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ISIS defector explains a key reason why people continue to join the group

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posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 05:53 PM
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originally posted by: IAMTAT
S&F from me, as well.
KEY phrase from your article:
"This is a welfare state."

Who'd a thunk, ISIS were such Progressives? Looks like the Islamic Caliphate is a Socialist state.


It's a Baathist state: socialism without civil rights.

Or, Leninism without atheism and Marxist ideology. The purpose of the government control of work and finance is not because of a Marxist concept of justice that workers deserve to own the means of production, but as a means to ensure loyalty and power in service to the needs of the state.

It's much more medieval and pre-capitalist: the lord of the land ran the economy to serve his power, punish enemies and reward allies.

From this point of view, counterfeit Daesh money and cyber attacks on their payroll system would be a weak point.


edit on 20-11-2015 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-11-2015 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-11-2015 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 06:51 PM
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a reply to: ~Lucidity

The elderly usually stay defiant or go to a refugee camp.



posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 07:31 PM
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a reply to: eisegesis

We always talk about repressed technology. Wouldn't this be the perfect opportunity, to unleash some of that hidden tech?

Forgo oil altogether, and bankrupt ISIS



posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 07:40 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Dr1Akula

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: redhorse

Yea that's all propaganda. Here's the UN's official numbers:


No my friend... you are the one spreading propaganda without knowing it....

Your source speak specifically of Syrians refugees, not all the people that are actually arriving in Europe... (claiming to be refugees)


Are you sure all of those people are Syrian refugees though? They claim to be refugees, but they may not be from Syria. I thought the problem area was Syria? Isn't that where ISIS is supposedly sending its cadre of terrorists to sneak in as terrorists from?

So why should I worry about refugees who come from places other than Syria? It's the Syrian refugees everyone is up in arms about. Worrying about refugees from other countries is moving the goal posts.


As all the fake Syrian passports show ... no one really knows who anyone coming from the ME are or where they are from.


All the fake Syrian passports? What fake Syrian passports are you even talking about?


Obviously you missed all the msm stories about the boxes of fake Syrian passports being seized. Google is your friend. Here's just the top link I found in a matter of seconds.
www.bbc.com...



posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 08:30 PM
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originally posted by: alienjuggalo

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: alienjuggalo



Sounds like a cop out to me.. I am broke boo hoo I guess I will go kill a bunch on innocent people for my 50$.

So are they really any different from the mercenary groups we have here in the states like Blackwater and others?


Yes... I havnt seen one video of a blackwater merc holding up a dead babys head while chanting to Allah..


'Collateral Damage' I think is the phrase the US army use.

While there's no heads on sticks there are plenty of online documentaries showing foot of some coaltion troops chearing about how bug the bomb they just used on a town called Falluja.




US troops cut off the city's water, power and food supplies, condemned as a violation of the Geneva convention by a UN special rapporteur, who accused occupying forces of "using hunger and deprivation of water as a weapon of war against the civilian population". Two-thirds of the city's 300,000 residents fled, many to squatters' camps without basic facilities.

A New York Times reporter “embedded” with US troops described the onslaught: “Just before the marines began to push south into Falluja, the American bombardment intensified, and heavy artillery could be heard pounding positions in or near the city every few minutes. An entire apartment complex was ground to rubble. A train station was obliterated in a hail of 2,000-pound bombs. All electrical power in the city was cut off about 5 p.m.” The account passes over without comment the destruction of an apartment complex and train station—both civilian structures. For the thousands of civilians who remain in Fallujah, there is nowhere to hide from the American blitzkreig. They risk being buried alive by staying in their homes during the unending bombing raids, and if they venture outside they face almost certain death at the hands of American troops and snipers, who have fought their way into the city center




www.theguardian.com...


edit on 20-11-2015 by bastion because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 08:46 PM
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So basically what this is telling us is that ISIS has a bottomless pit of funds rolling in...


Which leads us to the question of "Where could such large amounts of endless funds be coming from ?"

In my mind, the obvious answer to this question would be central banks and transnational corporations since those entities are the main players around the world with neverending funds flowing in on any given day.

