Oregon protest leader Ammon Bundy is arrested, says source

a reply to: MisterSpock

While everyone sits and calls these people criminals and traiters(I must have missed the trial), maybe time will have a way of shedding some light on what really happened.

Thanks, you just laid out what happened, pretty much.

I was wondering if I would have to muddle through another pages long law and order thread to find some nugget of truth, and here it is.

The FBI should be holding a presser any minute. Maybe then we'll begin to have some understanding of what happened (though I won't hold my breath or believe the OS).

originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: MisterSpock

Yes we tend to be more inquisitive on this site delving deeper than what mainstream media offer to report, so maybe give us the benefit of the doubt that we did the same in this news story but found the "occupiers" story wanting.

So you've read this testimony to Congress and found the "occupiers" story wanting?

Threats, Intimidation and Bullying by Federal Land Managing Agencies

And you've read all the links in this thread and found the occupiers story wanting?

And you read about the Oregon congressman calling out the BLM and other fed agencies here and you still found the occupiers story wanting?

I don't believe it. Either you have no idea just how bad these federal agencies are behaving, or you know exactly what they're doing and you condone and support it.

I think it is a very healthy sign that a conspiracy site has members that don't always fall for each and every battle cry, that would make us foolish sheep.

Blaming victims is even worse.

Federal seizure of land is a serious subject and all these boys did was garner support for the feds...

All these boys did was garner your support for the feds and those so inclined already. Some of us have our eyes wide open and know better than to give them a free pass.

a reply to: zazzafrazz

Federal seizure of land is a serious subject and all these boys did was garner support for the feds as their approach was idiotic and self serving, especially given Bundy benefited from federal welfare support.

I suppose you write your congressman letters about it? Or put an x in little boxes on 'voting day' to draw public attention and effect change?

Look up civil disobedience as a method of demonstrating to 'garner attention' when all other avenues for redress of grievances fail.

Obviously these 'self serving idiots' are upset about something enough too make a stand about it. My attention immediately goes to what that is, not what petty crimes they are accused of.

a reply to: Boadicea

I'll quote Phages reply to you in your thread you linked

Wait. Isn't it the cattle ranchers (like Bundy) who are complaining about the abuses of the BLM? Or just the "abuses" that they don't like?

I am all for proper oversight over the BLM and accountability for abuses, however, I am not for Bundy, his practice of taking a half million dollar federal loan from the federal government and then showing up to a Oregon wildlife station and start a circus that got someone killed.

Sue me.

If you read the first posts.
it sounds like the government had a hand in them.
the Only way the People have left is to make a noise.
the police did a Hit on a road, so no one would see it.

the police would never shoot first. would they?

originally posted by: intrptr

I suppose you write your congressman letters about it? Or put an x in little boxes on 'voting day' to draw public attention and effect change?
.

What have you done?

originally posted by: MisterSpock

The odds of this being a traffic stop "gone wrong" are so unbelievably thin that it doesn't even begin to pass the smell test.


They waited for this group to be isolated and away from their supporters, they STAGED a traffic stop..KNOWING full well who was in the car and that there would probably be firearms. It gave them the perfect stage to engage these people while having a nice little story to fall back on(crazy gun people open fire on poor old barney trying to issue a traffic ticket).

.

Just to clear up the confusion you seem to have...

This was not a traffic stop "gone wrong"..

This was a full-on tactical "felony traffic stop" with the intent of arresting those who had Federal and Local warrants out for their arrest.

And yes...when they execute a "felony arrest" traffic stop, knowing full well the occupants are armed they come with overwhelming force...>Swat teams, vests, multiple police and tactical vehicles,..the roads are shut down at both ends..

This keeps both civilians safe (close roads) and the arrestees safer...Leaving little invitation for a shoot-out or resistance when a couple of dozen tactical law enforcement agents and swat surround you.

As for the individual that died (suicide by cop)...he is repeatedly on film and in interviews recently explaining that he would die before spending a single day in a "concrete box"..and explained he knew there was a warrant out for his arrest.

He refused to surrender and was armed...whether he fired -on or drew/aimed his weapon at the officers, we will figure out.

Bundy has said he had his hands-up...but I suspect reality will quickly reconcile that via witnesses etc. No-doubt their is multiple dash-cam video to rely on if it needs to be settled.

originally posted by: Indigo5
As for the individual that died (suicide by cop)...he is repeatedly on film and in interviews recently explaining that he would die before spending a single day in a "concrete box"..
.

Which is somewhat ironic since now he will spend an eternity in a wooden one.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: Indigo5
As for the individual that died (suicide by cop)...he is repeatedly on film and in interviews recently explaining that he would die before spending a single day in a "concrete box"..
.

