Brexit is a Mess, how do we Fix it.

a reply to: ScepticScot
I only needed the one vote. I cast it knowing that WTO rules were on the table, as everyone knew because the remain camp publicised it.
It is an example of democracy to follow this referendum to leave the EU through now.

TICK TOCK TICK TOCK...

a reply to: Soloprotocol

We already meet the criteria for joining and they will welcome us with open arms.

Yes, you are willing to roll over and let the unelected, undemocratic EU commissioners do whatever they wish with you.
Once they've dissolved democratically elected National Assemblies you'll be nothing to them, an utter irrelevance.

Why would they care about Scotland - I nearly said an independent Scotland but you'll have given up all hope of independence and even devolved power.

5.3million Scots = 8.3% of UK population.
5.3million Scots = 1% of EU population.

How much influence do you think you'll have?

Just more people and land for them to lord it over and exploit and manipulate.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Do what Canada may threaten the US with: Hit the EU in the pocket. Use brains when dealing with a bigger bully.

Problem solved

www.cbc.ca...

And so Attaran is suggesting that Canada take aim at U.S. drug patents.

The U.S. holds more pharmaceutical patents and other intellectual property licences than any other country. But that strength could become a vulnerability if Canada took action to suspend American patents on Canadian soil. Canadian companies would then be able to produce those drugs. "You hit us on tariffs, we hit you on patents," he said.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: alldaylong

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: rhynouk

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: Freeborn

This is a major economic and constitutional change. People should be allowed a say on.The final outcome. A vote in 2016 should not be binding over what people want now.

But the process of leaving the EU would take 2 years from the moment article 50 was signed. Everybody knew that from day one.
While I agree times have changed, that doesn't mean you have another referendum.

People just have to except the result and work together to achieve it. No matter how much people moan and cry about it, it isn't going to change anyone's mind in the government. Tony Blair, Nick Clegg and John Major can swan around Europe all they want like a boyband, but it won't make any difference.

Why not have another referendum. Yet to hear any proper argument against it.

When David Cameron called the referendum, at no time did he state that a second referendum would be called to confirm the result of the first referendum.

I know that, you know that and everyone else knows that. You are arguing a lost cause.

David Cameron doesn't get to make that decision any more than you or I do.

He did actually.

David Cameron has said the British people must "have their say" on Europe as he pledged an in/out referendum if the Conservatives win the election

www.bbc.co.uk...

www.bbc.co.uk...

ukandeu.ac.uk...

time.com...

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Want some more ?

a reply to: ScepticScot

And the leave camp claimed we would still have access to the single market and no border with Ireland. Turns out remain was correct then.

I think everyone on both sides see's the benefits of Free Trade - after all that is what the UK originally signed up for, never on mention of political union - but its the EU playing hard ball because they wish to 'punish' the UK in order to deter other nations seeking to leave the EU.
I'm absolutely certain that if the EU entered negotiations with reasonable and realistic expectations an agreement could be made....but they haven't and it seems they won't, they have their stance and are not prepared to budge.

At this point I join the # 'em crowd - just give notice that all negotiations are stopping and will only recommence after 11pm on 29th March 2019.
Let's see if they change their stance then.
If not, well we've faced bigger dangers and worse possibilities before and always come through.....I'm sure we can do it again.

As for Ireland;
That is a delicate and tricky situation.
I don't think anyone really wants to jeopardise the peace process.
If I'm honest I have no solution and I really don't know what's for the best....I just know we don't want a return to The Troubles or any sort of conflict.

a reply to: ScepticScot
You still haven't answered my question, did you know that WTO rules were a potential outcome of leaving the EU?
I knew, the remain support leaflets told me about it.
I voted leave and democracy is following the will of the people.

Maybe time for a dictionary defination of the word referendum?

Referendum
noun [ C ] UK ​ /ˌref.əˈren.dəm/ US ​ /ˌref.əˈren.dəm/ plural referendums or formal referenda formal plebiscite
​
A vote in which all the people in a country or an area are asked to give their opinion about or decide
an important political or social question:

Decide being the operative word ...... The UK public HAVE DECIDED .....

