Alien conflicts

Look, in a nutshel....


I am in an unpopular position on this forum (but I've never been one to try to win popularity contests).

I have no reason to believe that the Earth is the only home to intelligent life in our Galaxy. There are too many great places where we'd probably be as comfortable as we are now if not more so and there are plenty of forms of life which exist in very alien-like places on Earth.

So I believe based on extrapolation of gathered astronomical data that life exists on other worlds in our galaxy. However that's a long way from believing intelligent life is common, and that such life would come to Earth out of 60 to 200 billion planets.


So believers especially ones who have bought into "The Core Story" call me a skeptic. And people in academia would look at me a little strangely for even considering that there might be anything of value in studying UFOlogy.

I am here because if and when we really DO find aliens of any type, from microbes up to a Type 3 civilization, then much of the average person in the street's ideas about aliens will unfortunately have come from often bad sci-fi, the UFO field and the bizarre characters who inhabit it.

I am a disciple of Dr. Peter A Sturrock.

But yeah, UFOlogy took a big hit again with the "Roswell Slides" but that's why peer-review and the scientific method exist to avoid big hits like that. It's not perfect but its light years better than anything going on in UFOlogy these days.

UFOlogy is entertainment, not science and I have ample data in support of that assertion.

originally posted by: JackHill

PEOPLE with MEMORIES about alien visitations recur to people like Jacobs because, basically, NO ONE else would. Not the government, not the 'scientific community', no one.

Hotel room amateur plastic surgery is also ill-advised, but people still do it. That doesn't make the procedure legitimate.

a reply to: JadeStar

Did you read the links Zeta just brought to explain abductions?

Do you understand that these 'theories' are not even close to explain a vast amount of abduction scenarios?

Again, WHY do you choose to IGNORE the information available on the subject? Is that responsible? Don't you think that people like the Hills, for instance, DISERVED a better treat, specially from the scientific community, to explain WHAT happened to them? False memories? Induced memories? And if no theory fits at all, then, blatant lies? Simply insulting.

'Science' should step up and FIND the answers, or at least, try. Not to ridicule or minimize the experiencies and the experiencers.

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: JackHill

PEOPLE with MEMORIES about alien visitations recur to people like Jacobs because, basically, NO ONE else would. Not the government, not the 'scientific community', no one.

Hotel room amateur plastic surgery is also ill-advised, but people still do it. That doesn't make the procedure legitimate.

They arrive with the knowledge of their experiencies. Many of them never went through any 'hypnosis session' at all.

Oh yes, false memories, hallucinations... but:

'Hey dad you know I think I have this crazy dream, because obviously can't be real right? I mean, little big headed things entering my room, you know... I just mention it because believe it felt so real'

'Hey son, guess what, I had the same dream, I remember basically the same things, damn! It felt so real'

Houston, we have a problem!

I believe in the interdimensional alien theory. I think these aliens correspond with our traditional beliefs of demons and angels. In other words, some are evil and some are good. I also believe that the evil ones are more aggressive and active, while the good ones are more passive but shining the good influence on us.

The evil aliens are subject to the rules of the higher good aliens. Why else are they restrained? Why do they not pour their wrath upon us in its full measure instead of taking potshots?

Look at the book of job and attribute the devil to the bad aliens and god to the good aliens and you will know what I mean.

originally posted by: JadeStar
But yeah, UFOlogy took a big hit again with the "Roswell Slides" but that's why peer-review and the scientific method exist to avoid big hits like that. It's not perfect but its light years better than anything going on in UFOlogy these days.

UFOlogy is entertainment, not science and I have ample data in support of that assertion.

UFOlogy is about some people making money, so they are not interested in peer review, or science - Just think, if peer review was done on this recent Roswell slide fiasco, how could they have made money on it. Even getting someone in to look over what they actually had would have stopped it dead, with things like the readable label on the mummy slide!

But they were not interested in doing that at all.

originally posted by: JackHill
a reply to: ZetaRediculian

So, they don't.

Thanks for clarifying it to all of us.

Multiple witnesses, same/very similar memories, external witnesses, body marks corroborating memories, physical traces on the surroundings, UFO's sightings around.

