5th Planned Parenthood Video Released

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: butcherguy

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: butcherguy

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: butcherguy

What is yours, if you don't mind my asking?

I've posted mine, several times. www.abovetopsecret.com...

Forgive me, but I am having trouble understanding where you draw the line for late term, from the post that you linked.

Perhaps defining terms would help?

Studies and estimates show that "Late term" abortions represent between .08% - 1.4% of abortions.

When is it permitted?

As of December 2014, forty-two states had bans on late-term abortions that were not facially unconstitutional under Roe v. Wade (i.e. banning all abortions) or enjoined by court order.[20] In addition, the Supreme Court in the case of Gonzales v. Carhart ruled that Congress may ban certain late-term abortion techniques, "both previability and postviability".

Eighteen states prohibit abortion after a certain number of weeks' gestation (usually 22 weeks from the last menstrual period).

Ten states (although Florida's enforcement of such laws are under permanent injunction) require a second physician to approve

Thirteen states have laws that require a second physician to be present during late-term abortion procedures in order to treat a fetus if born alive.

The Supreme Court has held that bans must include exceptions for threats to the woman's life, physical health, and mental health, but four states allow late-term abortions only when the woman's life is at risk; four allow them when the woman's life or physical health is at risk, but use a definition of health that pro-choice organizations believe is impermissibly narrow.

en.wikipedia.org...

I gave the member my cut-off line of 26 weeks.
I was looking for theirs.
That is all.

Mine is 22 weeks absent a compelling argument. I am "pro-life" and "pro-choice". I am not convinced that life exists prior to the second trimester. I base this on the miscarriage rate aka spontaneous abortions aka abortions by nature/god..moving from 75% in the first couple weeks to less than 1% after the 22 week mark...to actually putting the mothers life at risk at time of delivery. IMO it speaks to Nature/God weighing in on when life begins.

Your late term comes at an earlier time than my late term.
We should fight about it.... just kidding, of course.
We have common ground in that I too am pro-choice up until late term.

Now we're taking cartoons seriously? LOL...All well and good...until somebody up and draws a cartoon of Muhammad.

"How are the mighty fallen in the midst of the battle!"

a reply to: grandmakdw

I find it interesting that you project my abhorrence of late term abortion into
me supporting things you assume I would agree with. Haven't you learned
what happens when you assume something about someone?

I find it interesting that you're continuing to spout the same things over and over and never took the time to address the vast assumptions you made specifically about me.

You're welcome to have your opinion and I respect that, but don't be a hypocrite.

originally posted by: IAMTAT

Now we're taking cartoons seriously? LOL...All well and good...until somebody up and draws a cartoon of Muhammad.

"How are the mighty fallen in the midst of the battle!"

I bet Muhammad's Mother was Pro-Life.

a reply to: butcherguy

I heard that directly from a woman that had a very late term abortion.

How late is very late? Elective abortion is legal before viability, usually around 22-24 weeks. If a fetal anomaly is found, the fetus may NEVER be considered "viable".

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: IAMTAT

Now we're taking cartoons seriously? LOL...All well and good...until somebody up and draws a cartoon of Muhammad.

"How are the mighty fallen in the midst of the battle!"

I bet Muhammad's Mother was Pro-Life.

I'll bet she wasn't.

Reminds of the Joke:

"And Jesus said, "Let them who are without sin cast the first stone.............Oh, no! MOM!"

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Glad you pointed out the issue of morality because likewise I viewed the cartoon posted as a cheap shot at moralizing the issue from the other side of the argument - its equally irrelevant to the question of law breaking by PP.

The issue is going to be harder and harder for PP and its supporters to defend as I understand the yet to be released videos get worse and worse for PP's claims that its not breaking current federal and various states laws.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: butcherguy

I heard that directly from a woman that had a very late term abortion.

How late is very late? Elective abortion is legal before viability, usually around 22-24 weeks. If a fetal anomaly is found, the fetus may NEVER be considered "viable".

She was approximately one month from her due date.

originally posted by: Phoenix
a reply to: Krazysh0t
The issue is going to be harder and harder for PP and its supporters to defend as I understand the yet to be released videos get worse and worse for PP's claims that its not breaking current federal and various states laws.

They are on video 5 now and the ease of defending PP hasn't changed in the slightest. Every single video is obviously heavily edited to position a message that isn't happening. Plus, none of them can be submitted to a court of law. So even if they DID have damning evidence in them, no prosecution could ever use them to convict PP. So I'm pretty sure that even after the remaining 7 or so videos are released, it will still be JUST as easy to dismiss those videos as sensationalist propaganda and slander.

I mean you DO know that if Center for Medical Progress were REALLY trying to whistleblow a REAL breaking of the law, they should have released those videos (unedited) STRAIGHT to the police and no one else right? Then the police can go through them without outside bias tainting their perceptions and then conduct their own investigation. But nope, they instead opted to release them publicly which all but guarantees that they are completely worthless as far as legal evidence goes.

a reply to: butcherguy

No (ethical) doctor in the USA would abort a 9 month old fetus because the mom was mad at her "baby daddy". That doesn't mean that "she" didn't do something to harm herself, and/or her fetus to force an abortion.

