Turkey shot down Russian Jet: reportedly by two F16's

originally posted by: Xcathdra
Its a fast moving thread and I did not see your post. Maybe consider that before acting like an ass over missing a post of yours.

Consider that you could be in fact ignoring the question as you were, making of you acting like an ass too.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
Turkey released radar intercepts showing the violation.

It was to be proven also. Nevertheless Russian plain was shoot down in Syria airspace. Do you agree?

Was the Russian airplane a prejudicial to the peace, good order or security of Turkey?

Is it turkey figthing IS / terrorists? If it is, Why did they shot down an partner that is also doing that?

originally posted by: Xcathdra
Turkey violate Greek Airspace more than 1000 times annually, but that seems to be ignored ! Should turkey airplanes been shot down?
Turkish jets violated Greek airspace 1,017 times

And those 2 countries deal with it in their own way.

So you agree with Turkey violating other countries airspace?

originally posted by: asen_y2k
Another English speaking defence forum filled with Arabs and Turks are confirming reports of the downed Russian rescue helicopter. Apparantly it has been downed by Syrian rebels. Sadly I cannot read Arabic or Turkish tweets they are refering to.

Just hearing about this myself.

It's one thing Turkey legally defending itself, but this is something much more serious methinks.

Not sure how legit it is though. Trying to find more info now.

a reply to: C84K2

I think that the angle of descent and crash site could be telling ...

Once established ejection times opposed to rapid 40-30 deg. descent rates are made evident.

a reply to: madmick

Turkish airspace - not a buffer zone.

Exactly how many warnings should russia get? I mean their ambassador to turkey was summoned twice in october over airspace violations.

Putin:

We have been stabbed in the back by associates of terrorism

Just speaking live now!

www.rt.com...

President Putin
"a stab on the back by associates of terrorism"

a reply to: HumanPLC

Speaks volumes.

a reply to: Obi88

Last time i looked Turkey was a key NATO partner. I do agree as to the end of ISIL, but not at the expense of a third world war. Hopefully cooler heads prevail and this incident can be sorted out somewhat amicably.

R.I.P to the poor airman that was killed and hopefully the other airman in question will be returned home unharmed.

So that spat of land which is Turkish airspace of around 2-4km, they got off 10 warnings to the russian plane, and also shot it down in that time. I don't think so. It may have crossed Turkish airspace , but was shot down over Syria. The length of time it was in Turkey doesn't add up to 10 warnings.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: madmick

Turkish airspace - not a buffer zone.

Exactly how many warnings should russia get? I mean their ambassador to turkey was summoned twice in october over airspace violations.

originally posted by: C84K2
Is the area that it went through Turkish airspace within the buffer? How many nations recognize the buffer? This "buffer" could play a key role. I cant upload the google land map I took of the area. Ill try again

Yes, Putin has just said the plane was operating 1 kilometer from Turkish border....That would be within the 5 mile buffer zone Turkey has declared, tho who recognises that is unknown.

a reply to: voyger2

Sounds like he is calling Turkey as Daesh ally ...

Not good ...

That area the Russian plane flew across looks like the Turkish buffer zone created by Turkey and agreed by USA

Just google the buffer zone and it looks the same as the image on the radar

originally posted by: Timely
a reply to: voyger2

Sounds like he is calling Turkey as Daesh ally ...

Not good ...

Oh he most definitely did!

originally posted by: FormOfTheLord

I think we are closer to seeing WW3 with nukes flying, no microwave will be needed for the popcorn. . . .

We can still avoid it, but it needs guts.

The Russians need to get into their stomach, to play to win. If they downplay this, and play their old parlor tricks, to back off and hope to be able to fight another day. The fight is going to follow them to Moscow, where the Nukes will fly. Neither US or Brtain care one hoot for rest of Europe. Their aim, just as Noam Chomasky has said for decades, is to use radical Islam to maintain power over resources. The US will wage war with China, N.Korea, Russia ... eventually. It's a given ...

