Islamophobia, is it even a thing?

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: BlackProject

The term, Islamophobia and its use in terms of accusing someone of being an Islamaphobe, is basically a fabricated concept designed to enforce political correctness. Its applied to a wide range of behaviors and perspectives and it's used to denigrate those who express something less than abject acceptance of the presence of practicing Muslims in civilized Western societies. As is so often with these artificial constructs of the social engineers of Political Correctness, charges of Islamaphobia have become rather laughable except in the sense that they've been picked up by legal systems intent on enforcing Political correctness, which I take to be the case in the UK.

As a result therefore, the use of the term has had the effect of suppressing the exercise of free speech and free expression of heartfelt opinion. Other than that of course, it has no real meaning except as a label used to confound those who object to the importation of Muslims into their communities.

Hear, hear..

here, here..

Hear here..

a reply to: CallYourBluff

Thanks for posting your videos. Videos like this seem to go un-noticed in the media and online media too. I have seen similar videos in the past but not seen those. It does seem like anything that puts aggressive parties in a bad light is hidden from the public eye.

So I appreciate you adding this to this post.

It is becoming more and more obvious that Islam has its foot in the door here and is putting alot of work into keeping its foot their. As they know, life here in the UK is very good and if they loose that footing, they go home. To not much.

originally posted by: BlackProject
However can you say the same for others no, as you said.

You don't get it. I wouldn't even ASK if others would help me. If someone needed my help, I would help. Period.

You do not think about the other side of your own point because you would probably say 'well, I wouldn't expect others to help me, its just how I am' well fine.

No. You're wrong. If I needed help, I would ask for it, and fully expect it. I don't live in a world of fear and suspicion. I live in a world of love and trust. No one has ever denied to help me when I needed it.

Normal American and English citizens do not have their say anymore, as it is garnished with racism or islamophobia. This used to be a clash between black and white, still is obviously but it seems because this has shifted towards a more civilised manner, introduction of another class of beliefs have been introduced into our lives.

I honestly have no idea what you're talking about. We (in the US) have all the rights we've always had. We absolutely can "have our say". You think prejudice against Muslims is any more "civilized" than prejudice against black people??? Both are simply bigotry. You can't justify your bigotry to me. Sorry.

SORRY! but it is. I will put it simply. If I got onto a bus wearing a balaclava, would you trust me? I could be ready to mug you or pull out a gun.

You could mug me or pull out a gun if you were wearing a baseball hat or an Armani suit. Wearing a scarf or a balaclava is NOT bad behavior! You are a perfect example of your thread title. Islamophobia. And this thread proves how real and rampant it is. People who are racist are VERY uncomfortable being called racist... Likewise, the Islamophobic hate being called Islamophobic. Even as every word proves that you are.

It could be you think by wearing a certain material it now puts it in peaceful religious safety but it's not different.

Or, I could just not judge you at all.

The fear of Islam.

The fear of all extremists. However, Islam does seem to be quite problematic at the moment.

In the Middle East, if you are a Shia then you probably have Sunniphobia, and if your a Sunni then it Shiaphobia, what with these two groups butchering each other.

In the West, or the UK specifically, people fear and are cautious of those groups of Muslims who want to destroy our liberal society. Even with moderate Muslims there is an inclination to ignore women's rights, for example, so real concern that societal change will impact on the civil liberties.

As a group there is evidence that Muslims don't integrate well and have problems adapting to liberal societies. In fact, only a small proportion of imans preaching in UK mosques are from the UK, so very little context or understanding of the society they are preaching in. That's hardly good for social integration if the preacher has just flown in from Pakistan.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I do not feel the need to reply once again to your post. Considering it seems you think the world is full of rainbows.

As I tried to put to you, you may see the world in one way but that does not stand for everyone else.

No one took note of Hitler before he came to power and the minority killed the vast majority. My point being, you think because it's a small movement now, it won't grow exponentially in the future. At that point, you'll be wondering why you didn't speak up more but hey! it is not knocking at your front door yet is it so do not worry about it. Cut the grass and sip the kool aid.

a reply to: CallYourBluff

Whoa, that was a really good video, all of them, but the german one, with the delinquency problem was particularly poignant and can cause a couple of tears to fall into the river.. I can't stand thugs;

a reply to: BlackProject

This is actually a really good topic, I just wish you had a different, more serious title somehow..


