Where will Disclosure Come From?

@ OP

Disclosure is no longer necessary. Social media and CGI provides all that is needed to discredit any supposed pictures of Classified vehicles. You can simply flood various social media with hoaxes to discredit any legitimate imagery. Photo shopped docs to discredit any possible leaks, and the use of subcontractors to thwart FOIA requests. Where there is strategic advantage there is every reason to suppress the truth and perpetuate misinformation and disinformation. Even if another country contradicts US claims (China?) similar tactics would be employed to cast doubt upon the claim. IMO.

a reply to: Degradation33

This dynamic you outline does not fly,simply because we can lay technology down in historic layers and then on top of that lay the hoaxers and cgi productions and see the timeline and evolution of all technologys used to create fakes.

There is ample evidence that existed prior to CGI,and we can go back until we encapsulate any one technology being used to create fakes to seperate the fakes from the real images by in fact as ironic as it seems using the forward tech to proof things.

1000000 pictures hold not water compared to ten schoolkids building anti-gravitic toys in their Shop Classes in school.

It is actually preposterous to claim that the many thousands of clear and definable Anti-grvitic craft pictures have been faked.

Without overstating the obvious a round vanilla-pie Anti-gravitic craft is not exactly hi-end science fiction type of imagination,in fact it is as far removed from what Humanitys imagination could of or would have concieved as per known technology,which is WHERE OUR IMAGINATIONS CATALYSE.

You see we "imagine" things unavoidably connected to that which we already know,this is the basis of reverse extrapolation and reverse engineering.

Reverse engineering takes you back down the tangible mechanical records,reverse-extrapolation takes you down the cerebral path of history with equal accuracy.

If you break the natural sequential chain of data connections you stop the cohesive reverse engineering or extrapolating process,one DOES NOT need to know the EXACT cause of the disconnect immediatly but it will ALWAYS be discovered upon review because this is a PROCESS with a beginning and an end.

a reply to: one4all

I wish I could agree, but public sentiment has very short memory and shelf life, and once "discredited" so shall it remain, even when it is illogical. I agree some of the best evidence exists before CGI was commonplace, and there is a chain of evidence that dates back decades. While i feel there is some very compelling evidence, I believe the old fallback of the weak cover story and outright denial will not change any time soon. As long as there is someone there (and there are many) to accept the skeptical viewpoint and believe what their told at face value they will hold firm.

It's a trillion dollar industry that depends on secrecy, if only for technological supremacy. Any public admission would not be to their financial benefit. Civilian oversight is never conducive to uninhibited spending. Even when thousands get the objects on camera, from multiple angles, in a mass sighting they don't back down. There will always remain too much "reasonable doubt" in public sentiment to change tactics, even when that sentiment is the minority. It's too easy to claim fake, however absurd.

In any case I'd be very surprised to ever see disclosure.

originally posted by: Degradation33
a reply to: one4all

I wish I could agree, but public sentiment has very short memory and shelf life, and once "discredited" so shall it remain, even when it is illogical. I agree some of the best evidence exists before CGI was commonplace, and there is a chain of evidence that dates back decades. While i feel there is some very compelling evidence, I believe the old fallback of the weak cover story and outright denial will not change any time soon. As long as there is someone there (and there are many) to accept the skeptical viewpoint and believe what their told at face value they will hold firm.

It's a trillion dollar industry that depends on secrecy, if only for technological supremacy. Any public admission would not be to their financial benefit. Civilian oversight is never conducive to uninhibited spending. Even when thousands get the objects on camera, from multiple angles, in a mass sighting they don't back down. There will always remain too much "reasonable doubt" in public sentiment to change tactics, even when that sentiment is the minority. It's too easy to claim fake, however absurd.

In any case I'd be very surprised to ever see disclosure.

Yes, once there is even a shadow of doubt the case is severely weakened and the shadow lingers. The debunkers know this.

originally posted by: Degradation33
a reply to: one4all

In any case I'd be very surprised to ever see disclosure.

If aliens were here, they wouldn't need government permission to show themselves. So why haven't they? Nobody seems to be able to answer that one.

a reply to: kauskau

the way I read what you were saying seemed to imply the government has disclosed aliens in the past and we have a precedent to go by when thinking about future disclosure on aliens. so you are actually just assuming they will disclose when public pressure gets high enough? how high does it have to get and what kind of pressure are we talking about?

a reply to: Rob48

you can't try and think for the aliens. who knows why they do (or don't do) what they do? Have you entertained the thought maybe THEY are the government?

a reply to: bottleslingguy

well i think right now it is just impossible that pressure gets high.

But i think when something like the phoenix lights incident would happen again ....people would react differently than back in the day... Tv Stations would not have a chance to make fun about it..


More people would sign this: www.facebook.com...