People will never cease to amaze me in the stupid things they do out of desperation. A member here, "Bones75" (?), told the story of how his very pregnant (ex)wife held a knife to her belly, threatening to kill her fetus, while they were have an argument. I'm not condoning that, just saying, it happens.

a reply to: introvert

that's the thing,
investigating this on both sides would be in the best interest. then we'd know the answer of weather or not it was legal...and well, after we know that, we, as a nation can decide weather those laws need to be changed, enforced better, or well maybe we would find that the rewards that are being offered is worth what many see as a inhumanity.
this shouldn't be a discussion about abortion, abortion is, it will always be, it has always been.
there has been a few state investigations into planned parenthood over these videos and they found nothing illegal occurred which to me kind of means that the problem if there is one, is the laws. not with abortions.

but, the fact that they jumped right to "let's defund planned parenthood" kind of gives away their intentions to me.
you have a group that seems to have broken quit a few laws in getting these tapes.... not much being said about that although I believe both california and the federal gov't have opened up criminal investigations to find out what laws were broken.
you have business that are playing middle men between the abortion clinics and researchers and at least one of them was founded by someone who has connections with the republican speaker of the house.
and all the arrows are aimed at planned parenthood, a non profit organization that quit frankly abortions are a tiny part of the services they provide.

you don't like abortions, find, don't have one, but don't be surprised if somewhere on your life's journey you don't find an abortion as being the best alternative among the many alternatives you have to chose from for yourself or wife or daughter.

want to do away with late term abortions, well just keep in mind, a portion of them are done because fetal anomalies have been found. and well, caring for these babies will more than likely increase the healthcare costs (and probably your taxes) quite a bit!!

a reply to: dawnstar

I can agree with what you posted.

Well said.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Then Sir, you've mistaken who I am and what I'd like.

Laws need to be upheld, no more crony saving.

Nobody should be above the law.

I too tire of the 'mummified' brains of a growing number of the population. Tire of the closed-door deals, special interests getting special treatment.

By the way, if the country keeps going this way, the movie Idiocracy seems to come to mind...maybe that's their intended blue print?

a reply to: grandmakdw

Yes I find this killing to be as abhorrent as killing babies over 24 weeks, killing on average 9,000 of them per year in the US.

But not as abhorrent as killing babies at 18 weeks?

originally posted by: BlackboxInquiry
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Then Sir, you've mistaken who I am and what I'd like.

I haven't mistaken anything about you because I wasn't even talking to you originally for the post that you responded to me for. I'm just explaining why I seem so edgy about this topic since you asked.

Laws need to be upheld, no more crony saving.

Nobody should be above the law.

I too tire of the 'mummified' brains of a growing number of the population. Tire of the closed-door deals, special interests getting special treatment.

By the way, if the country keeps going this way, the movie Idiocracy seems to come to mind...maybe that's their intended blue print?

The problem I have with comparing society to satires that are trying to predict the direction society is going in such as Idiocracy, Robocop, or even 1984 is that real life tends to play out much differently by the time the years being shown in the movies are reached.

Many of the times, we focus on all the idiots, but neglect the fact that there are still tons of smart people out there inventing new things and keeping society going. It's just that the dumbest are usually the loudest.

Though, don't get me wrong, I think satire is one of the most intelligent forms of comedy and really can highlight the unmentioned hypocrisies in society at large. It's just that they aren't SUPPOSED to be used to predict the future. Even the ones based in the future.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

You have my respect and applause Sir.

New Hampshire defunds Planned Parenthood of Northern New England:

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Travel with over a $1000 cash get stopped cops many times seize it, small business daily cash sales on 3 days were 9900 and charged for structuring whole foods sells milk whole milk store is shut down with a swat team raid , an Amish dairyman same thing. Clinic 1 Dr under investigation for scrips / favors whole clinic lost the right to prescribe pain killers. You read about these all the time . All deprive people of rights. Its NOT uncommon.

You mean you have never seen where a well connected person or group received preferential treatment by courts and governmental agencies ?

If you cant see the gulf between political connected and regular citizens. I dont know what to say .

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: butcherguy

No (ethical) doctor in the USA would abort a 9 month old fetus because the mom was mad at her "baby daddy". That doesn't mean that "she" didn't do something to harm herself, and/or her fetus to force an abortion.

People will never cease to amaze me in the stupid things they do out of desperation. A member here, "Bones75" (?), told the story of how his very pregnant (ex)wife held a knife to her belly, threatening to kill her fetus, while they were have an argument. I'm not condoning that, just saying, it happens.

No ethical doctor would, but then we have people like Dr. Kermit Gosnell that operated abortion clinics since 1972 in Philadelphia and he was far from ethical. He was not a board certified obstetrician or gynecologist but was charging $1,600-$2,000 per abortion. It took a woman's death to bring charges against him in 2011.
So the guys that do it are out there.
Here are some links to the story:
CNN
Wikipedia: Kermit Gosnell

Girl age 15, accompanied by relative (1998): said to have told Gosnell she changed her mind about the abortion once inside the practice. Gosnell allegedly got upset, ripped off the patient's clothing, and forcibly restrained her. The patient later stated that Gosnell told her "This is the same care that I would give to my own daughter." She regained consciousness 12 hours later at her aunt's home, the abortion having been completed against her will.

Abortions are legal, yet we have cases like this 15 year old girl.
Lack of oversight is blamed in numerous write-ups about the case.

originally posted by: Lostinthedarkness
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Travel with over a $1000 cash get stopped cops many times seize it, small business daily cash sales on 3 days were 9900 and charged for structuring whole foods sells milk whole milk store is shut down with a swat team raid , an Amish dairyman same thing. Clinic 1 Dr under investigation for scrips / favors whole clinic lost the right to prescribe pain killers. You read about these all the time . All deprive people of rights. Its NOT uncommon.

These are all anecdotes and don't prove anything by themselves. All it shows is that, if true, SOME people have their rights deprived. You need to show, statistically, how widespread this issue is. For all I know, those are just a few police districts that do that and most other police districts don't do it.

You mean you have never seen where a well connected person or group received preferential treatment by courts and governmental agencies ?

I never said that doesn't happen.

If you cant see the gulf between political connected and regular citizens. I dont know what to say .

Don't invent arguments from me.