Putting an 18 year old into 120k debt should be considered criminal

I'm talking about the totality of the cost of education all the way down to the 700$ a month for a largely overinflated half room rent in a college area.

originally posted by: onequestion
Something isn't right here. Education NEEDS to be and SHOULD be free for everyone. This is one of the most limiting factors in the growth if this nation.

Except that isn't realistic.

One of the most limiting factors is people expecting things for free and not being willing to sacrifice and do whatever it takes to succeed. I interviewed some kid earlier this week who was in his 20s. Nice big phone , fancy clothes. When asked if he was willing to work overnight to start he bluntly stated "no because that would impact with his social life" . That's a much a bigger problem then people choosing to continue education because they think it will better their standing.

originally posted by: TonyBravada
Sorry, I went to school for 4 years of college and I only wound up about $9k in debt. I did 2 years at community college where my 4.0 got me a substantial scholarship to Drexel University (was ticketed at about $26k/year when I graduated). Whatever you are doing to get $120k in debt is your own and your parent's stupidity. My brother ended up with about $350k of debt, after Medical School... A majority of that has been paid off in 4 years by working at state funded clinics (really crappy job) which have tuition reimbursement.

Fine, your 18 year old doesn't know better... you, the parent, should.

There are so many options... you can go to a community college, which WILL be FULLY paid for if your parents are low income. Many state schools are still very affordable as well.

You honestly expect all parents to be market experts like yourself?
sorry but most people take the advice of the school counselers.

a reply to: opethPA

Your problem is you only see the "self" and not the communal factor in the success of a society or nation. It is OUR responsibility to ensure the success of every American.

THAT will bring us a bright future, THAT will bring us prosperity not just economically but on a humanitarian level.

Aside from prodigies we all go to uni/college about 20ish. I took a detour through marriage but got there later. The thing about higher education is that it becomes incumbent on the individual to perform for the money they pay. Up until then society pays. Cool. Would a tax payer want to fund High High School? Where the ADULTS(over 18) have little to no stake in it? Just like high school? I don't think that would fly. As an adult one has to take responsibility.

Nowadays it cost about $20000 or more per year to go to college. This includes tuition, rent, food, other necessities, such as the cost of an automobile and a little entertainment. That's about $120K for a Master's degree. Many students have to work, as well as borrow for college. Many parents won't support their kids through college because they either can't or won't afford it. I don't see the $120K figure all that high as far as the cost of college.

a reply to: onequestion

look heres the deal.....

You cant tell me that 18 yr olds these days cant use GOOGLE.......

You cant tell me that they cant stop and spend half a day looking at the markets for the fields they are interested in, how much on average it is to get the degree, and even where the best place to move AFTER college is to get a job in their chosen field for the best wages....

hell they can look up to see what the best party college is but they cant research that?

Give me a break

dbl

a reply to: eManym

This 120k debt is what's stifling creativity and innovation in the workforce.

It forces students to find jobs when that 120k should be getting used to fund entrepreneurial ventures.

I HAVE ANGLES

Pivots and footwork buddy learned that boxing

a reply to: onequestion

Well Onequestion, since you see the problem, what are you going to do to fix it? What qualifications do you have to steer the world into the right direction?

Or do you want the rest of us to fix it for you? So you can coast in your non-job as per your other thread...

Wait 10 years and you might grow up enough to see that the real world issues do not revolve around your neighbourhood block.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: opethPA

Your problem is you only see the "self" and not the communal factor in the success of a society or nation. It is OUR responsibility to ensure the success of every American.

THAT will bring us a bright future, THAT will bring us prosperity not just economically but on a humanitarian level.

And here we go. THAT is the problem.

According to YOU it's up to EVERYONE ELSE to ensure that other's succeed.

THIS is what has been wrong for a very long time now.

No one wants to take personal responsibility anymore.

The younger generation is all about "gimme gimme gimme gimme". They don't want to work for it. They don't want to be responsible for it.

They simply expect for it to be handed to them. They expect others to take care of them. They expect others to pay for everything.

And when it happens? It fails. It always fails.

The world won't die with a bang.....nor will it die with a whimper.

It will die with the words: "I'm Entitled."

originally posted by: intrepid
OK. Let's see if I got this straight. I went to university on student loans. I paid off those student loans and now you want MY tax dollars to pay for YOUR education? Have I got that right?

Let me see if I got this right, my father wasn't abusive but because my mother was I should be upset if my kid gets mad when I abuse them?

For some context.

At one time, attending and receiving higher education was not such a widespread thing, only a few made it into the prestigious institutions and the cost was totally covered by the church, who used their influence to gain influence by peddling influence. Eventually learning institutions detached themselves from the church and the age of enlightenment came.

School became more popular but took a left turn somewhere down the road. At one time it was about making sure everyone had a chance to learn, that someone could be anything they put their minds too, but what we have now is just a large machine spinning cogs and grinding students through those cogs for the purpose of act, but not an act of purpose.

History of University.

In conclusion, university should not put someone into years of debt, a year, maybe, max. The better educated your population and workforce is the more productive they can be, or at least have the potential. That pays itself back more than tuition cost and probably would, if people were learning anything in school.