I would love to ask muslims a few questions..

a reply to: BlackProject

On the contrary, you don't want to respond to Heretic because she nailed your insipid argument to the wall and displayed it for the rank ludicrosity it is.

Oh, and news flash ... not everyone thinks like you do, either.

If such a trite, obvious statement proved anything, all it would prove is that your thread is defunct from the beginning.

Because, after all ... what you're arguing is not what everyone else thinks.

/shrug

In fact, as Heretic pointed out ... the really amusing thing here is that your posts throughout your thread are in fact proving that your premise is utterly flawed.

You're the best argument against what you're trying to argue. LOL

originally posted by: BlackProject
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
As I tried to put to you, you may see the world in one way but that does not stand for everyone else.

(Quoting a favorite mod) "Right back atcha!" Islamophobia is a real thing and you, and a few others in this thread, are up to your necks in it. But as you said, that does not stand for everyone else. I totally understand that there are Islamophobes in the world. I see a lot of them here. And I support your right to be bigoted toward Muslims. I just don't agree with you.

And I'd rather live in my rainbow world than the dark, frightened and hateful place you're coming from. At least rainbows are REAL!

a reply to: Gryphon66

I do not wish to reply as one, what is the point. I already answered. The person replying already has their own mind set on what they think so, grand, go with that. I am not posting here to try change anyones view but to give my view and see what others views are. However it does become a little stupid, to reply to someone who clearly thinks the world is full of sunshine. Just isn't I am afraid.

It seems some people still think that nothing is up with current affairs in both the UK and America. Keep thinking that is all I can say.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

There is a difference however isn't there.

I live a happy life, no hate, no worries. I just see the demise of the future is apparent in both countries.

Some people.

I don't think any immigrant should expect a country to bend their laws or customs to accommodate their religious beliefs. If a business doesn't want Muslim women to wear their head scarves during business hours, they should be expexcted to conform to the wishes of the business owner or find another place of employment that allows it. A business is not a mosque.

The U.S. had cases where Muslim women refuse to remove their head scarves in court. There has also been a case where a women was pulled over for driving a car wearing a burqa! She insisted she be allowed to wear it while driving. The face covering is not only a danger to herself but other drivers. Their head coverings are clearly blocking their peripheral vision.

It should also be illegal for Muslim women to wear head scarves for their drivers license photos. It's clearly covering their full physical characteristics needed by law enforcement. No other American would be allowed to take a drivers license picture with a hat, baseball cap, or scarf on their head.

Would American businesses allow Satanic worshipers to wear their satanic garb? How about gang members wearing their colored bandanas? What about Jewish men wearing their Kippah? Some businesses even frown on having employees displaying tattoos.

So really, why should a country be expected to bend their way of life and laws for someone who didn't like their home country? Yet they move to their current host country and expect the entire country to conform to their personal beliefs and culture!

There is also a genuine concern by westerners that some Muslims may be hiding radical Islam beliefs. It's only human nature to put up your guard when a segment of a population shows violent and murderous traits and beliefs. If the Muslim religion has a record of producing radical Islamists, than people have every right to be genuinely concerned! We're not talking about 2 mentally deranged people over 10 years resorting to suicide bombings. We're talking about thousands of believers who are organized and bent on killing Christians or anyone else who don't follow their fanatical doctrine.

a reply to: BlackProject

Islamophobia is a thing.

One can only be accused of it, when ones opinions about Islam are under informed, and generalised to the point of becoming total nonsense. When someone uses the term terrorist to describe all Muslims, or uses a derogatory term to describe them, or treats Muslims with disrespect or distrust, purely because of their religious beliefs, you have Islamophobia.

Like every idiotic and intellectually invalid mode of phobic thought, Islamophobia relies on the willingness of participants in that attitude, to abandon logic, reason, and goodness, in order to accept the flawed, bigoted hate politics associated with it. I have no time for anyone who wants to engage with that attitude.

