The future economic instability and French Revolution style revolt coming to a town near you...

originally posted by: toysforadults

originally posted by: TonyS

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: Lumenari

the unfunded pension liabilities is a catastrophe in the making, I think they are praying enough baby boomers and Gen X dies before it fully manifest (which is soon)

the bricklayer's crew I'm working with has asked me to join because they are short handed but I won't because I've looked into it and they are barely surviving.

I know the owner of the company and they don't profit on these jobs the only reason they take them is because they have no choice in order to win the bid on other more profitable parts of the project

a lot of these construction companies are hanging on by a thread

I am surprised to hear that. Can't they up the bids for the contracts? Is there that much competition out there? All we hear is there's a huge shortage of skilled labor.

Don't understand.

no, the problem is the union's demands are to high, the pensions are way to unafordable so unless they get rid of the pensions they can't bid lower on the jobs

I am estimating here but you will take home somewhere around $40-42 an hour and you pay 10-11 right off the top for the pension and other benefits. You take home around $30-31 dollars an hour for the bricklayers, then they take 3% for the state union and 2% for the local (that is totalled from the $42 not the 31) so after taxes and benefits you're essentially down to somewhere around 20-24 an hour. You lose half your pay right out of the gates.

Paying a pension and health care benefits aren't losing your pay.

a reply to: Aazadan

healthcare benefits is losing your money if you're not using it and a pension is a promise that you get it back in 20-30 years

so it is a temporary loss, it's a loss in that you can take that same amount of money and invest it yourself in something as simple as real estate and get a higher return on your investment than you will giving it to daddy investment company who's doing who knows what with it

they almost lost their pensions in 2015 and I can't imagine it's doing much better 3 years later

originally posted by: toysforadults
they almost lost their pensions in 2015 and I can't imagine it's doing much better 3 years later

Pensions are intended to be invested by professionals in a long term focused mixture of stocks and bonds. That process is fine. If the professionals are messing up, then what chance does the individual have to succeed if the pro's can't do it?

The real issue with pensions is that companies and states have been dipping into them as a source of financing.

I prefer the idea of a 401k to a pension because it puts less hands on your money. However, you still wind up with the same issue... if you don't invest the right amount (which I readily admit very few can) with the right people in the right funds (and here, education is something of an issue), you will not have enough to retire on.

Health care pays for itself in preventative maintenance.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: toysforadults
they almost lost their pensions in 2015 and I can't imagine it's doing much better 3 years later

Pensions are intended to be invested by professionals in a long term focused mixture of stocks and bonds. That process is fine. If the professionals are messing up, then what chance does the individual have to succeed if the pro's can't do it?

The real issue with pensions is that companies and states have been dipping into them as a source of financing.

I prefer the idea of a 401k to a pension because it puts less hands on your money. However, you still wind up with the same issue... if you don't invest the right amount (which I readily admit very few can) with the right people in the right funds (and here, education is something of an issue), you will not have enough to retire on.

Health care pays for itself in preventative maintenance.

The individual should invest in index funds, which beat professionals "trading" all the time. Vanguard or Fidelity index funds preferred.

originally posted by: Ameilia
The individual should invest in index funds, which beat professionals "trading" all the time. Vanguard or Fidelity index funds preferred.

Correct, but the fact that people don't as a whole do that, means that people as a whole are not capable of optimally managing their retirements.

a reply to: toysforadults

In 2001..just before the towers were hit Rumsfelt convienently informed the US citizens that a few trillion dollars were lost track of. The next thing what happened is that all traces to where that money went got distroyed by "enemy"attacks. Now many years later nobody took it upon himself the task to prevent such administrative mess to ever happen again. Which brings us to present day in which rumours are that some more than 15 trillion dollars are gone missing.

And yet still nobody seems to care..or is someone appointed to prevent this from ever happening again ..or to find out where these dollars hide. Either this money is used to protect the nation against foreign threats ...development of exotic weapons... or this money has been stolen by those with access to it.

If the latter is the case the US people can count on it that the corruption and theft of US citizens money is all over government... and everybody involved is protecting eachother. And of course this is possible because the corruption is in the highest places in the most significant positions in the justice department.

It amazes me that the US citizens are staring like a deer captured in the healights ...and allow this to all to happen. All of the some 330 million citizens thinking...there must be someone around taking this task upon himself to prosecute those basterds.

NOT GONNA HAPPEN... of course this is all my opinion and have I no evidence there is a organised gang busy robbing the nation into poverty.

Maybe a revolution is neccesary before the people can bring these thiefs foward... just like it happened after the french revolution..

a reply to: zatara

The average citizen is more worried about the Yankees or Patriots game than their country being ran by global corrupt interests

jeffersons prophecy is true

The best government system in the world has become the worst

originally posted by: zataraWhich brings us to present day in which rumours are that some more than 15 trillion dollars are gone missing.

It hasn't gone missing, it was all spent on normal approved budgeted projects. The issue is that accounting in the pentagon is a mess.

Think about it logically, look at defense budgets. Carving out 15 trillion dollars from the previous 20 years worth of budgets is no easy feat. It's an enormous chunk of spending, if that were somehow dark money we would know because soldiers and contractors wouldn't be getting paid.

a reply to: Aazadan

Imo a 401k is a scam to let other people make money on your money, with the way the rules and regulations are setup.

There are Much better ways to invest than a 401k for retirement.

