So they want our guns...

Revelations29
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

 

You raise a good point of spreading awareness to others. That's one of the most important things. But see you are a part of a dying crowd. Sure there's people that will educate their children about these matters but they are few and far between. That 3% number of people who own guns will educate their children, but that group is a minority among the masses who are against it.

Advocating and spreading awareness is good, but I think it only goes so far. Because in my mind the people spreading awareness who are a minority, will soon be eliminated with the new generations and their new "progressive" way of thinking.

I think you have to do more then just spreading awareness, you have to stop the corruption where it starts. I think it all starts with the Central Banking system, and unless you eliminate that system, nothing will get any better. I don't think thats off topic, but I believe gun control will only get worse unless you eliminate the heart of the problem.

We are not "part of a dying crowd", we are part of a fast growing crowd, which is why gun laws have been becoming more "gun friendly" for decades now.

Hurry up and get your 20 posts and make a thread about your topic. I am sure many of us will join it and engage in the discussion.

I would, but I dont like being the Op because my cable sucks (thanks time warner) and I loose connection at the worst times for hours on end.

cavtrooper7
reply to post by Cuervo

 

I wouldn't move on anything but that(That's why I'm getting a BA in media art),I do agree we REALLY don't need that to happen.But how stupid are our challengers? Are they so foolishly emboldened buy politics that they will go for it? It sure does look like it but I also have a suggestion for all Progs:

Obama has gone WAAAAAAY too far with his agenda and the right let him get away with a LOT. What would it look like if a "HAWK" is elected? These may get past us as we vote out YOUR people this fall. I don't need THAT BS either but that pendulum is swinging back right.If it goes too far those guns cover that too.

I am in the center, I dont like abortion, but dont feel I can tell another to do it or not, I dont agree with gay marriage, but once again, who the hell am I to tell them what makes them miserable like all other married couples, there are many instances of this I could point out.

Truthfully, I dont think any of these issues are anyones business but the party involved directly.

I dont have to like it, but it isnt my right to intervene.

Having said all of that, Obama HAS gone WAY too far.\

I now fear that when the right wins the day they will also go WAY too far in the opposite direction.

Neither extreme is the answer.

Right down the middle, yes abortion is killing a life, let the woman live with her mistakes. Yes guns kill people, let the owners live with it.

How is this so hard to understand?

Keep the government out of our lives, stop asking them to get more involved on every little issue people individually dont like.

The world doesnt have to revolve around what the individual thinks, it is about many views and many lifestyles.

I just think it seems so simple to me. I dont know how it gets so out of control.

reply to post by oblvion


That would be MONEY my friend.The issues you suggest are the same with me I am a registered Independent(That way politics can't quantify my choice and sweat a bit,I LIKE that) I don't like abortions that don't threaten the mother,the child could be put up for adoption like I was. It's better than death.
Gays ? Sure they can have all the legal rights as a married couple,but they are NOT of the Christian faith so they can figure THAT out themselves.
I am no epic Christian either I believe in a BUNCH of things that don't sit well with dogmatic thinking(Fringe elements rule!)
,I figure MY job is to make life EASIER for others not lording over them,they sure as HELL will not do it to me for long.

peter vlar

oblvion


Who doesnt love hearing 100lbs bullets making their signature WHOOMP on the horizon?

BTW, we were in the rear with the gear, you guys were the grunts in the front, the beers are on me if I ever run into you.

edit on 2014bWednesdayv3320143 by oblvion because: (no reason given)

Anyone that doesn't love that sound is a fool. The bigger the boom the bigger my smile was. You should've seen me the day they issued me a 203. It was like Christmas morning for me! It was only 40 mm grenades which is tiny compared to what you guys were lobbing but a couple well placed shots from that... Just beautiful. Te day we trapped the sniper in a building and it was just 2 fire teams, 3 of the 40mm at the roof brought most of the 3rd floor down on him. I always had a lot more respect for you guys than the 11 B's on the mortar teams. They were all pussies who loved to talk a big game about being infantry when we were at a bar but we all know none of them had got their hands dirty since AIT.