The only thing Russia can do, is play hard ball. As long as Turkey thinks they can play Turkey, with US up it's hiney ... they'll continue to supply the Rebels and ISIS over their borders. And they'll continue to ferry "terrorist" cells, to Europe. That is what they've done all this time. Turkey to Germany, by way of Greece and the Balkans.

If Russia backs off, they'll lose ... if they intend to win, they'll have to shoot back. They will HAVE TO stop the supply routes. Not just in the media, but in the real world.

In other words, we are heading towards WWIII, unless Russia decides to get tough. The only way for Russia to stop this, it to show the world, that if it continues we'll all die, period.

Without that, neither the US or Britain, will ever back off. And it's just going to escalate, into a greater conflict ... which eventually, will cause the death of multitudes in Europe. Neither US, Britain, Israel or the Arabs will weep over Europe, but the Russians will be dead, just the same.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Rocker2013

And has been stated time and again if Russia doesnt want a war with nato dont violate Turkish airspace. This is all on Russia...

Fair enough, but why isn't there a coalition with Russia to fight ISIS, to avoid this in the first place? Seems pretty juvenile to me. The F-16's were clearly waiting for them, likely on patrol, no reason why Turkey woudn't patrol their skies. There is no way they would have had time to scramble and intercept. The border which Russia may or may not have violated is VERY small. Latakia is what, 40 km at most from Turkey? So, how long would that take to pop into while flying at 900 km/h (max speed is about 1300 km/h for Su-24)? about 2.4 min... depends on which direction they were heading too...into the combat zone or RTB?

So, if they knew this may happen, why would they not take appropriate steps to avoid it? It takes two to tango. I believe Russia had already extended the olive branch to Turkey only for them to decline any sort of agreement to avoid this in the first place. But then they continue their rhetoric of saying that it pisses them off that Russia is constantly violating their airspace. Well, geeeeze Turkey, Russia is only trying to kill the worlds biggest threat since Nazis! What gives? Why not help??? Oh, your likely in on helping ISIS survive and pull all the "infidels" into a war in the ME to make "biblical prophecy" come true? (face palm shaking head)

I'm sure Putin already has a response ready, knowing full well this was likely going to happen at some point or another with Turkey being their usual shady self.

Oh look, a dead Russian pilot...



Good luck NATO - thanks to Turkey, they may have started WW3!!!!

Isn't this the area where WW3 is supposed to start?

originally posted by: voyger2
Consider that you could be in fact ignoring the question as you were, making of you acting like an ass too.

Since you prefer to jump to conclusions.... I dint see your post. Deal with it.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
It was to be proven also. Nevertheless Russian plain was shoot down in Syria airspace. Do you agree?

Only after violating Turkish airspace.. Turkey had every right to respond, just as syria does or russia if a military aircraft violated its airspace.

originally posted by: voyger2
Was the Russian airplane a prejudicial to the peace, good order or security of Turkey?

Yes an armed foreign military aircraft violated their airspace - an incident that comes on the heels of other incidents where russia violated turkish airspace.

As i said if a us aircraft is downed over syria you guys would be making the same argument im making.

originally posted by: voyger2
Is it turkey figthing IS / terrorists? If it is, Why did they shot down an partner that is also doing that?

For the same reason russia would shoot down a foreign military aircraft attacking extremists in Chechnya or Dagestan. It violated their airspace.

originally posted by: voyger2
So you agree with Turkey violating other countries airspace?

I already stated syria is justified shooting down foreign aircraft in their airspace, just as turkey can.

Putin raining down truth about Turkey's complicity with ISIS.

Exactly the point I am trying to get across. Is that buffer zone legal. Does everyone recognise it, especially the russians. If they don't, why not? If they do, why were they in it?

originally posted by: Whereismypassword
That area the Russian plane flew across looks like the Turkish buffer zone created by Turkey and agreed by USA

Just google the buffer zone and it looks the same as the image on the radar

a reply to: Hellas

Massive test of diplomacy needed in 3 - 2 - 1 ...