More people would reasearch....and the next big incident would make people not believe anymore that the government does not know anything.

More people would reasearch....and the next big incident would make people not believe anymore that the government does not know anything.

The really scary part is that 'maybe' the only thing that needs to be disclosed is 'that the government does not know anything'.

Just watched this movie on YouTube [I'll post the link its free to watch] listed as Sci-fi but realistically showing what people believe the government does when UFO incident causes 'problems' - Its done documentary style and some believe it is based on a real incident. Its a little dated [1974] but stars Glenn Ford and very, very believable!

"The Disappearance of Flight 412" - Full Movie w/ Glenn Ford
See full movie here:
www.youtube.com...

originally posted by: Rob48

originally posted by: Degradation33
a reply to: one4all

In any case I'd be very surprised to ever see disclosure.

If aliens were here, they wouldn't need government permission to show themselves. So why haven't they? Nobody seems to be able to answer that one.

Either there aren't ET's coming here, or if there are, then it's their intentional choice not to reveal themselves. If they've interacted in secret with governments it's also possible that ET credibly threatened governments against disclosure.

If you believe in a cover-up, perhaps that's the reason for its virulence. What if, completely honestly, it actually was for our own good? I don't want to face a million ticked-off Klingon stormtroopers.

a reply to: kauskau
ok fine so are you talking about pressure like an "arab spring" or "occupy wall street" activity? We all group together getting pepper sprayed as we chant "DISCLOSURE NOW!!!" kinda thing? Personally I think the real kind of pressure that will make the most change without needing any acquiescence from the government is in our minds. We don't need to wait for the government to give us a nod. Why should we trust them anyway? I say get ahead of the curve and start believing now so you can eventually wrap your head around just the idea they are there and here already. I really don't see this as some crescendo event like you see on tv with everybody being convinced at the same time. I see it as gradual and cumulative. An even t like you describe is where you will get the panic and suicides and other negative things. Maybe that's why the aliens are so elusive? They probably realize how herd like we tend to be and don't want to start a stampede.

I think that have disclosure now but most folks just do not believe what is being told because it is so far over their head.

Listen to the YouTube report given by the retired CIA officer that is just 17 minutes long.

Richard Dolan was able to interview this officer before his passing away and place the video on You Tube.

If that is not disclosure I don't know what is...

originally posted by: waltwillis
I think that have disclosure now but most folks just do not believe what is being told because it is so far over their head.

Listen to the YouTube report given by the retired CIA officer that is just 17 minutes long.

Richard Dolan was able to interview this officer before his passing away and place the video on You Tube.

If that is not disclosure I don't know what is...

Oh wow, an anonymous person who claims to be a retired CIA officer. Yeah, I'm conviced! I could pretend to be a retired CIA officer and claim that the CIA were keeping thousand-acre fields of pink unicorns in Louisiana.

Why does the mention of the word "aliens" switch on the gullibility gene in such a chunk of the population?

originally posted by: Rob48

originally posted by: Degradation33
a reply to: one4all

In any case I'd be very surprised to ever see disclosure.

If aliens were here, they wouldn't need government permission to show themselves. So why haven't they? Nobody seems to be able to answer that one.

Non disclosure serves the alien's purpose. You are correct in saying that they don't need the government for disclosure. They can do it themselves any day of the week.

The alien modus operandi is secrecy or semi secrecy; they want some to believe and want some in doubt. By way of their antics in the sky they have divided humanity into three groups with regard to belief in ET; atheists, agnostics and believers.

All this is being engineered by them so they can filter out the useful servants from the generality of mankind.

a reply to: Rob48

advanced beings see us in a holistic way.
when we have a government which suppresses us...there are tendencies in us which we suppress as Beings..

And they will watch us until we are grown enough to be our own government.
Than they will come....they don´t see us as separated as we are.. Or in other words: they see our separation. And therefore they know that as long as we are not accepting even our own differences on this little blue planet..many people would run screaming with guns towards them...

They dont want to force us to know of their existence. They want us to evolve freely. Thats why there are people on this planet already who know for a fact that ET exists..but can not prove it to others..

Before we are mature enough we would just mean work to them because they would need to teach us on the most fundamental basic things.
(which btw they do via channeling..but i know only a few believe that to be true)

I don't want to spoil anyone's fun and I too often speculate about a benign advanced race of ETs who one day, when they think we have reached a high enough level of civilization, will come down and enlighten us to their advanced science and engineering. BUT how do you know this? - sounds like religious faith - hope you are right. BUT to date we have no indication we are dealing with friendly beings. The abductions, if true, hardly sound friendly - and how about the cattle mutilations and also the people who have disappeared without a trace? The dark side here is that we may be dealing with a carnivorous race that is experimenting with the porper recipe 'to serve man' - the hypothetical aliens from an old Twilight Zone episode - 'To Serve Man' turns out to be a cookbook!

originally posted by: AlienView
I don't want to spoil anyone's fun and I too often speculate about a benign advanced race of ETs who one day, when they think we have reached a high enough level of civilization, will come down and enlighten us to their advanced science and engineering. BUT how do you know this? - sounds like religious faith - hope you are right. BUT to date we have no indication we are dealing with friendly beings. The abductions, if true, hardly sound friendly - and how about the cattle mutilations and also the people who have disappeared without a trace? The dark side here is that we may be dealing with a carnivorous race that is experimenting with the porper recipe 'to serve man' - the hypothetical aliens from an old Twilight Zone episode - 'To Serve Man' turns out to be a cookbook!

