Creationists Demand Airtime On 'Cosmos' For The Sake Of Balance

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


In my investigations I've determined that the KJV (new or old) is just as much corrupted and tweaked as any other version....

I just can't trust 'translated translations of transcribed scribings from a dead language'.

It just doesn't compute. I know interpretation (as in, speaking as the liaison or representative for people who are conversing in different languages) and translation (writing out a piece of literature into another language) is very tricky to get right.

I know from experience.

Plus, it all seems like hearsay to me, since I was a little kid.


No matter how hard I've tried, every effort at it just loses my interest as another 'pulp' propaganda publication. I don't mean to dis anyone's heartfelt faith; it's just that if we can't agree on one version (such as - gravity pulls things toward the center of the earth), then what good is it??

It reminds me of the 'telephone game' when little kids sit in a circle; one tells his neighbor a whispered secret, and that neighbor tells his neighbor. Pass through ten sets of ears, and it comes out completely different than it was intended. Imagine when different languages (and inexpert interpretations) are involved!!

I just. I just
don't get it.

BuzzyWigs
In my investigations I've determined that the KJV (new or old) is just as much corrupted and tweaked as any other version....

I just can't trust 'translated translations of transcribed scribings from a dead language'.

It is interesting to note that the Codex Sinaiticus, written between 325 and 360, already differs with the Codex Vaticanus which is postulated to have been written slightly before it but in the same century. Both Bibles however are lacking material that would appear in future books which shows that even these Bibles, while the oldest known, were already in the process of being modified to fit cultural dictums laid down by the Pontiffs and/or Emperors in Rome and elsewhere.

BuzzyWigs
reply to post by Fromabove

 

I was going to offer a reply but I can see you don't read the Bible much or you would understand time better.

Well, I understand your average Jane's concept of time.
I also know that there are people who say that the 6 days it took to for God to create everything was really thousands of years....
so they got to 6,000. Not reasonable.

6 billion? Okay, I can go with that.

Since you seem to be the expert on the Bible (which I admittedly don't read) and offering me a sage and profound explanation, I'd like to hear it.

I do believe there are 10s of Thousands of pastors, priests, deacons, rectors, preachers, elders, and ministers who would all give me a different answer, though.

No?

The Bible never says that the earth is 6,000 years old, just that God created the universe and the earth in the beginning.

BuzzyWigs
reply to post by Fromabove

 

That God has not returned yet is a concept of your mind. God is with me all the time. He is with every believer. He's not with the unbeliever. So when these things happen I will say I expected it because He said it, but you might be surprised and not expect Him to return when He does.

So. Okay, I think I got this:
God is already here and with you all the time (not Jesus, just God), and he's with every believer.
But he's not with unbelievers (did I say I was an unbeliever? I'm totally agnostic)....
so, you won't be surprised. while an unbeliever might be. Okay, absolutely. I will be surprised, amazed, bowled over, breathless, saying well eff me, and probably wetting myself. I don't faint, though....at least not so far. Although in this case, I might!!

But

But

but it will be happening to you also - correct?

It will hurt you and yours. Right here next to the unbelievers....to say "told ya so" or "neener neener" -
trust me, my mouth will be hanging open and I will be sprinting to the front of the line to ask some questions, hand in the air.

But what will happen then? We all form a queue, based on socio-economic status or race or ethnicity; or Christian or Jew or Buddhist or Hindu or Unitarian Universalist or Baptist or JW aos;i;oasi?omg';.......illegible (x30,000)? Gender, age, sexual orientation, etc.?

Or will there be lots of lines, like in the old days at college, when it was punch-cards and booths, and lines divided up by alphabet....

Truly. You got me thinking. What will happen then? When he comes riding in a cloud?
(Aside from the already-noted Mother Earth Indicators)

When I say God is with me, I am also saying Jesus is with me.

There are only believers and resisters. Those who accept God and those that do not. And those that accept God will also accept His Son Jesus as Lord and Savior. This according to the Bible which I believe. So to me all others will be excluded from the kingdom of God because they don't want God, or want some other false god that they can worship and still sin by.

You might say, and probably will say, who am I to judge you or anyone else, I understand that. My answer is that I judge no one but believe what the Bible says, and it says if you reject God, if you reject His Son Jesus, you will die in sin and be judged for that sin and punished for that sin. I believe this and because my faith comes from the Bible. I am saying what it says, not me.