False memory would account for all of those things. It takes some time to read and learn about it outside of ufology to see how it works. There is plenty of research to back it up. Which is why there doesn't seem to be anyone willing to look into abductions more. And guys like me who are willing to give it a fair shake are basically shunned for...what? understanding how things like false memory fit? Guys like Hopkins and Jacobs muddied the waters. It will be a while before things settle.

If you want to believe the ancient alien people, they claim/imagine/exaggerate/wildly speculate that ancient textsfrom india describe alien conflict.

Certainly if multiple alien groups were visiting us, and they are anything like us, conflict almost defiantly ensued = )

originally posted by: Scdfa

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: Scdfa
You show me one exobiologist who has uncovered as much information about aliens as Budd Hopkins did. And he was an abstract artist by profession, for god's sake.

You're in college, where some people fail science.

I would have guessed standup comedian... Apparently some people fail at that too.

Budd Hopkins? The art guy who hypnotized people and fed them leading questions? Didn't he hang out with that David Jacobs weirdo?

Yep. Captain panties.

The sad thing about David Jacobs is he could have got all the used panties he wanted out of vending machines in Japan.

I guess that's why we never hear about Japanese UFO abduction researchers.... too busy at the vending machines

Anyway, back on track.. the only "Alien Conflict" I see is conflict between people who have a need to believe that the Aliens are here on Earth and those who say "prove it".

No, jade, the sad thing is that Dr. David Jacobs, who you so scientifically refer to as captain panties, has also revealed more information about aliens than ANY scientist or "exobiologist".

That's the "sad thing".

The sad thing about David Jacobs was his creepy sessions with his "patients". A chastity belt? Really?


Do you even know who Emma Woods was?

What about Stan Romanek? I guess he knows more about Aliens than any astrobiologist too right?

Funny how these guys have serious credibility issues usually dealing with weird sex stuff...

originally posted by: ZetaRediculian

originally posted by: JackHill
a reply to: ZetaRediculian

So, they don't.

Thanks for clarifying it to all of us.

Multiple witnesses, same/very similar memories, external witnesses, body marks corroborating memories, physical traces on the surroundings, UFO's sightings around.

False memory would account for all of those things. It takes some time to read and learn about it outside of ufology to see how it works.

Did you even read what I posted?

Multiple witnesses, same/very similar memories, external witnesses, body marks corroborating memories, physical traces on the surroundings, UFO's sightings around.

Please, try again. Falses memories? Now you're just being insulting, or simply trolling. Bring to the table COHERENT theories and we shall discuss.

a reply to: JackHill

Oh yes, false memories, hallucinations... but:

'Hey dad you know I think I have this crazy dream, because obviously can't be real right? I mean, little big headed things entering my room, you know... I just mention it because believe it felt so real'

'Hey son, guess what, I had the same dream, I remember basically the same things, damn! It felt so real'

Houston, we have a problem!

There is a problem with the scenario you just described and that is it is exactly one way a false memory could be created. It doesn't mean it was false, it means that you cant rule it out. I am going to stop before the rotten tomatoes start flying.

Ha! I guess I was too late. Obviously we wont get anywhere!

Multiple witnesses, same/very similar memories, external witnesses, body marks corroborating memories, physical traces on the surroundings, UFO's sightings around

Oh yes, the lump everything together as if its a fact method. False memories, hallucinations, misperceptions, hoaxes, things not actually being true that are in some stupid book by Hopkins. Or am I supposed to be like "oh gee, you really baffled all of science by listing things that have been listed before on the internet".

Please, try again. Falses memories? Now you're just being insulting, or simply trolling. Bring to the table COHERENT theories and we shall discuss.

Enjoy those stars you will get for being obnoxious to me. you've earned them

originally posted by: JackHill
a reply to: JadeStar

Did you read the links Zeta just brought to explain abductions?

Yes and I've found their line of reasoning and methodology sound. I would love to see something on the other side as sound but its hard to do that if you're going to insinuate or jump to the conclusion that extraterrestrials are behind these people's often traumatic experiences.

Do you understand that these 'theories' are not even close to explain a vast amount of abduction scenarios?

