gospels were written years after Jesus' death?

And then of course, there is the fact that there is no historical evidence to even prove that Jesus truly lived. How about the fact that the bible has been translated so many times that there are now errors in the meanings of words and it does not state what it originally stated?

I think, in all honesty, the bible is a book that holds some good messages (especially in the NT) but all in all, it is a book of fiction. It should not been taken as literal and it definately should not be considered divine.

to love our Dad with all our heart & soul & mind, & to love our neighbour as we love our self....many have trouble loving themself because of how lost they are, because of the way they behave/act...our Dad, the Creator of all has the last 'perfect' say, whether 'we' agree with it or not...the Creator has no limitations, He had a personal relationship with many native people well before His Holy collection of books came on the scene...it was never meant to be turned into a religion, that was lucifers doing to keep people from reaching their full potential...(U will do even 'greater' things than I)...most calling themselves Christains do not ('follow me') Jesus examples...there is much Hypocrisy & very little faith/Belief...the Creator can & does use the books in the Bible to 'speak' to us...if our eyes have been opened by the helper(Holy Spirit)...it is ALL useful & helpful in getting to know our DAD...what went down Before, what is going down Now, & what is Next...if u try & understand those 'selected' books without the helper, u will be 'put off' just as this 'i' was in the past...a very good Concordance will also be helpful...many times in history we see where Father has allowed others to destroy others...this continues to this day...this is to do with FREE WILL & the fact that the temporary ruler of this world (Lucifer) is still doing his best to deceive & suck in as many as he can...it really is up to US to decide who's side we're on...SELF or Fathers...if the Perfect one decides to allow 'evil' to be taken out of the picture it will be done...He has done it before & will again...any attempt of painting Father in bad light is of the evil one, the great deceiver...he wants to turn people away from our wonderful Dad & His Love...from a Holy relationship with Him...in a Spiritual understanding, there is no death...just another road...Jesus Love on two legs is the best example of what our Father stands for...He didn't descriminate against woman...& neither does Father...our ancestors Eve & Adam both got sucked in by the evil one...not much has changed...REAL love has to be by FREE WILL....we have been given it....how many are loving Him back?.....GB

For my thoughts on the Bible and other religions, see the info attached at the end of this post.

I've just finished reading a great book by John Spong called "The Sins of Scripture" and he goes into details as to where those horrible texts originally came from eg. kill anyone who isn't a christian, hate homosexuals, women are idiots etc.

Basically women are oppressed because they think that God made women out of Adam, so she's there to accompany the man and he is the master over her. Plus, as far as survival goes, women are physically weaker than men and thus, no good for hunting and bringing food in for the ancient tribe.

Homosexuality is said to be punishable by death because when the Jews were in exile, they wandered into other cultures where homosexuality was common place and the Jews wanted to define themselves by not taking part in their culture....so homosexuality was written down as being bad - as was eating non kosher food (they didn't want to eat meals with the other tribes either). THis was written down in Leviticus, which was just a list of Jewish rules that were eventually taken into the Bible, and thus, people thought that God hated homosexuals etc.

Sex is seen as bad because God said to 'go forth and muliply' so if you have sex for pleasure you're not doing what God said to do. Plus people thought that anything of the flesh was bad because we should all be working toward bettering our spirits.

MY THOUGHTS ON THE BIBLE:

“God” is an alien?
Anyone heard of the ancient astronaut theory - that our humanity has been visited since our beginnings by advanced people from the sky?
Have you seen the ancient cave paintings of the Australian Aboriginies, the Mayans and other tribes? Many of them show UFO looking objects and people with what look like space suits around their bodies.
Have you ever read the Bible...especially Jacob's account of a "ladder to heaven" and Ezekiel's descriptions of 'flying circles'? Could these be UFOs?
I'm a member of the Raelian Movement and the founder of the movement, a man named Rael, was contacted by an extra-terrestrial named Yahweh on 13th December 1973. During this encounter he was dictated a series of messages, which he wrote down and later published in the form of 3 books.

In summary, these messages explain that scientists from another planet originally created all life on Earth using DNA. These human beings were known in the Hebrew Bible as ELOHIM, but were mistaken for gods by our ancestors. The word ELOHIM does not mean “God”, but is a plural word meaning, “those who came from the sky”. It is to these people that Moses, Jesus, Buddha, Mohammed, Krishna, Joseph Smith and many many other prophets referred to.

