"Communism for Kids":Published by MIT Press

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Wookiep

I don't need an apology or to be agreed with. You bothered to look into what I was talking about even if you were a smug jerk initially. That's more than others have done. I hope you keep reading up on the topic. It's sort of like untold history.

I don't see it as being a jerk, at least that's not what I meant to do. It's not like we're new to this. If it helps, you're my favorite Socialist Libertarian Anarchist, even if I don't agree with your beliefs.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: ketsuko

The thing is that you have pretty much the same thing they have.

Just because you think you don't, doesn't make it so.

And that's fine. Then there is no need for the system here is there?

originally posted by: ketsuko
And that's fine. Then there is no need for the system here is there?

It isn't my place to say if there is a need or not.

That has never been my point.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

I'm not make believing anything. I've backed up everything I've said. You can read the information or not.

You backed with what evidence? Show us a nation that has been ruled by "anarcho-communism" or by "socialist anarchy"...

Definition of anarchy

1
a : absence of government
b : a state of lawlessness or political disorder due to the absence of governmental authority the city's descent into anarchyc : a utopian society of individuals who enjoy complete freedom without government

2
a : absence or denial of any authority or established order anarchy prevailed in the ghettob : absence of order : disorder
not manicured plots but a wild anarchy of nature — Israel Shenker

www.merriam-webster.com...

Socialist and communist nations have governments/social systems controlled by the elite. in socialism the elite are "the socialist party", and in communism it is the "communist party". Both of those parties control their respective governments. Anarchy is about having no government, no hierarchy.

originally posted by: daskakik
...
I even posted pictures of people in a black market in cuba looking rather at ease after he said that trading in the black market would get you arrested. Didn't matter, like a looped tape.

I can post pictures of south African children playing, and being happy. Even thou there are many days those children have nothing to eat.

Heck, you can find photos of rebels that are outcast from their governments, yet they took photos... I guess that means they were not really rebels in your opinion...

You can also find photos of criminals who even post in fakebook and admit committing crimes.

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
I can post pictures of south African children playing, and being happy. Even thou there are many days those children have nothing to eat.

And if you do, it means that it would be incorrect for someone to say that those african children are always hungry and sad and they sure as hell would be lying if they tried to say that all african children are always hungry and sad.

See how that works?

ETA: Your additions are silly.

a reply to: Wookiep

Initially you seemed to be calling me delusional or thought I was making my ideology up on the fly to win arguments. But... you read what I linked instead of continuing whatever you had been assuming.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Click or don't.

originally posted by: daskakik
And if you do, it means that it would be incorrect for someone to say that those african children are always hungry and sad and they sure as hell would be lying if they tried to say that all african children are always hungry and sad.

See how that works?

ETA: Your additions are silly.

No, what I see is another person who has never in his/her whole life seen what life is like in Cuba and wants to claim differently...

What i see is a member that in 7 years hasn't made/posted a single thread. Not once, which means you have never contributed anything, and that same person responds claiming he/she doesn't have to post any evidence to corroborate his/claims.

That's all i see...

a reply to: Kali74

Did you actually read that wikipedia excerpt you posted?

The first anarchist journal to use the term "libertarian" was Le Libertaire, Journal du Mouvement Social and it was published in New York City between 1858 and 1861 by French anarcho-communist Joseph Déjacque.[42] The next recorded use of the term was in Europe, when "libertarian communism" was used at a French regional anarchist Congress at Le Havre (16–22 November 1880). January the following year saw a French manifesto issued on "Libertarian or Anarchist Communism". Finally, 1895 saw leading anarchists Sébastien Faure and Louise Michel publish La Libertaire in France."[42] The word stems from the French word libertaire, and was used to evade the French ban on anarchist publications.[43] In this tradition, the term "libertarianism" in "libertarian socialism" is generally used as a synonym for anarchism, which some say is the original meaning of the term; hence "libertarian socialism" is equivalent to "socialist anarchism" to these scholars.[44][45] In the context of the European socialist movement, libertarian has conventionally been used to describe those who opposed state socialism, such as Mikhail Bakunin.

wiki

Those french anarchists used that term, libertarian anarchism, to evade the ban on anarchist publications.

