It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by marg6043
jake1997
I beg your pardon I suggest you research the history of the bible itself and its content before you believe so an outrageous myth.
But occurs will never do such a thing the bible is all you need. The Church has made sure of that, more than the bible to learn your historical facts.
Deny Ignorance.
Originally posted by Dasher
as a christian, i would have to agree that there is no proof nor evidence in the scriptures of a singular event known as the rapture or even implication of that which is the modern churches interpretation.
Originally posted by marg6043
Holy Scripture states that the Lord shortened the Great Tribulation for the sake of the elect. Why would this be necessary if they had been raptured away?
Originally posted by marg6043
The concept of Pre-Tribulational "rapture" which was developed by, and popularized by, the Protestants began only about 150-200 years ago.
It holds that the Church will be "raptured" away body and soul into Heaven by Jesus prior to the onset of the Great Tribulation. The Roman Catholic Church has condemned this notion as a falsehood.
Rapture concept has become so complicated that the "believers" do not even understand the meaning of it anymore.
Just like any other prediction in the bible, is bound to be question and analyzed and at the end is just but pure speculative rant of what the church wants their followers to believe.
Have a good day and I hope that your rapture, finds its way to your near future.
I will probably witness alliens landing in my back yard first.
One of the arguments most opponents to the Rapture use is that it can't be right as it was a theory developed much later in comparison to other views. They all say that it began around 1830 through the ministry of J.N.Darby. Actually the pretrib rapture position does have historical precedent. A sermon was delivered in AD 373 by the Byzantine leader Pseudo-Ephraem entitled "On the Last Times, the Antichrist, and the End of the World" or "Sermon on the End fo the World". This includes a concept very similar to the pretrib rapture.
One thing is certain. When any man assures you they personally have all the spiritual answers or know the Truth with a capital T, that person is a liar. Don't believe the hype.
Originally posted by Gazrok
The other tidbit, is that according to the good book, only 144000 are to be so saved, and these are all virgin men, descended from the 12 tribes of Israel...so a selective bunch at best it seems...
Originally posted by jake1997
One thing is certain. When any man assures you they personally have all the spiritual answers or know the Truth with a capital T, that person is a liar. Don't believe the hype.
Especially when he talks about the bible but does not quote scripture to support it.
The scripture for the rapture is shown above.
Take it for what its worth, or simply ignore it
Originally posted by jake1997
its clear to the reader who has integrity, that the bible teaches a round earth.
Originally posted by jake1997
So you can post what you want and give it your anti-christian bias slant...
It doesn't say they would have trouble does it? How high can you count?
Originally posted by dbrandtThis means that there is a HUGE amount of people saved during the tribulation. If someone would try to count them it would be a task that a person would have trouble doing.
this statement makes no sense.
It also means that since the tribulation will be the worst time man has ever known on earth, how could an uncountable number be saved. How, because God saves and with God all things are possible.
Originally posted by SomewhereinBetween
It doesn't say they would have trouble does it? How high can you count?
Originally posted by dbrandtThis means that there is a HUGE amount of people saved during the tribulation. If someone would try to count them it would be a task that a person would have trouble doing.
Oh c'mon I think that the point that was trying to be expressed through the bible was that there was a lot. Also imagine what a billion people would look like back then...too many to count. I think that is what was trying to be said not that there is a number that we can not count.
Originally posted by SomewhereinBetween
Revelation's tale will not happen.
Originally posted by marg6043
The concept of Pre-Tribulational "rapture" which was developed by, and popularized by, the Protestants began only about 150-200 years ago.
The Roman Catholic Church has condemned this notion as a falsehood.
Rapture concept has become so complicated that the "believers" do not even understand the meaning of it anymore.
Originally posted by dbrandt
I wrote this several months back. The rapture is Biblical and there are other places talking about it but here is what I wrote several months ago.
posted on 27-7-2004 at 06:38 PM
Pre-trib rapture verses
Someone said that it doesn't matter if the rapture is pre-trib or post-trib. I wholeheartedly disagree. It's pre-trib and you want to escape the tribulation period(it will be the worst time the human race has ever known, worse than what Hitler did and worse the the catastrophe of Noah's flood.) It is going to be hard to be a christian during the tribulation period, it will mean death for some. Plus a strong delusion is going to be sent during the tribulation period. The Bible tells us a "lie" will be told and many will believe this lie.