Now that humanity has the scientific knowledge to understand this, the Elohim have asked for these important messages to be communicated to the world, and for an embassy to be built, so they can return to Earth as predicted by all the major religions.

For more info go to www.rael.org where you can get a free download of “Intelligent Design – Message from the Designers”.

anything that 'dethones' Father is of the evil one....the Creator is the supreme SPIRIT, not an ET scientist...there are et's who denigh Father & think of themselves as gOD...there is no shortage of et's in CREATION...the ones mentioned in the OT were Giants who treated humans as sex slaves & worse...they were destroyed in the flood...more may very well be coming in future...personnally i wouldn't trust them as far as i could throw them...there may very well have been et manipulation of humans in past & present....however there are good et people as well......GB

[edit on 9-12-2007 by dave7]

my views.

the bible is not the bible. its been rewriten to suit needs of leading religious leaders. their was a big meeting, forgot what its called the court of something, were the different "leaders" of the different branches of christianity decided what would be in the bible. some bits taken out some added some altered. and it has been rewrote a fair few times since. a good arguement is that in the da vinci code ( i know i know it had to be mentioned ). plus think about it. if jesus (who was actually called joshua) was just like an everyday man. what good is that to the church?

jesus (joshua) was an alien. think about it. imaculate conception? (oh i have a point on that too, but will get to later), the "star" above the barn, poss alien craft? i mean what would a more primative mind think it was? paranormal abilities, resurection from the dead and then tpo be taken to heaven in " a beam of light". we're taling about people who were primative in their way of thiking. like the egyptians. gods this gods that. maybe their gods were aliens. all around this time (biblical time) there are mass stories of things to do with god and how people could do certain things. what if they were aliens OR had been in league with? and then poof they all gone and the bible is like the remnants of the stories from old. and the hope of the "2nd coming". will they return?

imacluate conception. right i feel that when all this was trans lated and thought up they got it wrong. first off when it was originally wrote or at that counsil thing you make jesus (joushua) sounds special from the start. he was imaculately concieved. ok now mary she was a virgin againmake it sound special. my view is this she wasn't a "virgin" she was a "young woman". they got it wrong when they were translating it OR they swapped it to sound special.

another point. jesus (joshua) born 25th dec. well thats not right as this time is a pagan festival and they cahnged it so the thing could go on under a new guise. BUT AGAIN another pointer to people changing things around. nothing is true. but i go on. now the shepards aperently came with lambs. when are lambs born? spring! the 3 wise men/kings they get their on turbo charged camels? no it would have taken months to get to the shack it all happened in. so then were they tracking ufos (going off on a slight tangent. there is a lot of references in art throughout history depicting "ufos" could this be observations of what we will know think f alien craft?)

but the good book aint the good book. its been changed a number of times.

much love

reply to post by time4chg07


Well, I hope you know what a can of worms you've opened here. In my experience here at ATS, you're likely to become the target of many weird christian fundimentalist types. Good luck - yer gonna need it

The OT is in the Bible for one simple reason really - the whole New Testament would colapse without it The early 'christians' were a jewish spinter group who relied on Jews for membership. They simply could not 'Do Away' with the OT - they'd would have cut their own fiscal throats by doing so. For hundreds of years, christians were sort of viewed as 'second-class' Jews by most cultures. It wasn't until the Constantine Synod that christianity even became respectable really...

J.

reply to post by ValhallasValkyrie


Very well said. I think you've pretty well nailed it there. Congrats!

Keep youtr head down now for the flak though, huh?

J.

Originally posted by darktim
the bible is not the bible. its been rewriten to suit needs of leading religious leaders....some bits taken out some added some altered...

The church fathers said which books stay and which books go but for very good reason. Many impostors were claiming various texts were written by the apostles and proclaiming false doctrine. Fortunately, many forgeries were caught by the early church fathers and even the apostles themselves who exposed the imposters.

Many of the early church fathers were understudies of the original apostles and openly declared the false works in their writings while verifying the true works. It's not like the council arbitrarily picked books at random that they thought fit. They painstakingly reviewed the records from the original church records during this process.

exactly my point. how can it be known which "false" peices are still in there?

reply to post by darktim


Exactly what I said: by going by the early eye witnesses, authors, and the apostle's testimonies. The New Testament authors even mention psuedographical forgeries being passed around, warn the reader to not pay attention to them, and that the manuscripts were not coming from the apostles but from impostors.

