Saudi Arabia and Turkey prepare for Syrian invasion, expect 'massive escalation'.

a reply to: 23432

Why would the nations who created ISIS want to destroy them?

I cannot believe there are people who think that in case erDOGan and Saudi Arabia go into Syria they would be against ISIS.

Turkey is fighting Kurds, and Saudi Arabia + Qatar would be fighting alongside their ISIS army.

I wish for Russia vs turkey conflict.

a reply to: 23432

Ukraine is what my eyes are on. Russian intervention elsewhere is simply a distraction. I really think soon there will be an East Ukraine and West Ukraine.

a reply to: daaskapital

Saudi Sending fighter aircraft to Turkey.. I hope they get their butts handed to them ! youtu.be...

Forget the headlines and the propaganda and it all boils down to is oil and setting up central banks where there are none. terrorism is bulls#

a reply to: 727Sky

The House of Saud wanted widespread 'regime change', and the USA did their bidding and continues to be joined at the hip to whatever the Saudi royal family wants. Saudi jets flying from Turkey only increases the likelihood of a very messy encounter with the Russians.

Since the Turks and the House of Saud (together with the Qatari) are the founders and funders of ISIS/ISIL/Daesh (Muslim Brotherhood by any other name), only a true idiot would believe they intend to take down their creation.

In all likelihood I expect the Saudis to join the Turks in bombing the non-PKK Kurds (who are fighting ISIS) as well as propping up ISIS wherever the Saudis et. al. can do so.

originally posted by: Nikola014
a reply to: 23432

Why would the nations who created ISIS want to destroy them?

I cannot believe there are people who think that in case erDOGan and Saudi Arabia go into Syria they would be against ISIS.

Turkey is fighting Kurds, and Saudi Arabia + Qatar would be fighting alongside their ISIS army.

I wish for Russia vs turkey conflict.

Turks & Kurds are not enemies , despite what you believe . Do you know how many Kurds serve in Turkish Army ?

DAESH wasn't created by Turks , in fact when USA was pulling out of Iraq , Turks exclusively warned Pentagon & Washington and stated that these weapons which were left behind was going to be used to further destabilise the region.
Turks said to Yankees ; don't invade Iraq , it's a bad move . Yankees ignored Turks .
Turks said to Yankees ; don't leave all these weapons behind . Yankees ignored Turks .

Erdogan asked Yankees to choose their sides between Kurdish Terrorists and Turks but we all know with 45 military bases and installations in Turkey and none in Kurdistan , USA needs Turks more then Turks need USA .

You want Russia - Turkish war ?

Why would you want to two nuclear capable nations to go to war ?

Have you got a death wish or something ?

Let me guess , you actually think that it will be piece of cake for Russians to beat the Turks , don't you ?



Do you realise how naively ignorant that thought you seem to entertain is ?

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: 23432

Ukraine is what my eyes are on. Russian intervention elsewhere is simply a distraction. I really think soon there will be an East Ukraine and West Ukraine.

Well if Russia is stupid enough to divide the nation of Ukraine ; it is going to prove again what Russians really do .

I think following a cease fire in Syria ; the forces in Kremlin will look to replace Putin .

lets not forget that Russia cares more about saving Assad than ISIS, a common enemy. Isis can be irrelevant here. US, turkey, Saudis wants Assad out. so essentially its Russia + Syria vs Turkey, SA, US. considering Putin has been expanding into the Ukraine, he'd better pick his battles real carefully before butting heads with 3 powerful opponents, they arent Ukrainians, they will mess Putin up no doubt about it. I dont know what Russia is up to really.

why would Putin want to keep Assad in? is there some kind of cashflow going on behind the scenes? maybe Syria is a Russian satellite? maybe Ukraine and Syiria are key strategic points before Russia makes a move on NATO and the west. to be clear, im not defending turkey or the Saudis at all, but on the topic of removing Assad, im with them.

a reply to: 23432

Saudi Arabia + Qatar are one of the cofounders of ISIS and their main funders. Turkey funds ISIS as well.

How are Turks and Kurds not enemies when the Kurds fight for the independent nation has been going on since the 1920's? And why is Turkey aiming at Kurds on their latest attack?

Since when does turkey have a nuclear weapon? I must have missed the memo.

I see war as the only way for erDOG to stop ruling.

originally posted by: 23432

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: 23432

Ukraine is what my eyes are on. Russian intervention elsewhere is simply a distraction. I really think soon there will be an East Ukraine and West Ukraine.

Well if Russia is stupid enough to divide the nation of Ukraine ; it is going to prove again what Russians really do .

I think following a cease fire in Syria ; the forces in Kremlin will look to replace Putin .

You've hit the nail on the head. Russia keeps silently pushing for an East/West Ukraine. Russia is trying to gather the local support with their campaign against ISIS, but however, I don't think Putin will be going anywhere soon.

a reply to: Vector99

But, there is no eastern and western Ukraine. There's Ukraine and Crimea which is now part of Russia alongside Donbass.

originally posted by: Kapriti
a reply to: daaskapital

The Erdogan government of Turkey is both religious and insane. In that respect they are not that different from the House of Saud save for ethnicity.