Someone also said that christians lower themselves to talk to the unsaved to get points to get into heaven. A real christian knows that he is only going to heaven because of what Christ has done for us. You can't do anything to get into heaven aside from faith in Christ. We serve God and as part of our service christians will be rewarded in heaven. The rewards we will receive are for growing in our faith and letting go our our will and listening for the voice of God to direct us. They rewards are for accepting the responsibilities of being a christian and following through on those responsibilities.
Now for the rapture verses:
1. I believe being taken to heaven before the tribulation is one of those rewards. I believe that this is the crown of righteousness that is talked about in 2 Timothy 4:8.
2. 2 Thessalonians 2:3 talks about a falling away that will happen. You need to get a concordance for the Bible so you can study seriously. The word used can mean "departing". This is a verse that could and probably does have a dual application. Departing means going away from true christianity and departing can also be christians departing for heaven in the rapture.
3. 2 Thess. 2:5-8 Someone is holding back the tribulation period and the appearing of the anti-christ. The only one stronger than satan is God(Holy Spirit). The Holy Spirit resides in christians right now and so when He is removed we are removed. God has promised that He would never take His spirit from us, so if He goes we go.
4. Luke 21:36 talks about a way to escape all the things to come(Jesus just talked about the end times before these verses). The word "escape" has the meaning of vanish which is what will happen in the rapture.
5. Acts 15:14-17 talks about God "taking out" (rapture) a people for His name. Then a "residue" of men will seek after the Lord. Residue means left down or left behind. The left Behind book series is a Biblical concept and the title has Biblical meaning.
6. Matthew 24:24 talks about that the "very elect" could be deceived during the trib period, and that would be possible except for one fact, we're gone.
7. Jesus in Matthew 16:13 talks about the fact that "the gates of hell shall not PREVAIL against the church" He is building.
7a. Revelation 13:7 says the antichrist will"overcome" the saints during the trib period.
7b. Daniel 7:21 says the saints will be "PREVAILED" against.
7c. Romans 11:25 talks about blindness on Israel's part toward Christ until the "fulness of the gentiles be come in". Fulness here means completion. Completion of the church.
It appears from these verses in #7 that not all saints will be in the church.
8. Matthew 24:22, Mark 13:20 Jesus tells us the days are shortened for the elect. We don't have as many days as the rest of the world because the days are shortened(we are raptured out of time into eternity. There are no days in eternity.)
8a. Who are the elect? Colossians 3:12 tells us christians are the elect of God.
9. Revelation 3:6 tells us that God has made christians to be "kings and priests" unto Himself.
9a. Rev. ch. 2&3 talks about the churches.
9b. Rev. 4:1 has a door in heaven opened and a trumpet blast(see 1Corinthians 15:51-54 to see this trumpet blast is associated with the rapture.)
9c. Rev 4:4 and 4:10 talks about 24 elders(they represent the 12 tribes of Israel and the 12 apostles) jewish and gentile believers ie. the church.
9d. Rev. 5:8-10 tells us who the 24 elders are. They are people redeemed from every kindred tongue people and nation who were redeemed by the blood of the "lamb"(Jesus). and they have been made kings and priests unto God. Look back at Rev. 3:6. kings and priests again. The kings and priests(christians) of verse 3:6, talked about in CH. 2&3, raptured in verse 4:1 now seen in verses 4:4 and 4:10 and identified in verses 5:8-10.
9e. These elders are seen again in Rev. 5:14, 7:11, 7:13, 11:16, 14:3, 19:4, and every time they are in heaven. Then later in Rev. ch. 19 a door in heaven is opened and Christ returns with the "armies of heaven".
10. The Old Testament even foretells the rapture in Isaiah 26:20-21 and Isaiah 57:1.
11. Rev. 7:9-17 talks of an uncountable number who come out of "great tribulation". and Rev. 20:4 talks of some who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and did not take the mark of the beast. So there will be people who trust Christ in the tribulation period. But there is a difference now is the time to accept Christ and miss the tribulation horrors.
There is plenty of evidence in the Bible for the pre-trib rapture. There are other verses but these are the ones off the top of my head. Anyone and I mean ANYONE can become part of the church and miss the tribulation, but it needs to be done NOW. After that the tribulation comes and it may mean death to be associated with Christ
Originally posted by FatherLukeDuke
If there were such a thing as the rapture what makes anyone think it should happen now, and not in 200 years or even 10,000?