We have eye witnesses and the original authors of the New Testament that tell us exactly what are authentic works and what are not. It's not rocket science. As soon as the Gnostics tried squeezing their works into the New Testament writings, they were immediately exposed as forgeries and impostors.

[edit on 12/31/2007 by AshleyD]

Originally posted by darktim
the "star" above the barn, poss alien craft? i mean what would a more primative mind think it was?

The explanation isn't nearly as exciting or sci-fi. Daniel (the prophet who set up the Persian order which would later become the NT Magi) prophesied to the year the life and Death of the Messiah. History shows this prophecy was fulfilled to the letter just as Daniel said it would be. Because Daniel knew the time frame of the Messiah's life, he gave this Persian order gifts from his own possessions along with instructions to be passed down in the generations so that his gifts could be given to the future Messiah.

In Numbers, we are possibly told a sign in the stars would accompany the Messiah's birth. Scientists have been able, through the use of computers, to replicate the night sky around this period. They discovered that a union of Venus and Jupiter formed a "bright star" in the sky. The Persian order set up by Daniel already knew what to look for in both the time frame and the celestial sign. According to the Messianic prophecies that states the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem, they also knew the location. So with the timing, location, and celestial sign of the Messiah, they had all the information they needed for their journey.

No aliens. No astrology. Just a prophet thinking ahead and passing on the information to others.

The Bible is a basic guide to get us from point A to point B in terms of salvation. But when you study it, and I mean really study it, you will get those "Whoa!" moments. Instead of passing it off as just "a book written by men to control the masses," dig a little deeper. The undesigned coincidences are amazing.

[edit on 12/31/2007 by AshleyD]

I watched the Passion of the Christ at the movie theater, when it came out. It bothered me to watch it because it showed Caiaphas plotting to kill Jesus, but it never explains why they found Him to be such a threat to them. Also, why would Pilot go along with their plan? I think the explaination is pretty simple. Caiaphas was not just one person, but a dynisty. They had no lagitamite claim to the High Priesthood but basicly bought the right for it because of their wealth and power. When Pilot came to Judea, he felt that they(Caiaphas) had to much power and wanted to deminish it somewhat. He consulted with the authorities on religeon and found out that there was a lagitamit person to become High Priest, instead of Caiaphis. The Romans had the power to decide who could be High Priest because they held the vestments in the tower at the Temple. So they had a new High Priest. That lasted one year, untill the Caiaphas group were able to use politics to get their honor back of holding that position in their family. Legaly, the High Priest is appointed for life. Jesus was able to actualy perform his duty on Yom Kippur because he could inter into the pressence of God, in the most Holy Place of the Temple that law requires the High Peiest to inter once a year. Caiaphas would not even attempt that, for fear of being struck down dead for dareing to go in where they had no right. So Jesus was established at that point as the King of the Jews. He had to go into total obscurity to keep from being killed by his jealous rivals in Jerusalem. So he went into the wilderness and eventualy ran into his cousin. John recognized Jesus as being the restoration of Man's intercessor to God. Jesus dropped his Priestly name, Simion, and used his ordinary name, Jesus, to hide the fact that he was the Messiah. He found Simon, his deciple, and named him Peter. He went about his buisness of restoring the religion of his people. Before he was killed he took his place where he belonged and taught in the Temple. It turned out to be his undoing but it was the work of God. Pilot had to go along with Caiaphas (to kill Jesus) because it could be claimed that it was his (Pilot's) fault that this person Jesus claimed to be the king of the Jews and was able to do so because of the doing of Pilot. Jesus placed his faith in God to the very end, and as in the movie, The Passion, he came back to life and returned to his followers and gained the respect of the people of the City. He was the most respected person in Jerusalem, but he was somewhat elusive. The men in white on the mountain said fear not for in the same way you saw him leave he will return. The new testament dropps him out of the story but ony leaves a hint that the beleavers could see him when they were initiated into the faith. He reapears in history at the fall and destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans. He comes to the Highest part of the city walls and tells the people that if they try to fight the Romans they will all be killed. The evil people in the city decide to go against his advice and they kill the people in the city who want to let the Romans in. From that point forward God forsakes the city and the Gospel goes to the Gentiles. I consider myself a gentile and that salvation is given to our race and we accept the heretical teachings of Paul. Paul went to heaven and talked to and was given direct instructions from Jesus. Basicly we are to not try to be like the man who lived on earth as Jesus, but to look to the Christ who is with God in Heaven and continues his ministry in the Heavenly Temple as our High Priest. He is there for our Day of Judgement and pleeds our case with his own blood. To look back down on this earth for a rebuilt temple and a new messiah is only the work of the Devil and the Beast and that man of sin and the Antichrist.

