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Russia Inadvertently Posts Its Casualties In Ukraine: 2,000 Deaths, 3,200 Disabled

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posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 01:15 PM
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Russia Inadvertently Posts Its Casualties In Ukraine: 2,000 Deaths, 3,200 Disabled - Forbes


Russian president Vladimir Putin has decreed that all Russian casualties “in peacetime” be a state secret. In addition to criminal charges arising from divulging state secrets, families risk losing pensions and lump-sum payments if they reveal that their sons were killed in Ukraine. Mothers of soldiers’ associations have been branded “foreign agents” for collecting data on Russian casualties. Dissident Boris Nemtsov was murdered shortly before completing his study of Russian casualties in Ukraine. Russian civil rights organizations, working against the fog of official resistance, could confirm only several hundred battlefield deaths.

Business Life (Delovaya Zhizn) reports on markets, finance, entrepreneurship, finance, and leisure, scarcely an outlet for sensational information. Its innocuously entitled “Increases in Pay for Military in 2015,” however, reveals what appear to be official figures on the number of Russian soldiers killed or made invalids “in eastern Ukraine.” Russian censors quickly removed the offending material but not before it had been webcached by the Ukrainian journal Novy Region (New Region). Here is the “top secret” material the censors removed (my translation):

“Compensation of military personnel taking part in military actions in Ukraine in 2014-2015.” In addition, the Russian government, in a decision about the monetary compensation of military personnel taking part in military action in eastern Ukraine, approved compensation for families of military personnel who were killed taking part in military action in Ukraine of three million rubles (about $50,000). For those who have become invalids during military action, the compensation is one and a half million rubles (about $25,000). A payment of 1,800 rubles is envisioned for contract “fighters” for every day of their presence in the conflict zone. In all, as of February 1, 2015, monetary compensation had been paid to more than 2,000 families of fallen soldiers and to 3,200 military personnel suffering heavy wounds and recognized as invalids (my italics).”

Sovietologists found many secrets of the USSR by digging into the Soviet press and technical and financial trade journals. That fallen and invalided military personnel are compensated must be reflected somewhere in budgets. As reported in Delovaya zhizn, compensation payments for those killed and invalided in Ukraine came to almost twenty million dollars, not a large share of the approximately $50 billion defense budget but large enough to appear in an appropriate budget subcategory.


Click link for remainder of article, including the original Russian article translated and referenced above.


Additional sources -
* - How Many Russian Soldiers Have Died in Ukraine? A Glimpse at the Bloody Toll - Yahoo
* - Archived origional Russian article
* - 'It Is a Government Crime': The Coffins of Russia's Ghost Soldiers In Ukraine Are Coming Home - Vice News Investigation
* - Shh!!! Putin Bans Talking about Dead Russian Troops in Ukraine
* - The Latest - Former Ukraine rebel head starts support group for Russian fighters


An interesting investigation and an even more interesting article with reference to the actual number of dead / injured Russian soldiers. If they are "volunteers" then why is Russia paying for their injuries / deaths? If they are volunteers then why are they, or their families in the event of death, prevented from discussing the situation? Is this something the Kremlin is going to continue to try and keep secret, just like they tried when the USSR invaded Afghanistan? The other question is how far will Putin go to keep his control over Russia? At what point will he turn on the Russian people for demanding answers?

The media outlet who posted the numbers reminds me of the President Human rights Council about the actual voting percentages in the illegal elections in Crimea.

Will these numbers push Putin to find a more heated confrontation with the west in order to distract the Russian people from the lies?

edit on 28-8-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-8-2015 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:00 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Bumping this thread - more people need to see this.


S&F



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:16 PM
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That indicates they not very well trained. That is a lot of casualties for such a small conflict.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:21 PM
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originally posted by: Xeven
That indicates they not very well trained.

Or maybe it actually indicates that they had no business invading Ukraine and Ukraine gave more opposition than expected.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:24 PM
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Isn't it funny that the estimated number of "separatist" casualties is right around 2,000? So does that mean that the Ukrainian military is actually doing twice as well or that there really isn't a separatist army and it's been Russian military this whole time?



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:29 PM
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a reply to: swanne

If Georgia is any indication then we know they're not very well trained. Just look at the composition of their military. Most are conscripts who only serve a year and that includes training.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:33 PM
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originally posted by: Xeven
That indicates they not very well trained. That is a lot of casualties for such a small conflict.


These should be Russia's professional forces and thus best trained. Russians captured have been from elite units like the paratroops. In this case I think it is more that the Russians have been doing the bulk of the fighting while the rebels spend their time robbing and drinking. And on top of that many of those captured claimed they had no idea where they going until they were shoved into the front line. So being thrown in unprepared and doing most of the heavy lifting would take its toll on any units. The problem for the Russian is the pool of well trained men only makes up less than 1/4 of its forces with the rest being almost worthless 1 year conscripts. Rotating enough of those professional troops in, on top of KIA and wounded and keeping its elite units manned for any national emergency is proving very difficult for the Russians. They can not send conscripts in because they would get slaughtered and they just do not have enough professional forces to keep going in Ukraine long term without causing large scale harm to few elite units they have. It is not a good situation for them.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 03:37 PM
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a reply to: Xcalibur254

Yes, indeed. But this is a classic illustration of action/reaction. People generally don't fight back when they agree on something - that high of a death toll means that Russia poked the bear (Ukraine) quite vigorously. No pun intended.