There's nothing wrong with the theories if they fit the vast majority of the data. Please explain how they do not. Maybe I missed something?

Again, WHY do you choose to IGNORE the information available on the subject?

I don't.

It's BECAUSE I am HIGHLY familiar with the subject matter that it doesn't pass the logical hurdle which would lead me to conclude the ETH is the best fit. Read the threads I authored and linked below if you think I've ignored things.

Its a bad assumption that those who are critical of people who promote UFOs and evidence of extraterrestrial visitation aren't familiar with the stories and cases. It's often because they are that they are skeptical. Check out a blog called "The UFO Trail" written by a former UFO believer and MUFON guy along those lines...

Is that responsible?

Yes. Absolutely.

Rationality, deductive reasoning, testing information through one's own research outside of the internet or a book is ALWAYS responsible.

Don't you think that people like the Hills, for instance, DISERVED a better treat, specially from the scientific community, to explain WHAT happened to them?

First of all no one deserves anything on the basis of a story alone. Let's be serious and save the drama and emotional appeal for the next TV UFO "Documentary".

The Hill case had a perfect storm of things which could be scientifically tested - ie: The Star Map, the spots on the car, the spots on Betty's dress, Barney's shoes.

The Hill case is a bit special in that it did receive a lot of scrutiny from the scientific community as a result of having this level of potentially corroborating evidence.

The star map was debated between Terence Dickinson and Carl Sagan in Astronomy Magazine! I have a copy of the whole thing which I sought out (its kinda rare):



THAT'S what is missing from UFOlogy these days. It's all entertainment today. A travelling side show circuit. MUFON spends more on its magazine and story telling yearly meeting than actual research and investigation:





Now.....ask yourself why the Hill case stands apart from the other abduction tales when it came to sparking such a debate and if you use logic then naturally you should conclude it is due to the amount of available testable evidence associated with it!

Most abductees these days just have dreams, out of body experiences and/or are never witnessed being abducted by anyone.

Sounds like so much b.s. to me OR ANY OTHER PHYSICAL SCIENTIST.

The Hill case most certainly was not B.S. but it is far from anything conclusive which would confirm the Extraterrestrial Hypothesis. It's an interesting case which science got involved in investigating.

I am most familiar with the star map and you can find much of my research into it right on this very forum. I have done a ton of research into Marjorie Fish the woman who assembled by hand something like 17 scale models of our local stellar neighborhood before finding a suitable match.

Ms. Fish was a skeptic but an open minded one who decided to test the story using astronomical data. That's science. Years later she reiterated that she was a skeptic.

There is NOTHING wrong with scientific skepticism when facing an unknown. This is the hallmark of any fruitful line of inquiry or research tbh.

I also requested and received copies of things from the Hill Collection at the University of New Hampshire which has helped aid my research.

Additionally, I have discussed and debated it with Stanton T. Friedman recently. He sent me 3 autographed books (one autographed by Betty Hill's niece, Kathleen Marden) as a result of our private email discussions:



I told him what I'll tell you. In my opinion the map is inconclusive awaiting further data from NASA's 2017 mission called TESS and the James Webb Space Telescope.

False memories? Induced memories? And if no theory fits at all, then, blatant lies? Simply insulting.

I never mentioned this with regard to the Hill case, as I said, it's special in that many of the details they did not need hypnosis to remember and those are things which drove them to see Dr. Leo Sprinkle.

Are you familiar with the opinion of Dr. Leo Sprinkle, the psychologist they were seeing on the session? He didn't believe they were abducted by extraterrestrials but they did undergo trauma. Why?

'Science' should step up and FIND the answers, or at least, try.

Bring science something better than just a good story with nothing of substance and we will. The Hill Case proved science will get involved when there is something it can test.

Anecdotal evidence is useless to science. Bring us physical evidence or even information like the star map which supposedly describes places in the galaxy "we both share" but is unknown to science at the moment but can be tested today or in the near future.

I'd love an abductee to say, "yeah the aliens said they live on a planet around a star we know as Gliese- XYZ and their planet is the 2nd one, it's year is this many Earth days long and its day is this many Earth hours long."