I do have an opinion and it's this.To say "I don't know for sure so I neither believe nor dis-believe is the same as not believing. It only means that your heart disagrees with your mind and so you hope there is no God even though your heart says that there is.

reply to post by BuzzyWigs


Whats more to the point Cosmos is NOT about evolution that's how stupid these bible thumpers are!!!

wmd_2008
reply to post by BuzzyWigs

 

Whats more to the point Cosmos is NOT about evolution that's how stupid these bible thumpers are!!!

Isn't there supposed to be a bit of etiquette and decorum when posting. Can I call you stupid because you see a universe and don't realize there is a God who created it and the perfection and order of it? No I won't do that.

Bible thumpers as you call them don't think like you and that's all. Also, COMOS is an indoctrination tool to blame God and praise science, not evolution, even though they agree with the concept.

In any case it's a one sided bad science documentary and too heavily opinionated for us Bible thumpers, as you call them.

Fromabove

BuzzyWigs
reply to post by Fromabove

 

That God has not returned yet is a concept of your mind. God is with me all the time. He is with every believer. He's not with the unbeliever. So when these things happen I will say I expected it because He said it, but you might be surprised and not expect Him to return when He does.

So. Okay, I think I got this:
God is already here and with you all the time (not Jesus, just God), and he's with every believer.
But he's not with unbelievers (did I say I was an unbeliever? I'm totally agnostic)....
so, you won't be surprised. while an unbeliever might be. Okay, absolutely. I will be surprised, amazed, bowled over, breathless, saying well eff me, and probably wetting myself. I don't faint, though....at least not so far. Although in this case, I might!!

But

But

but it will be happening to you also - correct?

It will hurt you and yours. Right here next to the unbelievers....to say "told ya so" or "neener neener" -
trust me, my mouth will be hanging open and I will be sprinting to the front of the line to ask some questions, hand in the air.

But what will happen then? We all form a queue, based on socio-economic status or race or ethnicity; or Christian or Jew or Buddhist or Hindu or Unitarian Universalist or Baptist or JW aos;i;oasi?omg';.......illegible (x30,000)? Gender, age, sexual orientation, etc.?

Or will there be lots of lines, like in the old days at college, when it was punch-cards and booths, and lines divided up by alphabet....

Truly. You got me thinking. What will happen then? When he comes riding in a cloud?
(Aside from the already-noted Mother Earth Indicators)

When I say God is with me, I am also saying Jesus is with me.

There are only believers and resisters. Those who accept God and those that do not. And those that accept God will also accept His Son Jesus as Lord and Savior. This according to the Bible which I believe. So to me all others will be excluded from the kingdom of God because they don't want God, or want some other false god that they can worship and still sin by.

I guess Mother Teresa is burning in hell right now... Man after all that good will, she loses her faith and because your god says that only believers can get into heaven, she is has to burn. Such a shame...

You might say, and probably will say, who am I to judge you or anyone else, I understand that. My answer is that I judge no one but believe what the Bible says, and it says if you reject God, if you reject His Son Jesus, you will die in sin and be judged for that sin and punished for that sin. I believe this and because my faith comes from the Bible. I am saying what it says, not me.

I do have an opinion and it's this.To say "I don't know for sure so I neither believe nor dis-believe is the same as not believing. It only means that your heart disagrees with your mind and so you hope there is no God even though your heart says that there is.

edit on 26-3-2014 by Fromabove because: (no reason given)

I have an opinion too, your god sucks. My heart isn't telling me a god exists either. It may be telling me that if he does exist, he certainly could care less about some random blue speck in the infinite length of the universe. The problem with most human religions is that they place too high an importance on the planet Earth and its inhabitants in respect to the universe. The universe is just TOO vast for this to be the case.

reply to post by Krazysh0t


Only God knows if Mother Teresa is in hell right now. I'm thinking that she believed in Jesus as her Lord. So I'm leaning towards her being in heaven.

However, no amount of good works can erase the stain of sin which is simply resisting and rejecting God. If she had rejected Jesus she would definitely be in hell, good deeds or not. This according to the Bible which I believe.