It is easy to claim fame when you werent the guy getting shot at.

Artillery is the king of battle, but infantry is the queen, just like in chess, she is the most useful piece in play.

There is no ARMY without her.

I will never say my job was more important than yours, or my role won the fight. Yours always was and is the job that actually wins the fight.

Pogey's always act like their job was the most important, anyone who has ever actually been "in the #" knows the real score.

You 11-B guys get that baby blue braid and the lapel disk for a reason. All other jobs exist only to support you, because YOU are the epitome of the ARMY.

The M203 is a beast, my first time shooting it I was all but GOD smacked, it kicks slow and long VS something like a shotgun or high powered rifle.

It is more like a solid shove against your shoulder than a hit.

And that THOOUNK sound it makes, it is like nothing else. Only an AT4 has higher man portable power and it is single use. The M203 reloads.

Did you even get to train on the MK-19?

Puffs those 40mm grenades out at about 3/4 the speed of the M2 .50 cal. Which is also way fun to shoot.

My first time firing it I was awe struck, thinking......"really?" "who makes something like this?" "it is bit much isnt it?"

After seeing it used in Iraq ( on youtube, I didnt serve in Iraq) against a fortified walled compound it all became clear, the infantry needed the power of my 155mm artillery at hand, not minutes away, because when seconds count.....well seconds count, better to have it handy than to have it incoming.

Dont know if you ever had any of these supporting you or not, but my God.............

cavtrooper7
reply to post by oblvion

 

That would be MONEY my friend.The issues you suggest are the same with me I am a registered Independent(That way politics can't quantify my choice and sweat a bit,I LIKE that) I don't like abortions that don't threaten the mother,the child could be put up for adoption like I was. It's better than death.
Gays ? Sure they can have all the legal rights as a married couple,but they are NOT of the Christian faith so they can figure THAT out themselves.
I am no epic Christian either I believe in a BUNCH of things that don't sit well with dogmatic thinking(Fringe elements rule!)
,I figure MY job is to make life EASIER for others not lording over them,they sure as HELL will not do it to me for long.

I cant argue one bit here.

I will not be dictated to, I dont give a damn who it is or what the subject.

I will do what I feal is right and proper, but I will not be told what is right and proper in anothers views. They can have their views and I can have mine, we can disagree.

It doesnt have to be MY way, any more than it has to be THEIR way.

guohua
reply to post by SWCCFAN

 

The UN Small arms treaty is a joke. It should have been called only Government and the UN can have small arms treaty.

Even if the US senate were to some how ratify this garbage the Constitution is still supreme law. Treaties are below it. Otherwise we would have lost all our rights a long time ago.

The UN can go pound sand and pout.

True, True, True, This Time,,, Only because we had people in the Senate that had already Said NO, because 53 senators voted to uphold Second Amendment rights and prevent the United States from entering into the United Nations Arms Trade Treaty.

Let me post How Proud Kerry was to Sign that worthless Treaty for his Messiah.

Secretary of State John Kerry signed the United Nations Arms Trade Treaty Wednesday. Upon adding his signature, Kerry addressed the world body:

On behalf of President Obama and the United States of America, I am very pleased to have signed this treaty here today. I signed it because President Obama knows that from decades of efforts that at any time that we work with — cooperatively to address the illicit trade in conventional weapons, we make the world a safer place. And this treaty is a significant step in that effort.

Promptly, Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon thanked Kerry and Obama for their complicity in consolidating UN control over weapons and ammunition:

Read the whole story here:
Kerry signs UN Arms Treaty
What does Obama and his Thugs want America to look like?

edit on 4-3-2014 by guohua because: (no reason given)

Wow that bottom picture sure is dumb, god forbid same sex people be treated as equals and ALL people are healthy in the country but hell, as long as we got our GUNS, clearly the only thing that matters, then we don't need equal rights or people being healthy, 'Murica!!