These are the same players, folks, who control our economic trends and political dog & pony shows !



And if true, this quite literally means we're fighting a Goliath that's backed by the very people we vote into office (!) and with whom we do day to day business with (!).....




posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 10:22 PM
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a reply to: eisegesis

I added to your collection of stars and flags, but you are slightly misrepresenting the facts. People don't join ISIS to get rich; they join to survive. We're not speaking about Westerners here but about Iraqi and Syrian Sunni Muslims.

Here is an even more insightful article than the one you quote, written by a psychologist who has been interviewing captured ISIS cadres: What I Discovered From Interviewing Imprisoned ISIS Fighters



posted on Nov, 20 2015 @ 10:38 PM
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I've had to do some really f''d up #e to survive this world....ask me for details and I will divulge them. I'm not ashamed. survival is survival.

Crimes against humanity for the sake of an ideology and/or religion are off the table though.

Survival is different from a devotion to an ideology/religion.






edit on 20-11-2015 by MagesticEsoteric because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 01:20 AM
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I can understand the argument that some joined to have an income with which to feed themselves and their families. But that doesn't begin to explain the raping and torture and maiming and murder of countless females, from the elderly to children. Not to mention what we've seen them do to the non-combatant men they capture. There is nothing that can justify that, but survivors have said that the men who raped them claimed the right to under ISIS' interpretation of Islam. Seems to me that a good number of them are insecure opportunists trying to feel big by subjugating defenseless men, women, and children.

And I did read ONE interview with a man who did find the moral fortitude when he looked around and saw what they were doing to females and he realized the rapes and rampant substance abuse were an abomination against Islam and not at all what he signed up for when he was recruited to fight for the glory of Islam. So clearly at least one person was in a position to say no. He had to sneak out and flee for his life, but he found the guts to follow his conscience once he found it again.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 01:32 AM
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a reply to: Aeshma

If such tech exists, they won't waste it on these clowns. Maybe in fifty years time.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 05:50 AM
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a reply to: SheeplFlavoredAgain

I agree; I don't buy it either. And, even if true, it makes the people who sign up for this an even lower form of scum, murderers and rapists...for hire.

Further, I think stories like this are yet another social engineering effort by the terrorist sympathizers (read: liberals) to justify the terrorist's actions and make people feel sorry for them. I call BS; Boo freaking Hoo! "Whoa is me, I live in a #t-hole, breed like a wild rabbit and don't have a job; I've got to feed my "family" so my only, last, choice is to become a murderer, a rapist, killing and raping children like my own, and blow stuff up for a living." No, I see this for what it is; these people sign up because it's a badge of honor and a license to maim and kill with impunity. And, once they start it's like a drug; they can't stop, they're addicted (ideologically or chemically, or both). Equally, it's like joining a street gang; once you're in, you're in for life (else they kill you).

This has little to do with money/survival, and everything to do with POWER...plain and simple.


edit on 11/21/2015 by Flyingclaydisk because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 11:24 AM
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a reply to: eisegesis

Oh that's even better than religion it's a welfare state according to your source. Socialism hits again!!!!!!!



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 11:39 AM
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a reply to: bastion

Someone just told me last nite that money is being taken in trucks driven by civilians but the rules of engagement require us not to hit the trucks cause of one civilian driver so Isis morphs. News last nite said that Isis has grown 80 % just since last year sooooo oh well it's all bushs fault right?



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 11:46 AM
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a reply to: diggindirt
So there you go! They may not be Syrians but as long as you've got a Syrian passport you can get into any western country accepting refugees and do what Isis wills. Wow and CIA and FBI guys on the news telling us they are beating us at our own game an FBI guy said there was no intel because they've learned not to spill on the internet.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 11:48 AM
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a reply to: CranialSponge


Which leads us to the question of "Where could such large amounts of endless funds be coming from ?"