My point is, unlike what some are led to believe, Putin is no angel. Cimeteries have just been filled up with 2,000 proof of this fact.


edit on 28-8-2015 by swanne because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:03 PM
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If these figures are true, then they further confirm that Russian ways of fighting have little consideration for common foot soldier or soldiers in general.

If Russia has been willing to commit its top line soldiers into the battle then it should have provided them with several times of advantages over the adversary. One advantage would have been the air power in the form of old Mig-21s, 23s etc. These would have negated the use of "mad dash" full frontal attacks by the infantry which results in lots of causalities.

Elite or even semi-elite soldiers do not come cheap in terms of training costs.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:05 PM
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a reply to: swanne




Bumping this thread - more people need to see this.


Some will just call it propaganda.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:09 PM
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a reply to: swanne




Or maybe it actually indicates that they had no business invading Ukraine and Ukraine gave more opposition than expected.


I am afraid you just...



Now Putin is unsure what to do it seems.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:13 PM
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a reply to: victor7




If Russia has been willing to commit its top line soldiers into the battle then it should have provided them with several times of advantages over the adversary. One advantage would have been the air power in the form of old Mig-21s, 23s etc.


Hard to do something like that when you are denying backing, and training the separatists.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:14 PM
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originally posted by: victor7
If these figures are true, then they further confirm that Russian ways of fighting have little consideration for common foot soldier or soldiers in general.

If Russia has been willing to commit its top line soldiers into the battle then it should have provided them with several times of advantages over the adversary. One advantage would have been the air power in the form of old Mig-21s, 23s etc. These would have negated the use of "mad dash" full frontal attacks by the infantry which results in lots of causalities.

Elite or even semi-elite soldiers do not come cheap in terms of training costs.


That would be to obvious and Russia could not even pretend to not be involved. It also would likely lead to an escalation from the West who might even start arming Ukraine. Russia is playing this like the normally do but, I think in this case the so called rebels proved to have no interest in fighting so the Russians have had to do far more than they hoped. Russia is just left in a bad spot and with the economic problems this is a conflict that is just going drain money they do not have.

The sad part is the Russian soldiers who are the ones getting screwed over in all of this. Tossed unprepared into a war they have no interest in and then screwed over if the are hurt or killed. It is just wrong.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:31 PM
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a reply to: MrSpad




The sad part is the Russian soldiers who are the ones getting screwed over in all of this. Tossed unprepared into a war they have no interest in and then screwed over if the are hurt or killed. It is just wrong.


That's how it goes when your on Planet Putin...

And it seems he likes partying there...




posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 04:51 PM
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a reply to: MrSpad

Eastern minds spend troops lives in a rediculous fashion,combat wise.
edit on 28-8-2015 by cavtrooper7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 05:31 PM
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originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: victor7




If Russia has been willing to commit its top line soldiers into the battle then it should have provided them with several times of advantages over the adversary. One advantage would have been the air power in the form of old Mig-21s, 23s etc.


Hard to do something like that when you are denying backing, and training the separatists.


Flying worthy Mig-21s are available on internet for $100k a piece, just make a transaction to Kremlin friendly third party which in turn reports them stolen etc. Rest is same deal as denying T-72BMs presence in Ukraine. Even if one is shot down, just deny it and also replace it saying it is the same plane or similar methods.

The other part of the equation would be, NATO will start arming Kiev with more planes to that RuAF can enter the theater officially.

If NATO threatens to use its airpower then some worries but not too much. Since winter last year various reports are coming out proving that Chinese have been detecting and tracking the F-22s from more 400 km range when they fly to bases in Japan and sometimes to S. Korea.

Seems trillions spent on F-22s and F-35s have been upto waste atleast against Russia, China and others who will get their hands on advanced radars that have been shown in recent arms shows by Russia and China. One such is JY-26 which is made by China.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 05:42 PM
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Nvm, somehow ended up on the current cache (google) page that redirects to aug 27.
edit on 28-8-2015 by TheBlacklist because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:52 PM
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What an absolute fail for Putler.



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 06:55 PM
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So how did this business site get this, what is supposed to be, secret information? What are their sources?
edit on 28-8-2015 by TheBlacklist because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2015 @ 08:03 PM
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originally posted by: TheBlacklist
So how did this business site get this, what is supposed to be, secret information? What are their sources?


RT:s explanation is that the site was hacked from Kiev IP address.

www.rt.com...

What I would not give for objective truth instead of propaganda from all sides spinning their lies.




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