Now let it happen.

a reply to: Freeborn

As anyone actually read " Article 50 " ?

The onus is on The E.U. to reach an agreement with The U.K.

2. A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention. In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3) of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council, acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament

www.lisbon-treaty.org...

originally posted by: alldaylong

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: alldaylong

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: rhynouk

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: Freeborn

This is a major economic and constitutional change. People should be allowed a say on.The final outcome. A vote in 2016 should not be binding over what people want now.

But the process of leaving the EU would take 2 years from the moment article 50 was signed. Everybody knew that from day one.
While I agree times have changed, that doesn't mean you have another referendum.

People just have to except the result and work together to achieve it. No matter how much people moan and cry about it, it isn't going to change anyone's mind in the government. Tony Blair, Nick Clegg and John Major can swan around Europe all they want like a boyband, but it won't make any difference.

Why not have another referendum. Yet to hear any proper argument against it.

When David Cameron called the referendum, at no time did he state that a second referendum would be called to confirm the result of the first referendum.

I know that, you know that and everyone else knows that. You are arguing a lost cause.

David Cameron doesn't get to make that decision any more than you or I do.

He did actually.

David Cameron has said the British people must "have their say" on Europe as he pledged an in/out referendum if the Conservatives win the election

www.bbc.co.uk...

www.bbc.co.uk...

ukandeu.ac.uk...

time.com...

www.telegraph.co.uk...

Want some more ?

We are talking about a second referendum, no one is suggesting going back In time.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: ScepticScot
You still haven't answered my question, did you know that WTO rules were a potential outcome of leaving the EU?
I knew, the remain support leaflets told me about it.
I voted leave and democracy is following the will of the people.

Yes I did know which is one of the reasons I voted remain ( not the main one).

And if the will of the people has changed?

Again no argument for not having a second referendum.

a reply to: ScepticScot
Enact the will of the people first then I'm all for future referendums about whatever.
#LeaveMeansLeave
...as you knew when you voted.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: ScepticScot
You still haven't answered my question, did you know that WTO rules were a potential outcome of leaving the EU?
I knew, the remain support leaflets told me about it.
I voted leave and democracy is following the will of the people.

Yes I did know which is one of the reasons I voted remain ( not the main one).

And if the will of the people has changed?

Again no argument for not having a second referendum.

There already was a referendum regarding membership in the EU. The issue has been decided upon.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: ScepticScot
Enact the will of the people first then I'm all for future referendums about whatever.
#LeaveMeansLeave
...as you knew when you voted.

Ignoring that the leave campaign claimed we would stay in the single market?

Besides which people allowed to change their mind.

Still not heard an argument against a second referendum.

originally posted by: ScepticScot
Still not heard an argument against a second referendum.

I argue against a second vote............

a reply to: ScepticScot
No need to argue against something which ain't happening lol
TICK TOCK TICK TOCK...

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: ScepticScot
Still not heard an argument against a second referendum.

I argue against a second vote............

Plead give an actual reason why? Genuinely can't see a single valid reason against.

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: Soloprotocol

We already meet the criteria for joining and they will welcome us with open arms.

Just more people and land for them to lord it over and exploit and manipulate.

So just like Westminster then. Only we'll have full control over our own taxation and Assets including Oil and Gas.

originally posted by: CornishCeltGuy
a reply to: ScepticScot
No need to argue against something which ain't happening lol
TICK TOCK TICK TOCK...

Have you recorded that as a macro or are you typing it each time?

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: ScepticScot
Still not heard an argument against a second referendum.

I argue against a second vote............

Plead give an actual reason why? Genuinely can't see a single valid reason against.

The matter has already been put to a vote.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Predictive text is all.
Solo did it in the failed Scottish independence threads, I'm owning it here lol
TICK TOCK TICK TOCK...