Just because it's natural doesn't make it right.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

BELIEVERpriest, you don’t know it yet, but you will.

In spirit there is no man nor woman, just us. We are, all of us, born over and over again, sometimes as physical male sometimes as physical female. When we switch as we often do, we have a consciousness misaligned with our bodies, it take a while to adjust.

it is not a sin, it is an opportunity to grow from the bigotry we experience. You are playing your part as was intended. You will experience the same bigotry when it is your turn. Learn your lesson well my friend. Once you do, you will be closer to your God.

Love is everything regardless.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: windword
Discrimination is not a violation of freedom (unless implimented by the government).

But stripping someone of freedom of marriage, due to discrimination of gender identity or sexual orientation is fine?

Discrimination is implemented by the government when actions are taken place.

"The EEOC has held that discrimination against an individual because that person is transgender (also known as gender identity discrimination) is discrimination because of sex and therefore is covered under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. See Macy v. Department of Justice, EEOC Appeal No. 0120120821 (April 20, 2012), www.eeoc.gov... The Commission has also found that claims by lesbian, gay, and bisexual individuals alleging sex-stereotyping state a sex discrimination claim under Title VII. See Veretto v. U.S. Postal Service, EEOC Appeal No. 0120110873 (July 1, 2011), www.eeoc.gov...; Castello v. U.S. Postal Service, EEOC Request No. 0520110649 (Dec. 20, 2011), www.eeoc.gov..."

a reply to: Ghost147

Look, I agree, under the Constitution, homosexuals and polygamists should be able to marry. I dont morally support that, but the Constitution is not a moral codex.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Ghost147

So you must then also agree that it is within a persons religious rights and freedom to kill a person who rejects the verdict of a priest 

No. Because in an equal liberty society, murder is an obstruction to another individual's liberty.

Are you not an obstruction to LGBTiQ+ people's liberty?

a reply to: JadeStar

Ok. So tell me how I'm abstructing your liberty. You arent entitled to my respect. So you can't say that my offending you is an obstruction of your rights.

You made the accusation, now you back it up.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

That's good It's nice to see

But could you answer my previous question?

....So you must then also agree that it is within a persons religious rights and freedom to kill a person who rejects the verdict of a priest

(Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT) anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel.

a reply to: Ghost147

Already answered that. You must have missed it.

Like I said the OT Law was a moral codex but constitutional law is an equal liberties codex.

Murder, rape, theft, etc are all obstructions of Costitutional rights. Now, I do view murder, rape, and theft as immoral, but clearly, groups like ISIS dont.

So, in an equal liberty society, you are free to do what you will (including discrimination) as long as you do not obstruct another individual's liberty. Cake is not a right.

Yes, I did miss it. And I see what you mean.

But aren't you forgetting about the anti-discrimination laws enacted by federal, state and local governments. The entire United States is covered by the Federal Civil Rights Act of 1964. Which prohibits discrimination by privately owned places of public accommodation.

a reply to: Ghost147

I knew that would come up. That law is unconstitutional. It violates the very founding principle of the Bill of Rights. Please understand, I'm don't consider myself to be racist. I'm latino, and I've experienced my fair share of racism, but it's not right to force someone who hates me to serve me. It only makes them hate me more.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: JadeStar

Ok. So tell me how I'm abstructing your liberty. You arent entitled to my respect. So you can't say that my offending you is an obstruction of your rights.

You made the accusation, now you back it up.

I don't understand. Why wouldn't you respect me? What have I done to you?

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Ghost147

I knew that would come up. That law is unconstitutional. It violates the very founding principle of the Bill of Rights. Please understand, I'm don't consider myself to be racist. I'm latino, and I've experienced my fair share of racism, but it's not right to force someone who hates me to serve me. It only makes them hate me more.

So then we go back to restaurants divided up by race, sexual orientation, etc? No thanks.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Ghost147

I knew that would come up. That law is unconstitutional.

So you are admitting that it is a law, and that your previously posted statement that the baker did not commit any unlawful act is incorrect?

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: JadeStar

Ok. So tell me how I'm abstructing your liberty. You arent entitled to my respect. So you can't say that my offending you is an obstruction of your rights.

You made the accusation, now you back it up.

I don't understand. Why wouldn't you respect me? What have I done to you?

I respect JadeStars gorgeousness! (among other things, such as her levelheadedness, open mindedness, logical reasoning, and most definitely her patience)

a reply to: JadeStar
I do respect you. I dont support you, but I respect you. But that doesn't mean I HAVE TO respect you.

Do you understand?

We all have freedom to speak, freedom to associate, freedom to offend, freedom to discriminate, but not the freedom to obstruct another's basic freedom. And I have not obstructed any of your liberties.

originally posted by: Ghost147

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Ghost147

I knew that would come up. That law is unconstitutional.

So you are admitting that it is a law, and that your previously posted statement that the baker did not commit any unlawful act is incorrect?

Not at all. The Constitution states that our rights are inalienable. So any good judge would realize that and recognize that the Civil Right Act of 1964 has no power....but, thats our (in)justice system for ya.

A good judge would have thrown the Wedding cake case out.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Ghost147

Look, I agree, under the Constitution, homosexuals and polygamists should be able to marry. I dont morally support that, but the Constitution is not a moral codex.

Neither is the old testament.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: JadeStar

freedom to discriminate,

Not according to God you don't. Maybe live those teachings instead of just thinking you do.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

I do respect you. I dont support you, but I respect you. But that doesn't mean I HAVE TO respect you.

Lip service.

Nothing more.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Darth_Prime

I will believe what I want. Its my right. Thats my point.

I would seem that you do.

Total silence on the Luke verses I posted I notice. Jesus commands all of us to play nice with each other.

I think you'll find that if you stop condemning and stop discriminating that goodwill will be established with the Gay community. I am powerless to do anything about bigger Christian VS issues like Atheism, but the average gay person will view you like the average straight person does if you just all back down and stop with the 'I'm Chrisitan and be damned if I'll bake a homosexual a cake' kind of crap

You know and we know what the bible says on the matter of homosexuality, it's been thrashed out over and over to the point of being beyond repetitive. However we're stuck with no choice with our sexuality, we have to live with it every breathing moment of our adult lives. We're just ordinary people trying to do the best with the hand we have been dealt in life.

Taking the high moral ground and belittling us at every possible turn is just not on. Jesus says and and so do I. And by belittling, I mean discriminating.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
Today its the LGBT doctrine. Tomorrow it will be pedophilia, gang rape and murder. Its not a social rights issue. Its order vesus lawlessness.

Your belief in God has blinded to you to reason.....no surprise there!

You are , like all of us, nothing more than an ape with a big brain. Some big brained apes have difficulty in understanding the world and invent mythical creatures (God) to help them.

All big brained apes use a thing called the law to allow us to live in harmony with one another. The basic premise of the law is as follows:

Do what you damn well please as long as it does not prevent anyone else from doing what they damn well please.

The law merely clarifies this for stupid people! The above also helps to identify laws invented to suppress people rather than help them live in harmony. I'm sure your bookshelf is full of them!