Your opinion is that my God sucks, so in that light Jesus must suck too. I just told you where the Bible says people who reject God end up. And that really gets you upset. So let's leave that there and get back on topic and figure out why the show COSMOS sucks.

reply to post by Fromabove


The show, Cosmos, doesn't suck though. It is well informed with a good host and provides good scientific information about our universe and how it works. Unlike a religion that damns someone to eternal burning for the actions they committed during a super small, teeny-tiny amount of that time. But hey believe what you want, if it gives you solace at night to know that good people who don't believe in god are being unspeakably tortured for the rest of eternity, then who am I to say otherwise. Personally, I wouldn't wish that fate on my worst enemies, let alone good, caring people, but hey what are you going to do? I find it funny after posting a link that speaks about PERSONAL letters written by Mother Teresa saying that she no longer has faith, you rationalize that she is still probably in heaven, despite your claim that all non-believers burn. I CAN however question your source of information.

reply to post by Fromabove

The Bible never says that the earth is 6,000 years old, just that God created the universe and the earth in the beginning.

All right then. So, would you say that the Answers in Genesis crowd (Ham & Co. of the Creation Museum/Noah Amusement Park) should not be given equal airtime? I'd think it would insult thinking Christians to have Ham's ideas represented as the "Christian truth." It just isn't.

Those are the Creationists that are demanding it, and I personally don't see any science that absolutely negates that it might have all been designed billions or trillions or however long ago (in our understanding of 'time', which we are pretty much stuck with, as much as we try to think outside of that)...by something or someone. Nothing yet has absolutely denied the existence of that "force" that started it all. The question becomes, then, was the "force" that started it all simply an exploding black hole?
Or was it a plan executed by a thinking entity?

I'm agnostic. I certainly don't, however, think there's a bearded old man with lightning coming out of his eyes sitting on a throne in the clouds. That is pure fairy tale stuff, and that adults accept it blows my mind.


I'm actually partial to the black-hole and multiverse theories. When stuff gets sucked into a black hole, it is condensed down to a singularity - a point. Then what? My idea is: It explodes into another universe somewhere else (another dimenion)....

and that's where we came from. The spewing of a black hole when it Bangs Big into a new universe.

Not that complicated; makes sense. But the whole Bible story, sorry, it doesn't make sense.

Ham and his followers are convinced that it is really only 6,000 human years ago; that dinosaurs were here with modern men.
And that, I think is ridiculous. For Tyson to allow that view on his show (or McFarlane or whoever) would seem like an April Fool's joke or something.

reply to post by Fromabove


So, who would get a shot at being on Cosmos though? Only Christians or Hindu's, Muslims and Native American's as well?

reply to post by Fromabove

So let's leave that there and get back on topic and figure out why the show COSMOS sucks.

Wait.

Whoa there nelly.

WHAT?

The topic is not "why does the show COSMOS suck"! If you want to discuss that, please make your own thread.
I made this one to discuss whether Creationists should be given equal time to present their view on COSMOS.
The show may be geared at people with short attention spans who don't want a dry PBS style lecture, but it absolutely "doesn't suck."

Plus, your stalwart acceptance that even Mother Teresa would be in hell by the standards in your book is just disturbing.
No wonder people get upset.

reply to post by Fromabove

Also, COMOS is an indoctrination tool to blame God and praise science, not evolution, even though they agree with the concept.

How is this show an indoctrination tool to blame God?

In any case it's a one sided bad science documentary and too heavily opinionated for us Bible thumpers, as you call them.

I don't think God will be mentioned at all beyond what Tyson already said: We don't know where life came from.
Period.
We don't.

Men wrote the Bible, supposedly via channeling. No more - or less - legitimate than Bashar (who we can no longer discuss here, but - who essentially is delivering a benevolent, loving message, in my opinion). All simply men thinking thoughts and declaring them.

You have quite a heavily opinionated bias against science, I see that clearly.

Seriously, what is with your judgment of people who aren't "Bible thumpers" and your violent hatred for the show???

Wow, this discussion is quite interesting. It has led to another question, a perpetual human question.

The Bible says "in the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth". Then it goes on to describe all the awful character traits of said God, assuming he is a person, an overlord. All the greatest religious writers have acknowledged that we don't have the capacity to understand "God" - it is a concept, an abstract idea that we're supposedly ill-equipped to understand at all.