Daedalus

stormson
tell me something.

how would the average person, with no formal military training, stack up against a 6 yr army scout?

now tell me, if the army were to turn on the people, just how well would the people stack up against the army, considering that 90% of people have no formal military training? just using small arms? now add in all the goodies, like drones and tanks, what are the peoples chances?

now, just for giggles, imagine that all the restraints that we put on the army for places like iraq were removed. where the army became what it truly was meant to be, a conquering army? where they were told to roll in, pacify by any means, and move on?

just imagine how much chance the average person would have if the army was told to operate by wwii rules of engagement rather than the "hearts and minds" rules of today.

the average person, never being in the army, can boast and bluster about how they could beat the best military in the world, but i expect better from a vet. even if restricted to just small arms, t.t.p. and physical conditioning puts the army ahead of the people.

edit on 5-3-2014 by stormson because: (no reason given)

Really?

if your statement was even remotely true, the russians would have been in and out of afghanistan in a couple of years, and we wouldn't even be there...instead, the russians battled untrained average people for a decade, bankrupted themselves doing it, and failed to achieve victory....we have been in there for OVER a decade, fighting a new generation of untrained average people, have bankrupted ourselves doing it, and have failed to achieve victory....when we were colonists, we beat the british army(the most powerful, most advanced army in the world, at the time), and they were FAR better armed, trained, and equipped than we were...sure we had a little help, but the majority of the work was done by us....

for you to believe that the citizens wouldn't stand a chance, is just shortsighted, and frankly, dumb...

edit on 5-3-2014 by Daedalus because: wouldn't you like to know

Yep those U.S trained and back Afghans back in 1980s , definitely untrained and just "the people"

Revelations29
Advocating and spreading awareness is good, but I think it only goes so far. Because in my mind the people spreading awareness who are a minority, will soon be eliminated with the new generations and their new "progressive" way of thinking.

I think the majority of citizens are aware of the gun control debate and I do not feel the pro-2nd Amendment advocates are in the minority as reflected by every poll and the subsequent defeat of actions (in most cases) for tighter restriction. Even when tougher laws do pass the gauntlet is immediately picked up and legal challenges are made t repeal them as is being done all over the country.

The best meme in the Original Post is the one that displays the evolution of concealed carry shall issuing states from the minority to the overwhelming majority over the past 30 years. This will only continue as legal precedent, by way the United States Constitution, is on our side.

cavtrooper7
Ah but remember I'm poor all I can afford are deer hunting rounds in my .308,I am no longer a signitory of the Geneva convention. That goes for interesting shotgun loads too. A very nasty deterrent to tyranny eh?

Hah, good point (pun intended). The .308 jacketed round is a pussy cat next to my .308 hunting ammo.

Revelations29
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

 

That 3% number of people who own guns will educate their children, but that group is a minority among the masses

i think you're confused....about the 3% thing, i mean. you've said it a few times, and it's not right...

3% is the percentage of all gun crimes are committed with so-called "assault weapons", not the percentage of gun owners in america...

according to a recent gallup poll, gun ownership is actually at 47%(as of 2011), and rising...

Aloysius the Gaul

Revelations29
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

 

How do you deal with a corrupt Government who wants to take your guns away?

Easiest way is to shift to the USA, since there is no such government there.

Of course you have to put up with a bunch of deluded "patriots" frothing at the mouth over imaginary wrongs.....but at least you can own a gun and shoot them in many states if they come onto your property.

man, seriously.....

this is really all i ever see out of folks like you(anti-gunners)..you come into these threads, say insulting things, make assertions and claims, and don't bother providing anything to back them, talk down to us, and you have the nerve to classify US as ignorant...honestly man....

either back your words with facts, or stop attention whoring, ok?

LogicalPhilosophy
Yep those U.S trained and back Afghans back in 1980s , definitely untrained and just "the people"

yes, we provided the mujaheddin with weapons, and SOME instruction...it's not like we sent the lot of them to boot, and they were professional soldiers....they had no formal military training. so yeah, they were the people...

it's funny that in your mind, because we gave them a little hand, that completely invalidates what they accomplished.

Daedalus

Revelations29
reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

 

That 3% number of people who own guns will educate their children, but that group is a minority among the masses

i think you're confused....about the 3% thing, i mean. you've said it a few times, and it's not right...

