objecting to " gay " birthday cakes ? the farce deepens

Christians are missing an opportunity to show Christ's love by making the best cake possible. Plus, do we start denying cakes to alcoholics, or someone we know may have cheated on there wife. That being said we should have the right to deny any service we want. I would hate to live in a world where someone is forced to make a KKK cake or a swastika cake. What about a videographer refusing to do a nudist wedding.

Don't know the US law but I'd of agreed a price and would of paid for it up front and thus formed a contract and then when the baker decided to cancel it I'm sure a lot of lawyers would be offering their services to sort it out for a very pretty penny.

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: dragonridr

So ... it's okay to discriminate against someone if you only have an online business, or a home-based business?

Oh, wait, this is in Ohio ... it's fine to discriminate against gays and lesbians.

Nevermind.

It’s okay for someone to force another person to break their religious code? To do something that they see as amoral?

Would it be okay if they were to refuse to bake a cake for a known pedofile and his underage bride?

So you are for religious freedom, I take it then you have no issue with Muslim women wearing burkas or Muslim men having multiple wives....?

If that’s what they choose then yes. In other countries they don’t have a choice.

a reply to: Gryphon66

I believe the Constitution is rather clear on who can establish laws, no ambiguity there nor any other interpretation. Article 1 gives Congress that power. Sharia law would not be legal without the authority of the entire Congress.

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
Would it be okay if they were to refuse to bake a cake for a known pedofile and his underage bride?

Not only is that a false equivalency, it's a stupid argument. And as long as I have your attention...let spellcheck be your friend, too!

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
Would it be okay if they were to refuse to bake a cake for a known pedofile and his underage bride?

Not only is that a false equivalency, it's a stupid argument. And as long as I have your attention...let spellcheck be your friend, too!

Why is it a false equivalency. Someone doing something you object to/ find revolting. That was er point.

a reply to: tovenar

a reply to: crsb123

originally posted by: Alien Abduct

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: dragonridr

So ... it's okay to discriminate against someone if you only have an online business, or a home-based business?

Oh, wait, this is in Ohio ... it's fine to discriminate against gays and lesbians.

Nevermind.

It’s okay for someone to force another person to break their religious code? To do something that they see as amoral?

Would it be okay if they were to refuse to bake a cake for a known pedofile and his underage bride?

This started with a cake with a penis on it for a wedding. This cake says "Happy Birthday" and should have 0 impact on your religious ability to create other than knowing a gay person is going to eat it.

It's a drastic difference in the amount of conflicting liberties, if she has ever made a single other cake that says "Happy Birthday" on it, it's officially discrimination based on sexuality. The main HUGE difference is it's not a penis cake, and was rejected solely on the values of the customer, with no thought towards the cake, other than they would not make it because the customer is gay. Penis cake is a much more grey area because the experience of the cake maker creating that cake is displeasure, this is 100% different, if you make "Happy Birthday" for anyone, you must sell that cake to everyone legally.

The other guy was not selling penis cakes, he didn't refuse a gay couple, he just refuses to make penis cakes period. He would have made them a different cake. This person however sells birthday cakes to others, but not this this couple because they are gay. 100% illegal discrimination. You see the difference? This Cake maker had to DISCOVER the couple was gay to refuse service on a normal cake, while the first guy obviously was not making a penis cake from the start because of his religious rights and just refused. Had this person not seen a picture of the gay couple together, it wouldn't have bothered them to create the cake? Bull#.

Now if some straight white christian couple went into the first guys cake place, and ordered a gay looking penis cake and he made it for them, then his initial claim would be discrimination, but the idea of his freedom is if he doesn't want to make that he doesn't have to. He just can't pick and choose his services based off the customers. If he makes a Penis cake for one, he makes a penis cake for all, and so he chooses to not make it for anyone and that is fine. But if she sells Birthday cakes to other people, but not gays because they are gay, regardless of cake, that is not allowed.

Huge difference. Slippery Slope. If the requested cake is templated and ever has been ordered before it's basically a closed case she loses. Other than Ohio or something.

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
Would it be okay if they were to refuse to bake a cake for a known pedofile and his underage bride?

Not only is that a false equivalency, it's a stupid argument. And as long as I have your attention...let spellcheck be your friend, too!

Correct spelling of words has nothing to do with this discussion.

I did not equate the two, I merely pointed out another example in which a religious person with high morals might deny making a cake for in which other people might be able to also identify with.

Simply pointing out two immoral acts doesn’t automatically mean that the person is equating the two. Perhaps if one’s reading comprehension skills were a little more up-to-date then perhaps they could observe the context of the whole argument.