The Russians I suspect are simply waiting for provocation from Turkey in order to sweep into Turkey. NATO will not go to war for Erdogan... although the US American Neo-Cons will scream and shout because they want their military-industrial complex to make more money off of engagement in another war.

Very few in the world understand how dangerous Erdogan is. He is not a cartoon character though he often acts like one. Any calculation of engaging the hornet's nest of the Middle East in warfare would have to have the strategic goal of eliminating Erdogan, ISIS, the House of Saud, and the monarchy of Bahrain. Every head must be cut off of the Sunni hydra, and I suspect that this is at the heart of Russian calculations at this time.

I think when Russia starts bombing Turkey, which they will if Turkey keeps this up, then I think according to the NATO pact they have to help defend Turkey, although I agree with you that US will be one of the first to start defending Turkey militarily if Russia goes in.

It is my understanding of the NATO agreement than if one is attacked the rest of NATO countries have to defend. Otherwise the agreement itself is meaningless.

Am I wrong in this understanding here?

originally posted by: Nikola014
a reply to: Vector99

But, there is no eastern and western Ukraine. There's Ukraine and Crimea which is now part of Russia alongside Donbass.

Crimea is a peninsula all their own aside from Ukraine. They were autonomous republic beforehand. Donbass is Ukraine land, so is Lugansk. Russia is trying to change that into east/west Ukraine.

a reply to: Nikola014

Your points are correct. Turkey does not have nuclear weapons of its own, but NATO has nuclear weapons in Turkey. Sheer madness, but such a decision was born of the nightmares of the Cold War. I understand that the Turks do not have actual control over these weapons.

A long time ago I knew some high ranking Turkish officials. They would never have tolerated Erdogan or his party. I suspect that Erdogan's home situation in Turkey is far more fragile than most calculate. A serious engagement with Russia and Erdogan would find the Kurds, the Alevis, and all of the other political, religious, and ethnic minorities within Turkey rising up against him and his government.

originally posted by: Kapriti
a reply to: 727Sky

The House of Saud wanted widespread 'regime change', and the USA did their bidding and continues to be joined at the hip to whatever the Saudi royal family wants. Saudi jets flying from Turkey only increases the likelihood of a very messy encounter with the Russians.

Since the Turks and the House of Saud (together with the Qatari) are the founders and funders of ISIS/ISIL/Daesh (Muslim Brotherhood by any other name), only a true idiot would believe they intend to take down their creation. In all likelihood I expect the Saudis to join the Turks in bombing the non-PKK Kurds (who are fighting ISIS) as well as propping up ISIS wherever the Saudis et. al. can do so.

I agree...

a reply to: vjr1113

Honestly, Russia has the moral upperhand here. Syria was a sovereign nation, and Assad the ruler. The land had religious freedom, Assad had more Christians in his cabinet than Muslims, he was a very liberal Muslim who supported religious freedom. He defended all the minority groups vigorously against the extremist Sunni's, which were the majority in that country.

Morally, Russia is the only one with the upper hand in his defense of Assad. No one else is even close to having a positive moral stance in this, everyone else wants Assad out for their own benefit. He was a staunch defender of Palestinians, and has taken in more refugees than any other middle eastern country from the Palestine - Israel conflict.

These stances of Assad, made him the enemy of the House of Saud and other countries, because he supported the minorities over the extremists, and enemies of Israel and other Christian countries who support Israel, due to his support for Palestine and Palestinians.

So, everyone but Russia and Iran decided he needed to go. Russia and Iran has the moral upper hand. Assad is not wrong for not allowing the extremists to run the country into the ground with their religious edicts.

a reply to: Kitana

You are correct about NATO. But Turkey's membership in NATO was with a secular government in place. There have been great concerns about Erdogan and his religious political party, and I would not be surprised if the NATO countries decided on something clever such as declaring Turkey in breach of NATO protocols so that the treaty would not be engaged.

From what I understand of USA and UK military sentiment, no one wants to support Erdogan and few are regarding NATO as an automatic switch that engages if a NATO nation is invaded. This is of course very worrying to the Baltic nations, but NATO has made it clear that the Baltics are non-negotiable. I think we must remember that Treaties are only as good as the politicians enforcing them. That thought should give all of us pause.

a reply to: Kapriti

The people of Turkey love Erdogan. I talk with them

link

a reply to: Kapriti

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for explaining, and you are correct what you said in your last sentence:

Treaties are only as good as the politicians enforcing them. That thought should give all of us pause.

This is true.

originally posted by: Nikola014
a reply to: 23432

Why would the nations who created ISIS want to destroy them?

I cannot believe there are people who think that in case erDOGan and Saudi Arabia go into Syria they would be against ISIS.

Turkey is fighting Kurds, and Saudi Arabia + Qatar would be fighting alongside their ISIS army.

I wish for Russia vs turkey conflict.

Because they did not create them. Nobody did. ISIS is just Aquida in Iraq joined with Saddams formers officers, Sunni militias and radicals that had once fought beside them in Iraq that has gone back home to Syria with a new name. They have has several new names over the decades from when the first started out as a group in Jordan who wanted to overthrow the King and were chased to Iraq in the late 1990's after killing an American diplomat.

And most Kurds are allied to Turkey, only two groups are hostile. Remember the Kurds are not single group and have often fought other Kurdish factions.