3% is the percentage of all gun crimes are committed with so-called "assault weapons", not the percentage of gun owners in america...

according to a recent gallup poll, gun ownership is actually at 47%(as of 2011), and rising rapidly...

There I fixed that for you, as it isnt just rising, it is rising RAPIDLY.

Daedalus

LogicalPhilosophy
Yep those U.S trained and back Afghans back in 1980s , definitely untrained and just "the people"

yes, we provided the mujaheddin with weapons, and SOME instruction...it's not like we sent the lot of them to boot, and they were professional soldiers....they had no formal military training. so yeah, they were the people...

it's funny that in your mind, because we gave them a little hand, that completely invalidates what they accomplished.

Doesnt it just drive you crazy the only thing the gun grabbers think matters is training?

They act like nobody but highly trained people could ever do any job.

This is retarded use of logic, as all people can do almost any job, as all jobs were created and implemented to be done by people.

Little training ( less than a day to operate a 19er8 howitzer, FDC would take longer, without the right natural skill set much longer, maybe 4 weeks for the average guy.) is needed to do any task.

I could train anyone to use just about anything in short order, as all military tech is "goof proof", which is ARMY SOP.

K.i.S.S.-keep it simple stupid

This is now, and always has been the ARMY's most useful tactic.

oblvion
Doesnt it just drive you crazy the only thing the gun grabbers think matters is training?

They act like nobody but highly trained people could ever do any job.

This is retarded use of logic, as all people can do almost any job, as all jobs were created and implemented to be done by people.

Little training ( less than a day to operate a 19er8 howitzer, FDC would take longer, without the right natural skill set much longer, maybe 4 weeks for the average guy.) is needed to do any task.

I could train anyone to use just about anything in short order, as all military tech is "goof proof", which is ARMY SOP.

K.i.S.S.-keep it simple stupid

This is now, and always has been the ARMY's most useful tactic.

it bothers me a little...only a little because i can't get TOO mad at the fact that they don't know any better....what irks me more though, is the fact that they refuse to educate themselves....

they go on under the impression that you need to be special operations, with like a decade under your belt, to be able to do ANYTHING that has anything to do with tactics, shooting, logistics, etc....they can't see outside the little bubble they live in, where the mindset of "if i can't do it, then that must be true of most people", and "if i see no need/use for something, then nobody else could possibly have a need/use for that thing" is perfectly ok...

i mean, i seriously doubt ANYONE here wants to see another civil war/revolution...hell, i doubt the people who fought in the civil war, and revolution, wanted to be running about the countryside, killing people either....it came down to the fact that it needed to be done. i think people would be MUCH happier if the federal government remembered it's place in the system of things, and stopped assuming authority it has no legal right/claim to.....but if it came to it, i honestly doubt the citizenry would be overwhelmed, and beaten in a day, like some people here seem to think...or why they'd even WANT such a thing to happen...do they hate their fellow man THAT much, that they'd really hope that anyone who doesn't think like them dies?

that's kinda sick, now that i think of it...

For all of those detractors that say the avg gunowner will not do well against a trained army,there is this:www.huntingpa.com...

Daedalus

oblvion
Doesnt it just drive you crazy the only thing the gun grabbers think matters is training?

They act like nobody but highly trained people could ever do any job.

This is retarded use of logic, as all people can do almost any job, as all jobs were created and implemented to be done by people.

Little training ( less than a day to operate a 19er8 howitzer, FDC would take longer, without the right natural skill set much longer, maybe 4 weeks for the average guy.) is needed to do any task.

I could train anyone to use just about anything in short order, as all military tech is "goof proof", which is ARMY SOP.

