dh, you're changing the subject again. We were discussing the existence or non-existence of "chem-trails". I post a lot about chem-trails because that's what I choose to do; and I assume that's why you post about "chem-trails".

But rather than trying to ascribe motives to me, why not discuss some of those six points that you were going to refute?

I mean, you can refute those six points, can't you?

Which one are you going to refute first?

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
dh, you're changing the subject again. We were discussing the existence or non-existence of "chem-trails". I post a lot about chem-trails because that's what I choose to do; and I assume that's why you post about "chem-trails".

But rather than trying to ascribe motives to me, why not discuss some of those six points that you were going to refute?

I mean, you can refute those six points, can't you?

Which one are you going to refute first?

there is a particulate content in jet exhaust. particles are chemicals. therfore, anything out of a jet's arse is, by nature, a chemical trail, or 'chemtrail'. thanks for playing.

dh-

Originally posted by dh
What's the motivation in trying to undermine these views,

On the other hand what is the point of a discussion board where everyone agrees with each other? If I can stop one person believing one stupid idea, I will be happy.

Originally posted by billybob

there is a particulate content in jet exhaust. particles are chemicals. therfore, anything out of a jet's arse is, by nature, a chemical trail, or 'chemtrail'. thanks for playing.

That's very weak. I don't think the "chemtrail" believers are referring to pollution - do you? Having said that, I've no idea what they are referring to, as none of them seem to be in postition to say what the chemicals are.

Originally posted by billybob

there is a particulate content in jet exhaust. particles are chemicals. therfore, anything out of a jet's arse is, by nature, a chemical trail, or 'chemtrail'. thanks for playing.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDukeThat's very weak. I don't think the "chemtrail" believers are referring to pollution - do you? Having said that, I've no idea what they are referring to, as none of them seem to be in postition to say what the chemicals are.

i think that some jets could have a little something extra in the exhaust. it's possible.
anything's possible.

[edit on 27-2-2005 by billybob]

I see those all the time where I live. (S. California) I believe the reason why some look fairly wide is because of the wind at high altitudes. I personally don't think it has anything to do with experiments or conspiracies.

They were low altitude. And for those claiming its a normal occurence, its been about a week and no such x-trails appeared since i took the pics. And we've had similar weather so its not the weather or temperatures.

Yesterday, in the late afternoon/early evening (just as the sun was setting), it was a crystal clear blue sky with few clouds, I saw some airline jets flying in different directions leaving short contrails high up in the altitude.

I was thinking about those chemtrails as I've seen up in the sky numerous times in the past. Those chemtrails are usually long like going for few to several miles, spread-out by few hundreds feet in length and were placed in low altitude in all different directions.

Airlines leaving short contrails high in the altitude while chemtrails leaving long contrails low in the altitude.

I'm nowhere near an international airport.

Something ain't kosher here.

Congratulations the_Oleeno, your one of the few who can see this phenomenon. Most others choose to create their own version of reality so as to not provoke any of their subconscious fears.

You're right. Something is not kosher here.

I'm going to get flamed for the above statement. But I honestly can say that those who don't think something is going on are absolutely moronic. Not everyone though. Some people, I'd say those 15 and under, probably had chemtrails going on their whole lives, so its hard for them to distinguish. All the rest of us, contrails were usually not the way the chemtrails are. There are still regular contrails, you can see the short thin lines as they dissapate within seconds. On the very rare occasion, you will see a high altitude airliner leave a contrail that lasts for a few minutes. Then every couple of days you will be assaulted by a squadron of white jets spraying chemicals into the air. But thats too scary for these people to believe.

[edit on 27-2-2005 by joepits]

Originally posted by billybob

i think that some jets could have a little something extra in the exhaust. it's possible.
anything's possible.

That is extremely flawed logic. How do you make up your mind about what is true? It is possible that you are a serial killer and I am Jesus come back to save the world from idiotic chemtrail believers. Do you think this is true because it is possible?

Originally posted by joepits

I'm going to get flamed for the above statement. But I honestly can say that those who don't think something is going on are absolutely moronic.

Well that makes about 99.99999% of the world's population "absolutely moronic", according to you.

But thats too scary for these people to believe.

Yes, I'm soooooo scared.

What am I scared of exactly? What are "they" spraying? What are the ill effects?

Why can't you come up with some kind of cogent theory, instead of just going "oooh, the stuff coming out of planes looks different from when I was a kid". Which is your arguement pretty much summed up.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke

But thats too scary for these people to believe.

Yes, I'm soooooo scared.

What am I scared of exactly? What are "they" spraying? What are the ill effects?

You're scared of the unknown.
You're scared of the possibility your government is not all good and out to help you and possibly even hurt you.

Originally posted by joepits
You're scared of the unknown.
You're scared of the possibility your government is not all good and out to help you and possibly even hurt you.

And what is the "unknown" I am scared off? Which government are you talking about? I'm not from the US.