But we don't get that do we? If we have please point me to it. Instead, we get nonsense about "evil reptilians from Draco" and "blonde-haired space brothers from the Pleiades" (presumably after conveniently moving from Venus when our science proved Venus was a hell hole).

Please, that crap deserves ridicule if for nothing else than it fails basic astronomy.

BTW: I've authored these thread. I think you might find them well researched and of interestL

The Hill Star Map and Exoplanets - Part 2: Analysis and NASA's Exo-S Mission (VIDEO)

The Hill Star Map and Exoplanets

SEE ALSO:

Origin of the Species: The Greys - An Astrobiological Analysis of a Familiar ET Stereotype

Origin of the Species: Rise of the Reptilian Alien Mythos and Its Unlikely Source

UFOs of the Future: Will these aircraft be mistaken for "Alien Ships" in the years to come?


And PLEASE and kindly let this be THE LAST TIME you, Scdfa or any other true believers on ATS accuse me of not examining the evidence to conclude that based on the 6 years of research i've done in ADDITION to my academic studies is downright disrespectful and quite ignorant of what i'm about

a reply to: JadeStar

Additionally, I have discussed and debated it with Stanton T. Friedman recently. He sent me 3 autographed books (one autographed by Betty Hill's niece, Kathleen Marden) as a result of our private email discussions:

I am glad you were able to engage him in a real discussion. Did you destroy him . It actually restores some of my lost faith in him. That's good news. And of course, If I disagreed with you on some aspects of the Hill case, that wouldn't make us mortal enemies either resulting in you saying I shouldn't conceive or something, would it?

originally posted by: JadeStar


So I believe based on extrapolation of gathered astronomical data that life exists on other worlds in our galaxy. However that's a long way from believing intelligent life is common, and that such life would come to Earth out of 60 to 200 billion planets.

Who's to say that this intelligent life hasn't found any other planets worthy of exploration like Earth? For all we know, this "life", which could consist of varying species, could have discovered or even seeded and colonized planets numbering in the hundreds to thousands.

I am here because if and when we really DO find aliens of any type, from microbes up to a Type 3 civilization, then much of the average person in the street's ideas about aliens will unfortunately have come from often bad sci-fi, the UFO field and the bizarre characters who inhabit it.

Nothing wrong with approaching and confirming the matter from your scientific approach but what's so bad about it coming from the ufo field? Especially with finding a type 3 civilization, it would substantiate what many ufologists and researchers have been saying all along. It might even turn out that governments, intelligence agencies, and the highest power structures on Earth knew about it for decades (which is strongly suspected) and some of that technological knowledge of other higher level civilizations was incorporated into this sci-fi throughout the years. Sci-fi deemed unreal and impossible due to limited earth standards and incomplete understandings of reality as we currently know it.

But yeah, UFOlogy took a big hit again with the "Roswell Slides" but that's why peer-review and the scientific method exist to avoid big hits like that. It's not perfect but its light years better than anything going on in UFOlogy these days.

UFOlogy is entertainment, not science and I have ample data in support of that assertion.

Ufology didn't take a hit with that. Not in the sense that anyone with even moderate level intelligence knows that any ploy such as that, whether preconceived hoax or authentically genuine, is going to be prone to extreme criticism due to the high deception factor involved with photographic evidence. That's no matter how you slice it. Anyone who had any thoughts on that being the smoking gun variety type of evidence should really be ashamed of themselves from the beginning.

Oh... and I'll take that ufology entertainment over boring scientific statistical data and peer journals.
As far as the possibility of otherworldly life being a reality, constant discussion of organisms only in micro stages seems so monotonous. The science part concerning the existence and visitation of extraterrestrials doesn't mean much to those already in support of the ETH. Upon confirming the reality, it would only serve as backup to those who were not intuitively deficient, but rather proficient at examining everything brought to the table over the past 8 decades (and even beyond that if you count ancient history). There is a big picture being painted for those who can do the aforementioned. The time has come for that picture to be revealed instead of being continuously denied. After the revelation, your scientific data may be of more importance to me. I may want to know the specifics of ET's home planet/star system and what makes it tick. I'll be sure to give you a holla if we're still around when the time comes.

originally posted by: JadeStar
Origin of the Species: Rise of the Reptilian Alien Mythos and Its Unlikely Source

I see you link this thread often but I don't think it's a good idea to continue that because it can be seen that member DazDaKing completed dismembered your entire premise there.