What were the costs to students?
The Charity School was funded largely by donations and benefit entertainments. The Academy and College depended partly on donations and lotteries, but primarily on tuition and other fees collected from students and their sponsors. For most of the eighteenth century, tuition costs were four pounds per year. Later in the century, student fees included not just an admission fee, but also a charge for firewood.

www.archives.upenn.edu...

They say tuition was about 20 shillings a year, when a live in servant made 100 pounds a year, so it seems like a student could fund their education by saving money, which is a weird concept today I know.

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: opethPA

Your problem is you only see the "self" and not the communal factor in the success of a society or nation. It is OUR responsibility to ensure the success of every American.

Ah right..My problem is being realistic and not following up with some vaguely sounding Matrix like dialogue.

it is not my responsibility to carry anyone just like I expect no one to carry me. If someone wants to be successful in whatever field they choose then they will do everything they can to make it. Sometimes that pays off, sometimes it doesn't.

originally posted by: xuenchen
Maybe these dead-beat bust-out loser college graduates should join the military?

20 years gets the pension, and a free education too.

originally posted by: theMediator
Yeah let's further the global elite in conquering the rest of the planet!
Great idea there. -_-

Sounds like you might be one of the educated victims.

The military could easily adapt.

Those loans, I tell you! They have magnetic properties between a pen, paper, and late teenagers. Their voodoo magic will FORCE you to sign your own debt-slavishness.

Hehe, it's just not honest to use the word, "force" here. Do your own thing. Go into a trade, become an entreprenuer, try out a local community college your first two years, get a scholarship. So many options.

Options overload!!

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: onequestion
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask

Umm I agree with this poster because he's right.

I'm right.

There's no mindset to this thread.

Education should be free and would benefit the entire planet period.

That's the mindset. period.

no you BELIEVE youre right, that doesnt make it so.......

it would be nice if education was free, but its NOT......

And because its not, people need to take responsibility forthe debt they incur and stop expecting other people to pay for it.

If you want to get a higher education and be a grown up, then take on the grown up responsibility , that means when you take out loans then you pay them off......

If you decide to major in something where you cant get good pay, then whose fault is that

Maybe I missed something but I haven't seen anyone suggest that student loan debts should be paid by the government.

What is being debated are the out-of-control costs of higher education and the lack of government support to keep costs down. Keep people from being buried in debt in the first place... that should be the goal. I also haven't seen anyone suggest that additional taxes should be taken to make this possible... merely that existing tax dollars are used more wisely to help remedy the problem. College hasn't always been this expensive... it's a relatively recent problem.

I'm glad your chosen field worked out for you but there are students who choose a field that's great when they enter college and dries up by the time they graduate. There are also students who research their major thoroughly and the information available paints a rosy picture that isn't realistic. The issue is, with no job experience, they don't know the difference. This isn't a matter of "personal responsibility", it's a matter of misrepresentation and outright lies told to young people.

I graduated college debt free and did not spend anywhere near 120k. No one is forcing people to do that. In fact, I would have MADE $15k-$20k getting my Master's at the University I got my Bachelor's had I not moved.

a reply to: xuenchen
People who went to college instead of the military, which will pay for a good chunk of college, probably have a problem with killing the brown people dujour for the government. How much better off would the US be if they diverted even 1/4 of the war budget to education? That wouldn't help the agenda of the rich pukes that run our government though, so it will never happen. Sure, you could go to war, then go to college, if you live through it, and come through it sane.

originally posted by: jhn7537

originally posted by: tavi45
The education itself is worthless. Basically a college degree says you're willing to pay money to prove that you're willing to be obedient. Out of my family of more than 200 people I'm universally considered the smartest but yet I have the least "education" of anyone. This is due to seeing through the bull# early.

The education itself it worthless? Really??? I learned plenty over the course of 4 years, did I learn $35k's worth a year? Hard to say, but to say the education is worthless is just silly in my opinion. The cost is silly... The idea that you need it to perform a job is silly... But the education one can obtain from a quality school is not silly...

I enjoyed my time at my undergrad, I networked with many brilliant minds who have helped me both academially and professionally speaking... Unfortunately today, you need a degree (most times) to even secure an interview (for a corporate job)...

Yeah I totally agree with that...Especially with science degrees. So you did a 4 year home study program in chemistry? Are you ready to come into the lab and use the mass spectrometer? No, because they cost too much and you never touched one, because you didn't do lab time in a school.

So you gave yourself a home MD. Ready to do surgery? No. Because you never had access to cadavers to practice on or experience assisting real surgeons because you didn't go to med school.

So you did 4 years study in computer science. Ready to release your new algorithm? You have a better shot here, but still the answer is no, because you didn't have access to the journals you needed to read (too much at $30 each) to know if your new algorithm is actually new, or the mass server farms to test it on.

Colleges represent RESOURCES that you just don't have access to if you don't go.

a reply to: Answer

See what I wrote above about why college is so grossly over-inflated.

Get the government out of subsidizing it to make it "affordable," costs will come down again.