Not to mention that there has been no nation, no government that has existed as such.

Anyone can write anything in a book.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse
So instead of arguing about the picture of people in Cuba openly trading goods without a trace of fear on their faces you try to make it about the number of threads I've made (or not made)?

Who cares what you see? Your opinion is only one. Any thinking person should add it to any other they come across and then average things out to get a little closer to the truth.

originally posted by: daskakik

Ever since he flat out dismissed the person who said life under Tito was better than what came after, I knew it was a waste of time bothering with any type of proof.
...

And to this day you can find Germans who claim life under Hitler was better than what came after...

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Wookiep

Initially you seemed to be calling me delusional or thought I was making my ideology up on the fly to win arguments. But... you read what I linked instead of continuing whatever you had been assuming.

That's fair. You're right.

I do think whomever came up with it is in error, it's akin to a fairy-tale in my world, but I'm sure I believe things that would be just fantasy to you. So I respect that. No hard feelings!

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

...and also you. Why should anyone flatly believe either of you.

originally posted by: daskakik

...and also you. Why should anyone flatly believe either of you.

I guess your argument is that you can't never believe anyone who has actually experienced any dictatorship... Because that's what you are arguing.

Are there people that even in dictatorships they lived better than "what came after"?... Sure there are...a dictatorship needs people in charge and their families who will always live better under such dictatorships than the rest of the people... It still doesn't make those nations and systems any less dictatorial and oppressive.

I have to ask myself what the heck you are doing in a forum like ATS, when you claim you don't have to corroborate any claims you make, and that people should believe you, even though you never experienced life in countries like Cuba.

Why do you even post in a forum when you claim you never have to corroborate your claims?...

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

As usual you miss the actual point. I don't believe you because of the way you parrot the fear-mongering bits that I heard growing up in the US, which I know are BS.

I also question the way you dismiss what others, who have also experienced dictatorships, have to add to the conversation.

Tempered with what other cubans have shared with me, I take what you say with a pinch of salt.

ETA:

Why do you even post in a forum when you claim you never have to corroborate your claims?...

I usually try but not so much to you because you seem to think you are the only one that can give an accurate account on Cuba and when I have done so in the past you dismiss it so I don't bother with it, when it comes to you.

a reply to: daskakik

So in other words, you know what is bs about Cuba or even socialism/communism even though you never lived in Cuba, or the U.S.S.R., or in China, or in North Korea. Yeah, that's exactly the same argument you made about not having to corroborate your arguments.

Heck, the socialism in Venezuela is called "socialism of the 21st century". Yet it is the same BS socialism/communism that destroyed Cuba and transformed it from the jewel of the Caribbean into the sheethole of the Caribbean.



You want to claim that is "crony-capitalist" even when the 1936 Constitution of the U.S.S.R. explains that those who are part of the communist party/communist regime/government are exalted from other working classes.

The one making claims, and not supporting his/her arguments is you.

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

No that is not what I said. You are free to try again, though.

ETA: I think I see where you got all my supposed claims from.

originally posted by: daskakik

I usually try but not so much to you because you seem to think you are the only one that can give an accurate account on Cuba and when I have done so in the past you dismiss it so I don't bother with it, when it comes to you.

LOL i am not the only one, over 2 million Cubans who have left the island and the majority of them say the same thing.

Many Cubans in the island are also not afraid, as long as the police is not looking.



You want to claim only capitalism has rich elites despite the fact that the same communist constitution you tried to use as an example, explains that the communists in power are a better class than the proletariat, or the rest of the Cuban working classes.



[yvid]

a reply to: ElectricUniverse

I ran into some different ones.

Just so we are clear, they don't say it is utopia but they don't sound like you...red scarfs???