Why not just join those two ideas together?

"God" made the universe. We don't know what "God" is.

reply to post by BuzzyWigs


Science disagrees with his world view and beliefs. It is the nature of fundamentalists to fiercely reject all things that contradict their beliefs.

reply to post by BuzzyWigs


I like that idea. One of my theories is that We are all parts of God sent to earth to experience life and when we die we are reunited with God, yet, Perhaps God is just a small part of a bigger God who is just part of a bigger God who is just part of a bigger God...a chain that never ends. It's unfathomable. Yet all we have to experience or discover or know any of this is Science.

reply to post by Fromabove

I do have an opinion and it's this.To say "I don't know for sure so I neither believe nor dis-believe is the same as not believing. It only means that your heart disagrees with your mind and so you hope there is no God even though your heart says that there is.

No. Actually to say I don't know for sure, so I neither believe nor disbelieve means that I don't know for sure, and when it comes down to it, neither do you. Pascal's wager is your gig, I see.

My heart and mind both tell me I want there to be justice, I want there to be a loving Source. But the God of the Bible is one mean dude. I wouldn't want to be his friend. Jesus? He's an okay bloke, real or imagined, myth or fact, I've no problem with him. I think he'd like me, actually.

So, I'm not a closet atheist. I'm a bona fide, tried and true agnostic. But I definitely don't believe "God" is a "person" or behaves like one. No. Nononono. Your book notwithstanding.

reply to post by amazing

I like that idea. One of my theories is that We are all parts of God sent to earth to experience life and when we die we are reunited with God, yet, Perhaps God is just a small part of a bigger God who is just part of a bigger God who is just part of a bigger God...a chain that never ends. It's unfathomable. Yet all we have to experience or discover or know any of this is Science.

Yes!!

I accept that theory whole-heartedly. When we die we are reunited with the Divine, which is unfathomable. Indescribable.

Do we come to inhabit physical bodies in order to learn? Yes, I think so. Can we learn it all in one teensy weensy lifetime? No.
The soul is immortal, and will be given all the time and experiences necessary to become worthy of reuniting with that Divine.

You mention all we have is science, add to that, our limited brain power/sensory input.



I'm pleased you like my theory!

reply to post by Fromabove


No I learned to THINK FOR MYSELF, I withdrew from the BRAINWASHING at an early age do you honestly think because someone tells you a story from a book of fairy tales at school and then at the Sunday brainwashing academy that what they say is 100% true.

Lets have a look , the simple fact is MAN created god (lower case that's all the subject deserves) in fact MAN created lots of god(s) here is a nice little list for you Names of Gods

Now each one of those god(s) from around the world have creation stories for MAN and the Universe, each one of those was believed by the people in that part of this pale blue dot, everyone of those stories has as much right as your god to be believed in, Yet ALL the creation stories are different they CAN'T all be right BUT they CAN ALL BE WRONG!!!

Now god(s) were created as a problem solver ie when MAN did not understand how something happened a god(s) did it.

For example thunder god,rain god, sun god etc etc

Care to explain how this supposed almighty being that supposedly created the Earth the Universe and everything could not get his message to all parts of the world at the same time surely a SIMPLE TASK for the being that created everything.

Religion is about power and control and running a job club for the church, keep the myth going and we keep our self employed, keep hammering the stories home and we will always have a job. There is NO proof of god(s) and never will be.

reply to post by wmd_2008

For example thunder god,rain god, sun god etc etc

I just wanted to give a shout out to the traffic god - yesterday I had to drive in the big city; not something I enjoy or am used to. Every time I had to merge onto the freeway, there was a nice big gap in the traffic, so that I didn't have to worry about being schmooshed while I crossed the lanes to get to the next (too-close and to the left!) exit.

Or - if it was GOD god, to thank him for that.
I was protected.

Care to explain how this supposed almighty being that supposedly created the Earth the Universe and everything could not get his message to all parts of the world at the same time surely a SIMPLE TASK for the being that created everything.

God. The Ultimate Know-It-All.
I think I'll start a new thread.


Or, not. Not really. It would be too much of a firestorm.
But it's interesting to think about.


Or maybe I will. I'll try to compose it professionally. Stay tuned, same BTStime, same BTSchannel!