alot of the idealogy and symbology in chrstianity has been around a lot longer then 2000 yrs. alot of it was taken from pagan beliefs. one time people believed in many gods and then mon faith came out of ancient iran via the zorostian faith. its all recycled always has been people add and take to religion. what is religion? a way of undsterstanding life and to help cushion the blow of death. it moves through trends. it may take a few hundred years or a couple thousand years be faiths and religions always change and follow trends.

but re the bible people get all defensive about tit when talkin about it that it is the word of god and its perfect. it aint and that point will always be raised, unfortunately, that its been re wrote many times to fit in with what the religious leaders of the time wnated it to say. again bits have been changed, added and removed. weres mary the wife of christ? apperently in the earliest versions she was his equal now she is a whore who he took pity on. were is jesus the young years? on minute he's a boy the next he's a man in his mid 30s. weres the other stuff? maybe taken away in order to have him perseved in a certain light? what if he had a wife and kids. apperently again in an earlier version he did, so were has that gone now? see what i mean. it aint the world from above its a collection of stories based on people who are meant to instill moral values in people. few enough ill hold my hand up and say there is no smoke without fire. every story some were has truth at its base. but to have this idea that the bible, which is whatwe're talking about here, is the perfect thing that is right and just and perfect is nonsence. unfortunately people change things to the way they want them.

classic example here ok. christianity has numerous branches. each saying that they are the true way. they read the same book about the same things but their view on the subject is supposedly THE one. how can that be? each one will say you need to do this and to do that in order to worship god properly, you should read this and that from the bible. but wait a sec aint it the same book that they're all carrying? surely their cant be more then one version of the bible knocking around. can there?

Originally posted by AshleyD


The Bible is a basic guide to get us from point A to point B in terms of salvation. But when you study it, and I mean really study it, you will get those "Whoa!" moments. Instead of passing it off as just "a book written by men to control the masses," dig a little deeper. The undesigned coincidences are amazing.

[edit on 12/31/2007 by AshleyD]

can u name some of these "undesigned coincidences?"

Simple questions the Bible does not answer. What came before 'God'? How did 'God' come to be? Why are we made in 'Gods' image? How did 6 billion people stem from only 2? Why would a small baby who has not been baptised that dies because of some deisease go to "hell?" Why does the "holy land" belong to the Jews (which in itself is a paradox)? Why are Jews the chosen ones? These are ridiculous claims that can not be answered by the Pope himself. And actually the Catholic Church addressed my second question saying (not in these exact words) "Babies don't go to hell, but now go to limbo" or something along those lines. I don't remember the exact quote. But basically they retracted the need for baptism by babies to go to heaven. The Bible does not have the answers. Only the answers that ancient POLYtheistic and eventually monotheistic man tried to explain. And who knows what was going on 6,000 years ago during the Epic of Gilgamesh or "Noah's Arc." I can tell you that not a soul on this earth knows what exactly went on during those times. There are far too many contradictions and inaccuracies to know.

That means the "star of David" in the plagiarized story of the birth of Jesus could have easily been a UFO (not that that's what i believe). Im sorry but your explanation by scientist is absolutely irrelevant, even if it is true.

So man turns to religion which in turn gives comfort to the unknown. By giving stories to believe in and people to look up to and be like, the bible does an excellent job giving that warm, fuzzy feeling inside. I challenge anyone to read the Quran or the buddhist texts and not get those same feelings. I also was a believer of the Christian 'God' growing up and also bought in to the easy stories that the Bible gives its answers through. The only thing I have done to come to some of my conclusions is use a little logic and objective thinking (and I don't know much at all to be honest. My education is very, very limited, but I do look at things objectively and try to learn as much as possible).