The reality of the situation is that unless one is willing to engage with people of differing faiths, ethnic backgrounds, sexualities and genders, on an equal footing and with respect for those individuals as fellow members of the human race, then there is phobic and discriminatory behaviour at work, and that is just not acceptable. It was never acceptable, but in this day and age, it is outright criminal.

Christianophobia is going on like crazy madness everywhere.

Conservativeophobia is also going on like madness.

Phobia is an irrational fear. There is nothing irrational about being leary of a culture with such a barbaric history. They have been barbaric since the seventh century and I have seen nothing indicating they will ever change their ways.

a reply to: BlackProject

Right, you don't have any counter-arguments ... so you want to make non-response seem important and relevant.

Again, your posts are the only proof that anyone needs that your thesis is $#|+.

Congratulations!

originally posted by: Bluntone22
Phobia is an irrational fear. There is nothing irrational about being leary of a culture with such a barbaric history. They have been barbaric since the seventh century and I have seen nothing indicating they will ever change their ways.

Just out of curiosity ... you know this about all 1.57 Billion Muslims?

Wow, and I get accused of making generic statements that are ridiculous ... sheesh!

a reply to: Bluntone22

Barbaric history?

By that token, we should all be deathly afraid of my country, as well as the US, Germany, France, Spain, Russia, China, Japan, Christianity, Taoism, the Greeks, and without a doubt the Italians... I could go on. Every culture and nation which has a history of violence and oppression, by your measure, is a threat.

I call poppycock. People from all of those cultures, and all of those nations, have the capacity to be caring, loving toward other human beings, and fair in their dealings with them. It is also the case that there are others in those cultures and from those places, who do not have the capacity for world encompassing love and respect for all persons and faiths. But to judge any person based on their faith, their creed, their colour, no matter what statistical relevance you falsely believe that information to have, IS phobic, and unsupportable.

Dealing with people as individuals, rather than walking avatars for a demographic one might dislike, is the only legitimate way to conduct oneself where these things are concerned. The reason this has been accepted by reasonable peoples all over the world, is that failure to do so invites the sort of reasonless carnage that haunted the last century, and that attitude and its inevitable outcome has no place in the world in this day and age. It is one thing for the human race to make mistakes, but it should be forced to make new errors, not repeat old ones, ad infinitum, simply because of the closed minded, and under educated waffle of a bigoted minority.

Actually having strong denounciation for theocracy movements is not the same thing as suggesting that all of the ME, Arabic people, if that is another understanding of what is meant by Islam, because to me Islam is a more fundamental ideology. (so like I posted already, it depends on the definition, and many of us are not clear on that). But this is not the same thing as suggesting that that whole region is primitive.

There is a lot of money and arms being spent training up merc's by western powers and corporate powers, to attack countries that are less extremist. To force what used to be a minority hard core cult, down everyone's throat and create a false new type of middle east.

Its not the people doing this, though they may in turn become programmed by it, it seems to be some major bankers and also para military, those who seem to want to consolidate power.

I don't find this beautiful modern unveiled Syrian woman to be primitive or dark ages for example!


#RefugeeCrisis: What The Media Is Hiding, Help #SyrianRefugees Go Home

And the Honor Diaries has put out alot for thought. But then some of their own speakers tell you not to be afraid of being labeled racist for example, because that doesnt hurt you, but not speaking up when sharia or honor issues occur in your country is hurting and killing people cohersed by an increasingly dominant regressive movement.

IMO, that movement is fanned into existance by Western Powers, and its obscene.

Islamophobia is non-existing, we see on a daily basis what this theocratic belief does, what it brings forth, the fruit has many names.
IS, ISIS, al nusra, al qaeda, taliban, hamas, boko haram, muslim brotherhood, hezbollah, al shabaab, and many more names of extremist groups that are less known.
Than there are the islamic countries, they provide us some insight of the true nature of islam, no human rights, brutal punishments, slavery, oppression.

In the last few years in Europe, killings by jihadists, to be against this theocratic belief, even afraid, is anything but irrational.