Which is somewhat ironic since now he will spend an eternity in a wooden one.

And the effen-a-hole, Ammon Bundy...who loves the news cameras much more than "freedom"...who encouraged him and started the whole mess...was likely the first out of the vehicle with his hands up calling don't shoot. LaVoy Finnicum's death is on him...in my very strong opinion.

a reply to: Indigo5

This was a full-on tactical "felony traffic stop" with the intent of arresting those who had Federal and Local warrants out for their arrest.

Haha for trespassing, hail the police state.

Or succumb to a 'hail' of bullets.

You can tell how they are rolling it out for mass consumption, the news report I overhear as I speak just stated and I quote…

"One of the protesters was shot and killed".

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

I'd much rather say he's finally found his true freedom away from this open prison we call life

originally posted by: Discotech
I'd much rather say he's finally found his true freedom away from this open prison we call life

When you are dead you are dead for a long time.


I would prefer to not be dead.

originally posted by: dreamingawake
Link to the LiveSteam YouTube Channel.
Guess the Idaho 3% Percenters were right that it was going to escalate to this.

Well of course, they planned it and started it

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Indigo5

This was a full-on tactical "felony traffic stop" with the intent of arresting those who had Federal and Local warrants out for their arrest.

Haha for trespassing, hail the police state.

Or succumb to a 'hail' of bullets.

You can tell how they are rolling it out for mass consumption, the news report I overhear as I speak just stated and I quote…

"One of the protesters was shot and killed".

For seizing and occupying government buildings and lands with an armed force..

That is not "trespassing"...That is terrorism...and just because you or others might agree with them, makes it no less a terrorist action...do you not think that ISIS has people that agree with their grievances?

Round up a bunch of people with guns and seize and occupy lands with a military force...I stop caring about what you are complaining about.

And "protestor"??? Protestors stop being protestors when they start carrying guns, seizing land and buildings and setting up defenses.

a reply to: intrptr

I have not made comment yet on what happened regarding that poor mans death as I want to get more information, If he was killed without firing then I am upfront in demanding the officers prosecution, but I will wait and see before making claims.

I am horrified that this resulted in someone dying. I can't understand how Bundy can sleep at night knowing he dragged these folk into getting killed. It is text book cult leader stuff, said it from day one, and this ending just solidifies my belief. I saw the writing on the wall on Jan 3 that he or one or more of his followers would end up getting killed.
The guys are just a cult

He may not be wearing jesus sandals and handing out cool aide, different ideology and flag, same cult leader tactics.

a reply to: Indigo5

That is not "trespassing"...That is terrorism..

Actually, under the law it would would not necessarily be so. One requirement for a charge of domestic terrorism would be

(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;

I'm not sure if any of the stupid stuff they did was dangerous to human life.

a reply to: Phage

Yes, and i do agree while these people may have been igmo's they were not terrorists and to try to define them as such is a slippery slope.

originally posted by: zazzafrazz
a reply to: Boadicea

I'll quote Phages reply to you in your thread you linked

Phage: "Wait. Isn't it the cattle ranchers (like Bundy) who are complaining about the abuses of the BLM? Or just the "abuses" that they don't like?"

And I will add the part of Phage's quote that you deliberately omitted:

Phage: "Cut and dried? No. Many issues, many people, many interests. "

I will also quote my reply, which you also conveniently failed to include:

In a direct sense, no, what the Bundys are doing will not help... indirectly, however, it is helping by shining a big fat spotlight on the past and current abuses of the feds, and the inevitable repercussions. I desperately hope and pray that someone somewhere takes this opportunity to offer genuine practical and productive reform measures. I'm sure there are good guys and bad guys on both sides -- both the government agencies and the private sector. I'm also sure that there's collusion between the bad guys in the government agencies and the bad guys in the private sector. I've read enough to question if the current use of these federal lands is really the best use of the land, but I also question their preferred use of the lands, and especially their methods. But before all of the relative and resultant issues can be addressed, we must address/redress/reform the managing agencies.

I am all for proper oversight over the BLM and accountability for abuses, however, I am not for Bundy, his practice of taking a half million dollar federal loan from the federal government and then showing up to a Oregon wildlife station and start a circus that got someone killed.

I'll believe it when I see it. Show me one time -- just one -- where you called out the BLM and the other federal land managing agencies for their bad behavior BEFORE you were called out for ignoring their bad behavior. Walk the walk or it's all B.S. Right now you're just a bully hiding behind even bigger bullies with guns and glorifying their cold blooded murder. Oooooooh...

a reply to: zazzafrazz

Wha..... yeah right..... are they a constitutional cult?

I think not.