Anyway, people who choose Christianity or any other religion for that matter usually do so without thinking of the whole picture. They use their Bible as reference for all the answers, the urge to want to believe in something greater than them, a power that will protect and give them moral guidance and the testimonies of people close to them to determine their decisions.

Instead, try looking inside and finding who you are as a person and not need a guideline to do so or a "way" to "salvation."
People need to come to the realization that the Bible or any other book is not going to give them all the answers (like where we came from, or what happens after we die) and it is ok not to know. I am sure you will see religion fails in comparison to the light of the innerself. And believe me if there were evidence of the Bible to be true and not require faith alone (as it states) there would be no other religion. Unfortunately, to the contrary of some peoples claims there really is none. That is why there are 6 billion people on this earth and not even 1/3rd of them agree on the same God. Sure is intersting.

reply to post by darktim


Here are a couple of entries in encyclopedias for the person who a lot of Bible scolars believe was an influince on Jesus. I believe a good as any explaination to where Jesus was during the missing years would be that he was buissy learnig in a Rabbinical school. He was called Rabbi in the Gospels and I think they did for good reason.
hilel], known as Hillel Hazaken (the Elder), or Hillel Hababli (‘the Babylonian’) (1st-c BC–1st-c AD) One of the most respected Jewish teachers of his time, probably born in Babylonia. He immigrated to Palestine at about age 40. He founded a school of followers bearing his name, which was frequently in debate with (and often presented more tolerant attitudes than) the contemporary followers of Shammai. Noted for his use of seven rules in expounding Scripture, his views were influential for later rabbinic Judaism.
Hillel, fl. c.30 B.C.-A.D. 10, Jewish scholar, regarded as the forebear of the later patriarchs who led the Jews of Palestine until c.A.D. 400. The Jerusalem Talmud calls him the president of the Sanhedrin. He and Shammai formed the most important of the rabbinic zuggot (oppositional pairs), with Hillel usually taking a more liberal stance in the interpretation of scripture. He was the great spiritual and ethical leader of his generation. His most famous maxim is "Do not unto others that which is hateful unto thee."



[edit on 2-1-2008 by jmdewey60]

Originally posted by abelievingskeptic
can u name some of these "undesigned coincidences?"

It would take quite a bit of time that I don't have to go over it all but here is a brief example and my favorite: We know the Bible was written by dozens of men over a span of centuries. Numbers are used repeatedly in the Bible and have underlying spiritual significance. Even though I can see how one author could have been smart enough to have written the Bible using this system, I have a hard time believing they all purposely did this- especially while having the numbers represent the same spiritual meanings.

Also the symbolism of the Old Testament laws, temple rituals, and feasts compared to New Testament symbolism with Jesus’ life, death, and resurrection. The foreshadowed symbolism is amazing compounded by the fact of multiple authors and centuries.

What came before 'God'?

Absolutely nothing. I know it hurts the human brain to think about it but He always existed. Out of curiosity, how do you think the universe, earth, and life came into being? Something had to exist to get us all here. What are the three main beliefs about our origins? A supreme being, aliens, and the theory of evolution.

Evolution makes too many false conclusions and someone had to create the aliens. This leaves an infinite being beyond our comprehension that would have the ability to create matter out of nothing and also explains the intricate design and order of the universe and and the miracle of life. If you want to know why I think this is an impossibility for everything to "just happen," read my signature. And even the junkyard would have at least supplied the original matter and not even the tornado could have given the aircraft intelligent life.

Why are we made in 'Gods' image?

Because we were the pinnacle of His creation designed for fellowship with Him. Even the angels were to fulfill "servant" roles why humans were for fellowship.

How did 6 billion people stem from only 2?

Six billion people stemming from two is a lot easier to believe that six billion people stemming from inorganic matter floating around the universe. But don't forget it was actually more than two. All people alive today are believed to be descendants of Noah and his descendants (eight people total).

Why would a small baby who has not been baptised that dies because of some deisease go to "hell?"

This is completely unscriptual and is false Catholic dogma. I can think of two specific examples off the top of my head that explicitly state children who die before the age of accountability go to Heaven. One is David's son and the other is Paul alluding to "default childhood salvation." So we have at least one example refuting their false doctrine from each testament.

Why does the "holy land" belong to the Jews (which in itself is a paradox)?

