On to something huge here! (UFO HOAX)

Those are aircraft lights. After watching the videos and reading Defcon's posts, I have to agree. Defcon has made his statements with sufficient proof...Where as these videos don't show much other than the things he has been explaining.

Aircraft lights. Nothing special.

Originally posted by MiahX

Originally posted by Frozenthought

Originally posted by MiahX
Frozen, none of us are calling you a hoaxer or saying that you don't have good intentions, you very well may be on to something huge as your title says! But don't be negative about wanting to scrutinize the facts to be sure.

The only thing that is not being discussed is what this thread was about in the 1st place, That these same exact objects have been filmed and wittnessed over Lake Ontario as well.

You're right, they have been filmed! But what are they? I believe that ET's exist too, but is that what these are?

Let's work together to find out! Will you work with us?

Have fun with it!

[edit on 9-2-2007 by MiahX]

I am starting my quest for truth by reading everything at WWW.Orbwatch.com because these folks are the only group I have come across that seem to have these same exact objects on film, with some scientists that have already looked into there footage. That sounds like a great place to start to figure out what these objects are.

How about we talk about what we find at that site?

For all of you who says these lights are simply from planes.....don't planes have beacons?? Flashing lights?

I live by 2 airports, and I see planes flying in and out from 1/2 mile to maybe 5 miles away on my drive home all the time, and they all have flashing lights to visually indicate their presence in the air.

Michael's footage, does not show any flashing lights. I see two "orbs" on each craft that "pulsates" and flickers, but no intermittently light.

Hey FrozenThought everyone appreciates you posting your video and responding to all the questions.

Its give us all something interesting to look at & talk about , thanks dude

Doesn't every airplane have to have blinking light's?

And different planes have different patterns so they can be identified?

Any pilot's here want to confirm that?

Originally posted by Frozenthought

I am starting my quest for truth by reading everything at WWW.Orbwatch.com because these folks are the only group I have come across that seem to have these same exact objects on film, with some scientists that have already looked into there footage. That sounds like a great place to start to figure out what these objects are.

How about we talk about what we find at that site?

I agree that I have never seen planes that low to the water and moving like they were, I am very interested to find out what they are! If I lived closer I would go hang out and look for them with ya!

Do you have any more videos you could provide with one of these orbs up closer?

Also, did you file a police report for the assault on you? If so, any chance you will make it public? That would sure prove someone was out to get you!

Originally posted by MachXX
For all of you who says these lights are simply from planes.....don't planes have beacons?? Flashing lights?

I live by 2 airports, and I see planes flying in and out from 1/2 mile to maybe 5 miles away on my drive home all the time, and they all have flashing lights to visually indicate their presence in the air.

Michael's footage, does not show any flashing lights. I see two "orbs" on each craft that "pulsates" and flickers, but no intermittently light.

Read back a few pages, this was addressed. There are certain types of planes, that have such strong landing lights, that they brightness "drowns" out any navigation lights that are on the plane.

Somone here, I forget who, forgive me, posted pics, etc to show this to be the case.

Originally posted by yeti101
Hey FrozenThought everyone appreciates you posting your video and responding to all the questions.

Its give us all something interesting to look at & talk about , thanks dude

Thank You, Peace! I'm trying to do whatever i can :-)

I have never seen a plane that had lights like that. I have been to many mets games and if you have ever been to shea stadium the air traffic is heavy. With JFK and La guardia airports nearby, planes landing left and right.
Planes do have alot of lights, usually 2 or 3 very bright white lights when landing (solid like a headlight) and some small blinking lights. Nothing like which was shown in that video. I am only speaking of the commercial air traffic which I have seen throughout my life. I am not familiar with military airplanes when it comes to landing, only in flight. (binoculars are great) So I can't rule them out, however I don't see any reason for a military plane to blink that way. Or any plane for that matter. That stuff was wierd whatever it was.

Originally posted by sensfan

Originally posted by MachXX
For all of you who says these lights are simply from planes.....don't planes have beacons?? Flashing lights?

I live by 2 airports, and I see planes flying in and out from 1/2 mile to maybe 5 miles away on my drive home all the time, and they all have flashing lights to visually indicate their presence in the air.

Michael's footage, does not show any flashing lights. I see two "orbs" on each craft that "pulsates" and flickers, but no intermittently light.

Read back a few pages, this was addressed. There are certain types of planes, that have such strong landing lights, that they brightness "drowns" out any navigation lights that are on the plane.

Somone here, I forget who, forgive me, posted pics, etc to show this to be the case.

Yes, planes have very strong "head-on" lights (which shine in the direction of flight) to literally light up the flight path or the actual runway when they touchdown. But you'll notice that we supposedly see all angles of these planes as they make their turns, which would explain the objects going left to right and vice versa (after being stationary). If this is the case, and we are seeing them at an angle, the lights would not be directed right at the camera, but towards the sides. At this angle of flight, the very bright "head-on" lights would then not "drown out" the flashing beacons.....yet we do not see them.