Billybob says:

“there is a particulate content in jet exhaust. particles are chemicals. therfore, anything out of a jet's arse is, by nature, a chemical trail, or 'chemtrail'. thanks for playing.”

So I gather that you believe that “chem-trails” are contrails? Okay, I’ll buy that.

"i think that some jets could have a little something extra in the exhaust. it's possible. anything's possible.”

So you’re arguing in favor of “chem-trails” because “anything’s possible”?

Hey, maybe I am joepits’ father! Remember, “anything’s possible”! I know! Let’s start a thread saying “Off_the_Streat is joepits’ Father”. I’m sure you’d buy into that “theory” too!

joepits says:

"They were low altitude. "

Gee, joepits, a couple of days ago you admitted on this same threadyou couldn't determine the altitude of contrails. Here's what you admitted on post id 1212473 of page one of this thread:

"OK. Well lets say I was fooled and they are really 30,000 feet high.

Now you're changine your story again, because it suits your hypothesis.

"And for those claiming its a normal occurence, its been about a week and no such x-trails appeared since i took the pics. And we've had similar weather so its not the weather or temperatures.

Similar weather on the ground has nothing to do with the temperature and humidity at 30,000-plus feet.

And besides, since you refuse to say anything about yourself or where you live, we have no way whatsoever of checking your story out.

Meanwhile, whenever I ask you to address any of the six points about why I think "chem-trails" are a hoax, you change the subject.

You realize, of course, that you now have exactly zero credibility.

OTS,

I did not say they were at 30,000 feet. You misinterpreted what I said. I meant that if they were at 30,000 feet they would have to be huge. Larger than any airplane width or any "usual" jet contrail.

I know they were not at 30,000 feet. I am not an aviator but I could tell these ones were pretty close over my head. I might add that I got a bit dizzy when taking these photos. I'm sure you will say it was just placebo.

I gave up on trying to educate you about chemtrails a while ago. When I post I do not take into account anything you have to "add". I realize you are are a moron. Thats why I "ignore" your famous 6 points.

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
You realize, of course, that you now have exactly zero credibility.

Thats great. Will you kindly piss off now?




[edit on 27-2-2005 by joepits]

Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke

Originally posted by billybob

i think that some jets could have a little something extra in the exhaust. it's possible.
anything's possible.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDukeThat is extremely flawed logic.

no. it's not. anything's possible. it's possible that your brain is in a jar and what you think is reality is completely virtual, ALA 'the matrix'. prove that's not the case. you can't.
these are good logical arguments in the pure sense. you are talking about interpretation of data, which is different than 'logic'. 'logic' is IF, AND, OR, NOT statements.
as in, both chemtrail observers, AND contrail observers are observing trails coming from planes.
chemtrail believers believe there is water, exhaust and chemical-x being released in these trails.
chemtrail debunkers believe there is only water and a little carbon.
they can NOT BOTH be right. it is one OR the other.
there is nothing logically flawed with saying it is possible. until proven impossible, it remains possible. you can argue that the probability is low, but that is probabilty statistics, not logic. it can NOT be BOTH. it is one OR the other.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDukeHow do you make up your mind about what is true?

same way you do. comparative analysis. we constantly take in data and compare it with our archetypical memory database. we do not, for example, remember every single apple that we have ever seen. we have an archetype for apple, and if we find an apple sized, red,yellow or green fruit that is apple-shaped, we will assume it's an apple. it could be plstic or clay and we will think it's real from a distance. if it's really a good copy, we would need to feel it to know that's it's fake. if the texture was well simulated, we would have to taste it. if it was amade of apple textured, apple flavoured tofu, we might have to use even more subtle sensory perception to notice the difference.
throw a foam rock or brick at someone and see if they see it as foam or rock before it hits them.

Originally posted by FatherLukeDukeIt is possible that you are a serial killer and I am Jesus come back to save the world from idiotic chemtrail believers. Do you think this is true because it is possible?

bless you jesus. forgive me my sins.

joepits says:

"I gave up on trying to educate you about chemtrails a while ago. When I post I do not take into account anything you have to "add". I realize you are are a moron. Thats why I "ignore" your famous 6 points.... Will you kindly piss off now?"

Wow, you sure know how to debate and get your points over in a logical and coherent manner!

ROFLMAO!!

Well, this thread has been totally derailed.
We're not discussing chemtrails anymore, we're discussing the validity of our arguments and the meaning of our language.
Off The Street, the MAN must be very pleased with your work.

And joepits I second that emotion...

[edit on 27/2/2005 by ANOK]

ANOK says:

"Well, this thread has been totally derailed. We're not discussing chemtrails anymore, we're discussing the validity of our arguments."

And why not? If your arguments have little or no validity, then that pretty much rules out "chem-trails", dosn't it?

"Off The Street, the MAN must be very pleased with your work."

I am The Man.

"And joepits I second that emotion... "

ANOK, If you intend to discuss "chem-trails" you should try logic, evidence, and common sense -- not "emotion". Joepits has sunk to emotional responses, and look at his credibility!