First of all, why is this a paradox? Second, this goes back to a promise God made to Abraham and his descendants. It shows God looking upon the earth and seeing sinful men but Abraham and his people caught His eye as one of the only communities still faithful to God. Because of this, God blessed the Jews with the land of Israel (and the Bible gives us clues as to why the land is sacred and set apart).

Why are Jews the chosen ones?

Because God made a covenant with Abraham and He never breaks covenant. But it is not that they get special treatment. They are actually in a judgement period currently called "the age of the Gentiles." But this is coming to a close precisely as God promised in the prophecies concerning the return of Jews to Israel as a sovereign united state and Jerusalem in the end times.

These are ridiculous claims that can not be answered by the Pope himself.

Just for the record, I'm not Catholic and have very serious issues with their structure, doctrine, and perversion of God's Word.

And actually the Catholic Church addressed my second question saying (not in these exact words) "Babies don't go to hell, but now go to limbo" or something along those lines. I don't remember the exact quote.

You're referring to purgatory- another concept I don't agree with as it is unscriptual.

POLYtheistic and eventually monotheistic man tried to explain.

I actually have a sneaking hunch that all religions started out as monotheistic. Being that if we all are truly descended from Adam, who knew the one true God, then we all started out as monotheistic and later strayed by adding in other gods into our beliefs.

And who knows what was going on 6,000 years ago during the Epic of Gilgamesh or "Noah's Arc."

Again, to me this points to a common origin as taught by the Bible. Although critics like to use the Epic of Gilgamesh to cast doubt on the Genesis account, the existence of flood stories are told in almost all cultures all over the globe. To me it sounds like the truth later became distorted again.

I can tell you that not a soul on this earth knows what exactly went on during those times.

Exactly. None of us were there. So, I take the Genesis account by faith because the Bible has uncanny accuracy in other things that were later proven correct through science and archeology. Then there is the field of study known as flood geology but it is controversial and I don't have enough knowledge of it to be honest!

That means the "star of David" in the plagiarized story of the birth of Jesus could have easily been a UFO (not that that's what i believe). Im sorry but your explanation by scientist is absolutely irrelevant, even if it is true.

1) It was not plagiarized.
2) I think you're referring to the Star of Bethlehem.

and I don't know much at all to be honest. My education is very, very limited, but I do look at things objectively and try to learn as much as possible).

That's the only way to do it. We can't enter this subject with presupposed ideas. It only works when you weigh the evidence collectively.

[edit on 1/2/2008 by AshleyD]

Speaking from the point of, As it is written.

And figuring that nearly all of the church doctrines today, differ, from, AS it is written.

It is not much of a surprise to hear some are lacking faith.

When Jesus was walking on water, only one Apostle had the Faith to join him, on the water, but when Peter started to sink, Jesus pulled him up. And the first thing JESUS said, to Peter, was, Why did you doubt?

See > Matthew 14:30-31

That is the nut shell, for those who struggle these days.

The cure is to listen to a extremist preacher, just like all the Prophets were, and JESUS himself was ! Did you know that all the real truth preachers of old were hated and killed by the main stream of the day, that the prophet lived in.

This is the prophet of these days, I like, and i have tested him long, and well, and he is the real deal, and he doesn't even know he is a prophet. Link here www.scripturesforamerica.org...

And yes, everybody on the web lies about him, as, one might expect !
He's not a racist any more than GOD Almighty is.


The Anti-Christ truth here
www.scripturesforamerica.org...
This is News Letter volume 9, if the link fails.

All the above, is what i know is hard, for most, but i ask that you test it, diligently.

reply to post by h2oatom


Your post should be, in a nutshell, I am a happy Cult member.
The thread has a subject. It is asking what your belief is. You do not state a belief, other than you should follow your particular Cult leader. Kind of weak, in my opinion. Why do you not spell out what you believe, instead of pointing to some one who has some un-understandable religious sounding reteric. Thy to break it down to something that makes sense, instead of a lot of talking in circles.

[edit on 5-1-2008 by jmdewey60]

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
maybe the guy is trying to utilize a 'reverse psychology' tactic, but if that's the case he's in deep trouble if he actually ends up doing time with anyone who's taken him seriously...as for what the op wanted to know, here's a fact common to every translation of the good book...ready...they're all copywrited...what can be deduced from that fact? respectfully, mike