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: Aazadan

Imo a 401k is a scam to let other people make money on your money, with the way the rules and regulations are setup.

There are Much better ways to invest than a 401k for retirement.

Like?

California has an economic problem directly related to the liberal policies

That may be part of it but it's mostly due to massive population growth which is a conservative, and retarded, policy that's destroying the middle class in many states.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: Aazadan

Imo a 401k is a scam to let other people make money on your money, with the way the rules and regulations are setup.

There are Much better ways to invest than a 401k for retirement.

Like?

Real estate.

My issue with the 401K is the draconian regulations and penalties to use your own money.

They need to allow for more flexibility when using your own money to invest. I prefer the real estate market over the stock market anyday. I should have the option to use my 401k to make investments in real estate or even pay off my own house , versus being tied to the stock market.

Most people would be ok at retirement if they had their home paid off and lived of SS. So if they really cared about helping people versus using their money to make money, they would allow access to ones 401k without penalties to pay off their home or invest in real estate and not that self directed IRA BS either. Versus solely forcing people to be tied to the stock market which most people are uneducated on and end up making bad decisions and investments anyways.

Of course their is always room for abuse so they could take measures to minimize that by preventing HELOC from being taken on properties that a 401K was used on , etc.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: zataraWhich brings us to present day in which rumours are that some more than 15 trillion dollars are gone missing.

It hasn't gone missing, it was all spent on normal approved budgeted projects. The issue is that accounting in the pentagon is a mess.

Think about it logically, look at defense budgets. Carving out 15 trillion dollars from the previous 20 years worth of budgets is no easy feat. It's an enormous chunk of spending, if that were somehow dark money we would know because soldiers and contractors wouldn't be getting paid.

On the other hand ..how many different projects does it take to screw up a the accountance office to come to the total of some 15 trillion dollars. I mean...that's a lot of projects. So much money for so many projects gone missing that you could say there is a pattern forming. Well,...maybe you are right, could be just a few giant projects...like building a city on the moon?

a reply to: zatara

It has to do with the accounting software the Pentagon uses. It's an absolutely massive undertaking, they don't have the software or systems in place to properly track it, they have no funding to build that system because those immense budgets have funding stipulations on other things, and at this point it's basically an unfixable problem. If the records exist, they can't be reassembled.

I'm confused. The OP starts out talking about all these economic problems, using California in numerous examples.

Don't all the liberal policies in California fix these problems? There can't possibly be income inequality there.

originally posted by: face23785
I'm confused. The OP starts out talking about all these economic problems, using California in numerous examples.

Don't all the liberal policies in California fix these problems? There can't possibly be income inequality there.

California has much less income inequality than other states. The effective minimum wage job there is to drive for Uber/Lyft which pays on average about $35/hour or roughly $75k/year. The typical college educated job pays $100k-$150k per year. Thus, the unskilled uneducated job pays half what the ivory tower job does. In other areas of the country the range is more like $15k/year vs 80k/year.

California is also the land of startups that pay in equity. That equity means that those who are instrumental in producing a product are properly rewarded for their success. Not just the company owner.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: face23785
I'm confused. The OP starts out talking about all these economic problems, using California in numerous examples.

Don't all the liberal policies in California fix these problems? There can't possibly be income inequality there.

California has much less income inequality than other states. The effective minimum wage job there is to drive for Uber/Lyft which pays on average about $35/hour or roughly $75k/year. The typical college educated job pays $100k-$150k per year. Thus, the unskilled uneducated job pays half what the ivory tower job does. In other areas of the country the range is more like $15k/year vs 80k/year.

California is also the land of startups that pay in equity. That equity means that those who are instrumental in producing a product are properly rewarded for their success. Not just the company owner.

You're not factoring in cost of living. California is one of the worst states when it comes to the actual value of a dollar. You make more money, but everything costs so much more it completely offsets it and then some.

Take a look.

Also, a typical college educated job is "ivory tower" to you?

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: face23785
I'm confused. The OP starts out talking about all these economic problems, using California in numerous examples.

Don't all the liberal policies in California fix these problems? There can't possibly be income inequality there.

California has much less income inequality than other states. The effective minimum wage job there is to drive for Uber/Lyft which pays on average about $35/hour or roughly $75k/year. The typical college educated job pays $100k-$150k per year. Thus, the unskilled uneducated job pays half what the ivory tower job does. In other areas of the country the range is more like $15k/year vs 80k/year.

California is also the land of startups that pay in equity. That equity means that those who are instrumental in producing a product are properly rewarded for their success. Not just the company owner.

there is not a single thing in this post that's factually correct, do we live in the same country?? Uber doesn't pay $35 an hour

originally posted by: toysforadults
there is not a single thing in this post that's factually correct, do we live in the same country?? Uber doesn't pay $35 an hour

Yes it does. I just spent the last 2 weeks in the Bay Area, taking several Uber's per day asked all of them their typical wages as part of the small talk in the car. Each said they shoot for about $300 per 8 hour day. Which is a bit over $35/hour. Some calculations based on the percent of the ride they said they keep, how long our rides were, and the cost for those rides backed that up.

originally posted by: face23785
You're not factoring in cost of living. California is one of the worst states when it comes to the actual value of a dollar. You make more money, but everything costs so much more it completely offsets it and then some.

Take a look.

Also, a typical college educated job is "ivory tower" to you?

How far the money goes isn't what's important when you're talking about income inequality.

And yes, I've been told hundreds of times by people on this website that college = ivory tower.