Defensiveness only has meaning when something is being defended.

I'm glad that sensfan sees where my line of reasoning is going...

MLH, we've been trying to corroborate and verify aspects of your sighting, all in the process of trying to determine the actual contents of that video.

Holding back the info that you are a co-producer of a film which RELIES on this footage NOT being planes, is very telling, indeed.

You state that you want to do something good for the UFO community - as a part of that community, I'll tell you this - objective, verifiable, and independently analyzed evidence is the ONLY USEFUL stuff we seek. You keep stating that we can BELIEVE whatever we want - here's the rub: I do not want to BELIEVE a damn thing, UNDERSTANDING is the only useful mechanism here. Anyone can believe anything, especially if there's commercial motivation for that belief.

You stand to gain from the sale of Sereda's DVD, so your objectivity in being the source of the footage is obviously questionable. Regardless, assuming you had genuine footage, you are entitled to make money from it - as long as you take the proper steps in trying to verify and validate the nature of that footage. We are attempting to keep you on track with that endeavor.

Believe what you want, you only have two choices Fear or LOVE choose wisely.

That statement is ridiculously simplistic - it reminds me of a scene from Donnie Darko. To try and boil down our skeptical approach to this footage by invoking this childish philosophy is really on the edge of being insulting. The nature of reality, and especially the nuances of objectively analyzing footage like yours, involves curiosity, inquisitiveness, a sense of clarity and an understanding of subtlety. The fact that you have invoked belief and passion says something about your own agenda with this footage - are you going to accuse me of being a debunker and NSA guy, the way that Sereda did when I posed some probing questions about this footage?

When more than a few people state that they feel that these are perhaps NOT ufos, folks who say that they have seen very similar lights above Lake Erie, it's entirely reasonable to dig down and ask some tough questions. Did you think this would not happen? Did you think that this footage would be accepted at face value? Yes, you might indeed have footage of actual UFOs, or maybe you don't, but want to believe that you do. What does this have to do with determining the truth? I would suggest you realize that the UFO community has been burned sixteen ways to Sunday, and fights every day for legitimacy in the eyes of the mainstream. The last thing we need is some footage which is called genuine, which can subsequently be proven to be IFOs. This hurts the community, and we know it, so pardon us if we don't don rose-colored glasses and choose LOVE over REASON.

dB

[edit on 9-2-2007 by davidbiedny]

Originally posted by Frozenthought
Doesn't every airplane have to have blinking light's?

And different planes have different patterns so they can be identified?

Any pilot's here want to confirm that?

I can't think of a more qualified person to look at this than John Lear. He has seen more planes than anyone.

Here is some info on Navigation Lights from Wikipedia:

Navigation lights in civil aviation are required to be operational and to be turned on from sunset to sunrise. High-intensity white strobe lights are part of the anti-collision light system, as well as the aviation red or white rotating beacon. The anti collision light system (either strobe lights or rotating beacon) is required to be operational and to be turned on for all airplanes built after March 11th 1996 on all aircraft operations.

Info on Navigation Lights

Originally posted by MachXX
For all of you who says these lights are simply from planes.....don't planes have beacons?? Flashing lights?

I live by 2 airports, and I see planes flying in and out from 1/2 mile to maybe 5 miles away on my drive home all the time, and they all have flashing lights to visually indicate their presence in the air.

Michael's footage, does not show any flashing lights. I see two "orbs" on each craft that "pulsates" and flickers, but no intermittently light.

I live near an airport and at the right angle ie head on, you can't see the blinking lights because or the brightness of the front beams. I mistook these for ufos before and was amazed at them 'hovering' in the sky for ages, until they changed direction and it was clear to see the blinking light. I was pretty dissapointed, but it taught me alot about the importance of perspective.

By the way I beleive in UFOs aliens etc and have witnessed some very credible sightings myself, so I'm not on a debunking mission or anything.

Thanks again Frozenthought for sharing this with us, as I believe any discussion is good, regardless of my opinion (which is changeable). I was very impressed at first I'll admit, but think we need corroborating evidence from maybe a third party somehow to prove/disprove the plane theory.

Originally posted by MiahX
Do you have any more videos you could provide with one of these orbs up closer?

Also, did you file a police report for the assault on you? If so, any chance you will make it public? That would sure prove someone was out to get you!

I didn't file a report, I'm not sure what happened so...

As far as other video, Yes, After filming for years down at the lake, I have some mind blowing footage.

One strange thing is the house sized Balls of Light Plasma that seem to be pulsating different colors, This last summer these Plasma ORBS strarted to come in very close and let me film them, In just as good quality as this clip that is now on youtube.