The same physical laws govern the entire universe and that's been widely proven so its not likely "they" would have some separate physics, they would be working with and around the same physical laws we work with and around, just with better technology.

Pardon me but I am curious. You say that our law of physics have been proven to govern the entire universe. How exactly has that been proven when we are barely out of the solar system?? Last time I checked the universe was an immense place and considering we know so little about our own little briar's patch of woods, don't you think that's a rather arrogant statement to make?

en.wikipedia.org...

www.youtube.com...


i think this may interest you ?

originally posted by: JackHill

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: draknoir2

originally posted by: Scdfa
You show me one exobiologist who has uncovered as much information about aliens as Budd Hopkins did. And he was an abstract artist by profession, for god's sake.

You're in college, where some people fail science.

I would have guessed standup comedian... Apparently some people fail at that too.

Budd Hopkins? The art guy who hypnotized people and fed them leading questions? Didn't he hang out with that David Jacobs weirdo?

You miss the point, again. People with MEMORIES about ALIEN encounters contact people like Jacobs, not the other way around. It's not like Jacobs go from place to place hypnotyzing folks as a magician and implanting 'memories' at will to make some bucks from it.

Save your breath. Disinformation can pretend to be anyone.

a reply to: JadeStar

What you say is right although now most of the planets population have a camera with them the quality of ufo images has not got better, with digital we get exif data giving time,date,focal length,aperture shutter speed iso sometimes even EXACT location if the gps is on, there are a few threads on here were people have been shown to be wrong re their claims because of that. Then when an image is posted through ufo sites 99% of the time the picture has NO exif data how convenient !

Next distance and time many people on here refer to Drakes equation which is a guesstimate using guesstimated factors then they quite happily quote figs of 200 billion Earth like planets in our Galaxy etc if ANY part of the equation is actually ZERO that causes a problem. As I said distance and time the farthest part of our Galaxy is around 75,000 light years from us the chances of even 2 races developing at a close enough distance that one will have the ability to visit the other is very very slim.

We then have claims of a few tens of races close by to us supposedly documented (by who) that visit here often named after the constellation they are from, now you and I know how constellations work obviously some on here don't. I have no doubt out there at some point there has to be other life it's a numbers thing BUT I don't think Mog from Zog takes day trips to Earth and I don't think he ever has. I would love to see proof that's why I joined here I was told I would see and hear of things I hadn't elsewhere have I, not really.

If I saw a video or picture on here that proved the existence of other life I would back it 100% , I look at pictures & video from a photographers point of view there are MANY of us on here some professional others keen amateurs like myself (35 years) many of us are also keen astronomers/astrophotographers we even have our own thread for any reading this that haven't seen it Members Astrophotography

We have members on that thread all over this pale blue dot many with pro grade equipment we are all used to looking at the sky DAY & NIGHT yet with all the man hours spent on producing images on that thread we never seem to get Mog from Zog.

We also have members on here that claim multiple sightings or even that they know when they will appear YET when challenge to produce evidence they always have a convenient excuse why they can't I wonder why.

Now we also have threads showing images from the past of statues etc that don't look human and that is used as possible proof but again man has a great imagination in China an eclipse was thought to be a dragon eating the Sun is it!
Artists always have been creative & still are even in modern times Crying Girl Anyone know a girl who looks like that!

So alien conflicts is kind of a moot point when we have NO definitive evidence of Aliens to start with.

originally posted by: TrueMessiah

originally posted by: JadeStar
Origin of the Species: Rise of the Reptilian Alien Mythos and Its Unlikely Source

I see you link this thread often but I don't think it's a good idea to continue that because it can be seen that member DazDaKing completed dismembered your entire premise there.

Care to point out where exactly said 'dismemberment' occurred? I saw nothing in that members' post(s) that negated that threads' premise....