K.i.S.S.-keep it simple stupid

This is now, and always has been the ARMY's most useful tactic.

it bothers me a little...only a little because i can't get TOO mad at the fact that they don't know any better....what irks me more though, is the fact that they refuse to educate themselves....

they go on under the impression that you need to be special operations, with like a decade under your belt, to be able to do ANYTHING that has anything to do with tactics, shooting, logistics, etc....they can't see outside the little bubble they live in, where the mindset of "if i can't do it, then that must be true of most people", and "if i see no need/use for something, then nobody else could possibly have a need/use for that thing" is perfectly ok...

i mean, i seriously doubt ANYONE here wants to see another civil war/revolution...hell, i doubt the people who fought in the civil war, and revolution, wanted to be running about the countryside, killing people either....it came down to the fact that it needed to be done. i think people would be MUCH happier if the federal government remembered it's place in the system of things, and stopped assuming authority it has no legal right/claim to.....but if it came to it, i honestly doubt the citizenry would be overwhelmed, and beaten in a day, like some people here seem to think...or why they'd even WANT such a thing to happen...do they hate their fellow man THAT much, that they'd really hope that anyone who doesn't think like them dies?

that's kinda sick, now that i think of it...

Your use of logic is flawless here.

I also disturbs me that these people dont think any further than the the first layer of "want".


They want X, therefore no matter what else happens, X must occur at all costs, even if it is stupid.

Even though half way to X they encounter Z which comes into total contravention of X. Do they adjust? No they drive forward, X is then only thing that has or ever will matter.

Please just punch me in the face and knock me out until this is over, I suffer daily from dealing with stupid, I grow weary of it.

oblvion

Daedalus

LogicalPhilosophy
Yep those U.S trained and back Afghans back in 1980s , definitely untrained and just "the people"

yes, we provided the mujaheddin with weapons, and SOME instruction...it's not like we sent the lot of them to boot, and they were professional soldiers....they had no formal military training. so yeah, they were the people...

it's funny that in your mind, because we gave them a little hand, that completely invalidates what they accomplished.

Doesnt it just drive you crazy the only thing the gun grabbers think matters is training?

They act like nobody but highly trained people could ever do any job.

This is retarded use of logic, as all people can do almost any job, as all jobs were created and implemented to be done by people.

Little training ( less than a day to operate a 19er8 howitzer, FDC would take longer, without the right natural skill set much longer, maybe 4 weeks for the average guy.) is needed to do any task.

I could train anyone to use just about anything in short order, as all military tech is "goof proof", which is ARMY SOP.

K.i.S.S.-keep it simple stupid

This is now, and always has been the ARMY's most useful tactic.

It's because they don't really care about training, if they did, I would be able to own the same FA M-4 I carried in Iraq. They just say that because they think it makes them sound reasonable.

NavyDoc

oblvion

Daedalus

LogicalPhilosophy
Yep those U.S trained and back Afghans back in 1980s , definitely untrained and just "the people"

yes, we provided the mujaheddin with weapons, and SOME instruction...it's not like we sent the lot of them to boot, and they were professional soldiers....they had no formal military training. so yeah, they were the people...

it's funny that in your mind, because we gave them a little hand, that completely invalidates what they accomplished.

Doesnt it just drive you crazy the only thing the gun grabbers think matters is training?

They act like nobody but highly trained people could ever do any job.

This is retarded use of logic, as all people can do almost any job, as all jobs were created and implemented to be done by people.

Little training ( less than a day to operate a 19er8 howitzer, FDC would take longer, without the right natural skill set much longer, maybe 4 weeks for the average guy.) is needed to do any task.

I could train anyone to use just about anything in short order, as all military tech is "goof proof", which is ARMY SOP.

K.i.S.S.-keep it simple stupid

This is now, and always has been the ARMY's most useful tactic.

It's because they don't really care about training, if they did, I would be able to own the same FA M-4 I carried in Iraq. They just say that because they think it makes them sound reasonable.

Doc, every single time I read a post of yours, it is the same, LOGICAL USE OF REASON!!!!

I would, even at the times I disagree with you, promote you to Commander In Chief, because your use of logic and reason has a trail that can be "logically" followed to its conclusion.

Unlike so many gun grabbers out there.

Please Sir, protect yourself, we(the people) will need the likes of you in the coming years.

All of my assault rifles were stolen when I took them to deer camp with me. Darndest thing....

I still cannot help but LOL when I think of them trying to take guns from most people I know! lol
You may also wanna stock up on diesel fuel and fertilizer too--for your vehicles and garden of course

S&F