Anyway, One of my own favorite clips is This ORB just appears out of nowhere stait out infront of me and begins moving towards me, It got so close that on a good day, I could have swam out to where it was, it would be a long swim but it was close.

It then begins slowly moving to the right/East and as I am filming it, it dissapears, You can hear me say "It just dissaperared" and then as i continue to film it re manifests, then it disappeared again so i put the camera into night shot, I could barely see a smudge of light and all of a sudden it just look liked it exploded into a ball of fire, I was pretty excited about what i seen so i switched the camera back into normal color mode and this ORB looked like something you would see on a Christman Tree, it remained that bright for the rest of the footage, as it continued moving right, I kept filming it, and on a tripod, the video is amazing, then all of a sudden, it just takes off, there is no acceleration, it just goes from speed A (very slow) to speed B, I couldn't even keep up with it with the camera.

I will get that up on youtube soon

Originally posted by Frozenthought

I will get that up on youtube soon

AWESOME! I can't wait to see it!

Oh sensfan your being consistently critical of people here I feel. Re-Read your posts. Consider pulling back the barbed wire and let thoughts and opinions through.

Dallas

Originally posted by Dallas
Oh sensfan your being consistently critical of people here I feel. Re-Read your posts. Consider pulling back the barbed wire and let thoughts and opinions through.

Dallas

What's wrong with being cirtical when searching for the truth? Trust me, I believe in UFO's maybe more than many here at ATS, but I won't take a fuzzy light in the sky for a ufo until I see more substantial proof than that.

Originally posted by davidbiedny
Holding back the info that you are a co-producer of a film which RELIES on this footage NOT being planes, is very telling, indeed.
dB

Well I would have to say then that you have no clue what you are talking about because I told everybody here in my first post regarding this footage that I am working with David, here is that thread...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I didn't say it AGAIN in this thread because this thread wasn't even supposed to be about MY FOOTAGE, it had already been discussed here...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

My whole point of this thread is that I had found a whole other group of people who had filmed these same objects over Lake Ontario.

And you want me to send you my footage whaen you are clearly just trying to discount it, ya right, perhaps you do have some bosses in the Illuminiti who don't want this info out?

Regarding Fear Or Love?

I do believe Our physical 3rd dimensional reality can be thought of as a school of sorts, for the soul to learn to use mental energy in a responsible way. Your beliefs (belief = thoughts, feelings, & emotions) create your reality.

If you harbor any negativity or fear, you will just create those situations endlessly, but there are always guides to help you out of your self-created
prison. Nobody is ever left behind. All get it eventually, but in their own way and their own time.

I believe Humans are really only capable of two pure emotions, Love & Fear and every emotion & thought is a derivative of one of the other, and we are able to experience both to whatever level we choose.

Be mindful of where you place your thoughts, because there is a direct
correlation between what you think and what you experience as your normal everyday physical reality & personal life, they are one in the same. We do not observe reality, we are interacting with it.

You choose to attack and say I was withholding info regarding working with David with out checking into what you were even saying.

choose FEAR, Fear of not being right, Fear of information that goes against your own belief system? I don't know but it's FEAR

[edit on 9-2-2007 by Frozenthought]

And you want me to send you my footage whaen you are clearly just trying to discount it, ya right, perhaps you do have some bosses in the Illuminiti who don't want this info out?

I believe this statement sais it all. You don't want people to look at your footage with a critical eye in case they can prove it is something normal and not ufo related. If you were truly interested in showing true ufo footage, you would gladly let everyone have a look and try to debunk it. If it is in fact unrefutable ufo footage, it will stand up to any criticism.

Your mind is made up and can't be changed even with hard evidence, so what's the point of posting your video?

Originally posted by Frozenthought

Originally posted by davidbiedny
Holding back the info that you are a co-producer of a film which RELIES on this footage NOT being planes, is very telling, indeed.
dB

Well I would have to say then that you have no clue what you are talking about because I told everybody here in my first post regarding this footage that I am working with David, here is that thread...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I didn't say it AGAIN in this thread because this thread wasn't even supposed to be about MY FOOTAGE, it had already been discussed here...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

My whole point of this thread is that I had found a whole other group of people who had fiolmed these same objects over Lake Ontario

And you want me to send you my footage whaen you are clearly just trying to discount it, ya right, perhaps you do have some bosses in the Illuminiti who don't want this info out?

To be fair, I had heard some time back that Frozenthought was working with Dan Aykroyd and David on the new DVD, davidbiedny may not have seen it is all.

And to be fair to davidbiedny, he runs the Paracast, he is very scientific and just wants the facts to help prove the UFO phenomenon. www.theparacast.com... He does it for FREE, and he is a guy who could make a lot more money with his skills.


[edit on 9-2-2007 by MiahX]