From people who drive cars. The bigger the car, the more you support terrorism. Shocking, but true.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 12:01 PM
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a reply to: avriel
It's probably not worth the effort to explain it to you since you've already made up your mind. No ma and pa didn't inform me about socialism. Pa was too busy hiring guys in the community and getting them trained in skills like arc welding.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: alienjuggalo



Sounds like a cop out to me.. I am broke boo hoo I guess I will go kill a bunch on innocent people for my 50$.

So are they really any different from the mercenary groups we have here in the states like Blackwater and others?



Blackwater is a security contracting company that is subject to the laws of the countries they operate in, they aren't trying to set up their own state. I don't know what video games you've been playing or movies you've been watching, but no matter what you may believe, Security Contractors are not used offensively, they provide security for static locations and other things like convoy and VIP protection, and return fire only when fired upon.

One of your most pathetic attempts at excusing the actions of Muslim Terrorists. I hope no one is paying you for writing such weak propaganda, terrorist shill.
edit on 21-11-2015 by chuck258 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 03:30 PM
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originally posted by: diggindirt

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Dr1Akula

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: redhorse

Yea that's all propaganda. Here's the UN's official numbers:


No my friend... you are the one spreading propaganda without knowing it....

Your source speak specifically of Syrians refugees, not all the people that are actually arriving in Europe... (claiming to be refugees)


Are you sure all of those people are Syrian refugees though? They claim to be refugees, but they may not be from Syria. I thought the problem area was Syria? Isn't that where ISIS is supposedly sending its cadre of terrorists to sneak in as terrorists from?

So why should I worry about refugees who come from places other than Syria? It's the Syrian refugees everyone is up in arms about. Worrying about refugees from other countries is moving the goal posts.


As all the fake Syrian passports show ... no one really knows who anyone coming from the ME are or where they are from.


All the fake Syrian passports? What fake Syrian passports are you even talking about?


Obviously you missed all the msm stories about the boxes of fake Syrian passports being seized. Google is your friend. Here's just the top link I found in a matter of seconds.
www.bbc.com...




Excuse Krazyshot. Like buster2010, I think I'm convinced they are really just Islamist shills. Their heads are completely buried in the sand and they make completelybaseless accusations all the time.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 03:36 PM
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originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
a reply to: diggindirt
So there you go! They may not be Syrians but as long as you've got a Syrian passport you can get into any western country accepting refugees and do what Isis wills. Wow and CIA and FBI guys on the news telling us they are beating us at our own game an FBI guy said there was no intel because they've learned not to spill on the internet.


It is also indicative that these groups plan attacks far in advance. Unlike western peoples, they don't plan on election cycles, they have generational plans for their goals. For males the training begins when they are six years old!
Distribute several hundreds or thousands of fake passports and see if they are recognized. Constantly probing the inefficiencies of our security systems, this has been an on-going operation since at least 1993. It seems that the alphabet agencies can only catch the ones with which they are involved.



posted on Nov, 21 2015 @ 05:41 PM
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originally posted by: redhorse

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: eisegesis

Sounds like they are taking a page from the cartels and what made them so successful.


And the Mongolians and the Romans and on and on... This is stick and carrot behavioral modification at its core. It is how you herd humans (or any animal) in the direction that you want them to go, both figuratively and literally. If you do the "wrong" thing (oppose the caliphate) we will make you suffer, if you do the "right" thing (join the caliphate) we will take care of you and you will prosper.

If I were faced with the choice of watching my children starve or survival well...

Allah Akbar or whatever they want me to say, whoever they want me to shoot, whatever.

Most of you will judge my lack of moral fortitude but at least I'm honest with myself. Most of you would also do the same whether you'll admit it or not.


No. There are a lot of things that are worse than death. Much worse. A rat is a creature/person who will do anything to survive. We are supposed to be better than that.

Is life really that precious? That you'd sacrifice your humanity to live another day, or even 40+ years? Don't hide behind the fact you have kids. Face up to the realization that they are better off dead than to live a life like that? That's no life. Zombified on Captagon, running around destroying everything that's good and peaceful and innocent in the world?

The only way I would join would be to infiltrate and kill as many as I could as soon as I had a chance.




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