If they were that advanced that they can travel the stars they probably don't need to go to other planets for dinner.

After all even we have things like lab grown meat, 3D printing, etc.

We know a lot more today than they did when that 50s Sci-Fi was made.

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: AlienView
I don't want to spoil anyone's fun and I too often speculate about a benign advanced race of ETs who one day, when they think we have reached a high enough level of civilization, will come down and enlighten us to their advanced science and engineering. BUT how do you know this? - sounds like religious faith - hope you are right. BUT to date we have no indication we are dealing with friendly beings. The abductions, if true, hardly sound friendly - and how about the cattle mutilations and also the people who have disappeared without a trace? The dark side here is that we may be dealing with a carnivorous race that is experimenting with the porper recipe 'to serve man' - the hypothetical aliens from an old Twilight Zone episode - 'To Serve Man' turns out to be a cookbook!

If they were that advanced that they can travel the stars they probably don't need to go to other planets for dinner.

After all even we have things like lab grown meat, 3D printing, etc.

We know a lot more today than they did when that 50s Sci-Fi was made.

I would tend to agree but when dealing with hypothetical entities all scenarios should be considered. Most might think thet an advanced cibilization would be more civilized and not so barbaric - But consider some of the 'so-called' advanced human civilizations of the past and even the not so distant past - the Nazis for example - super good war machine - what if the first alien race we run into has a Nazi like mentality? And what if they are like the mythical 'insectoid' type alien - insect like; Like the parasitical bugs that feed on man here on Earth, you would have to consider what an alien race of insectoids might do - Man aesthetically might be very ugly to them - but still might taste good and may supply nutritional sustenance. One should consider that maybe, just maybe, Stephen Hawking is right, maybe we don't really want to meet them. [I know they will find us eventually anyway so keep the bug spray handy!]

I think the question everyone should be asking themselves is what exactly would change for you PERSONALLY if you were told by elected officials that there are extraterrestrials?

Would your life suddenly get better?

Would you suddenly expect these beings to want to communicate with you?

Would you become a better human being?

I don't think any of you really know what you are fighting for. If the governments came out and told you that extraterrestrials were real nothing would change, you'd say "I knew it!" and then go to bed and wake up the next morning with something else to complain about. That's just being realistic.

originally posted by: AlienView
I would tend to agree but when dealing with hypothetical entities all scenarios should be considered. Most might think thet an advanced cibilization would be more civilized and not so barbaric - But consider some of the 'so-called' advanced human civilizations of the past and even the not so distant past - the Nazis for example - super good war machine - what if the first alien race we run into has a Nazi like mentality? And what if they are like the mythical 'insectoid' type alien - insect like; Like the parasitical bugs that feed on man here on Earth, you would have to consider what an alien race of insectoids might do - Man aesthetically might be very ugly to them - but still might taste good and may supply nutritional sustenance.

The problem is that you are anthropomorphizing aliens. Aliens will probably be nothing like us. Advanced aliens which can travel the stars even less like us.

Here's why..

We've been confined to a planet with limited resources. Most of human history's conflicts have had to do with these limits. ie: land, natural resources, labor, etc.



There are billions of planets like Earth in the Galaxy. Most won't be inhabited. Therefore if one has the technology to travel the stars then they probably don't need to come to Earth for any resource.

Furthermore...

If you can build starships you can build robots so....no need for biological slaves.

If you can build starships you can make lab meat so..... no need for eating other sentient beings

If you can build starships you likely have figured out how to avoid costly conflicts which waste resources destroying things rather than building starships.

So it all boils down to ;ogic. The same logic that leads to technology which may lead to starships.

As for Stephen Hawking. He is an attention seeker who comments on plenty of things he is not very well versed in. Unfortunately the media runs with it.

If you want to hear theoretical physicists talk about aliens then I'd point you to Michio Kaku who at least has studied astrobiology (unlike Hawking).



The last argument against the prevalence of hostile aliens in our galaxy is the fact that we're here.

Any sufficiently advanced civilization hell bent on destroying us would have wiped out our ancestors since Earth has been detectable as a life-bearing world for 3.4 billion years or so.