Making a personal attack against me because of a misspelling in an informal setting will only serve to diminish your credibility in this discussion.


And as long as I have your attention... I’d like to reiterate my argument and make it concise for the confused. Some religious people see homosexuality as an immoral act just as they and even non religious folk see pedophilia, married men and women having an affair or cloning humans as immoral.

a reply to: KatWouldKillYou

The other guy was not selling penis cakes, he didn't refuse a gay couple, he just refuses to make penis cakes period. He would have made them a different cake. This person however sells birthday cakes to others, but not this this couple because they are gay. 100% illegal discrimination. You see the difference?

Perhaps in your reading of the OP source article you skipped over a very important part in the first few sentences where it stated that it’s actually NOT illegal. You see the difference?

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: scrounger

So that's a no then... I agree I don't believe in religious freedom either, as far as I'm concerned the law of the land takes precedence.

do you ever read what someones posts before you comment or if it factually does not support your view you post the equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears going LALALALALALA."

in short your comment shows you IGNORED what I said and spew personal slam

sad, really sad

scrounger

a reply to: scrounger

I just didn't agree with you and was being a smart ass, now you know what that loud whoooosh sound was.

a reply to: Alien Abduct

Maybe if you quoted the sentence and gave some context.

If you are referring to the response from the owner that they do not do gay-themed cakes, that is fine, because they don't need to do that.

Not selling cake at all to gay people is not the same.

What really sells the story is the gay couple had to figure out how they even found out, the cake was obviously not sexually orientated or themed at all.

If someone else is allowed to buy the same cake the first couple requested, without being gay, it makes it illegal.

Make sense?

Only by being a custom cake, is this legal loophole even applicable. If it's a templated cake, she broke the law.

Ps. I read the source before you said that, and I read it again afterwards to understand what the # you are talking about, but I guess I still don't know. Nice job calling me out though /s. Quote the extremely obvious piece of information I missed for me?

originally posted by: KatWouldKillYou
a reply to: Alien Abduct

Maybe if you quoted the sentence and gave some context.

If you are referring to the response from the owner that they do not do gay-themed cakes, that is fine, because they don't need to do that.

Not selling cake at all to gay people is not the same.

What really sells the story is the gay couple had to figure out how they even found out, the cake was obviously not sexually orientated or themed at all.

If someone else is allowed to buy the same cake the first couple requested, without being gay, it makes it illegal.

Make sense?

Only by being a custom cake, is this legal loophole even applicable. If it's a templated cake, she broke the law.

Ps. I read the source before you said that, and I read it again afterwards to understand what the # you are talking about, but I guess I still don't know. Nice job calling me out though /s. Quote the extremely obvious piece of information I missed for me?

Show me where in Ohio law this action is illegal, then perhaps you might have an argument.

a reply to: crsb123

Such is the state of politics and society these days, I think it should be important for anyone to discriminate against anyone they want to. Without giving a reason.
"I don't want to sell you my products because I don't want to."
"I don't want you driving my taxi because I don't want you to/ I don't want you in my taxi because I choose not to."
"I don't want to offer you this job because you're not what I'm looking for."

A level playing field.

a reply to: ignorant_ape

What I really find amazing is all the time wasted bickering over gay cakes.
There are more important issues facing people and the world.I will never
lose any sleep over someone not getting a gay cake.

a reply to: mamabeth

.

originally posted by: crsb123
Christians are missing an opportunity to show Christ's love by making the best cake possible. Plus, do we start denying cakes to alcoholics, or someone we know may have cheated on there wife. That being said we should have the right to deny any service we want. I would hate to live in a world where someone is forced to make a KKK cake or a swastika cake. What about a videographer refusing to do a nudist wedding.

I came very close to helping a gay couple with their wedding because I like them!
My son reminded me that if I helped them I would be partaking in their abomination.
I had to refuse to help them and they were very understanding about it.
How would any Christian be showing Christ's love on something the Lord says is an
abomination to Him? I think that praying for these people to have their spiritual eyes
and ears opened to the truth is showing Christ's love.

Pretty sad that some choose to think this is just about a cake.

Inequality is not just about a cake.

a reply to: Autorico

A lot of Christian ladies know how to bake cakes,cookies,pies and breads!
I have the pans,pillars and plates and can make my own!

I think it's good for Christian bakers to stand up for and stick to their beliefs. Surely, there's nothing wrong with that. The only problem I see is that they don't stand up for ALL of their Christian beliefs. For example, if someone wants a wedding cake and they are:

- Muslim, Morman, Wickan, Buddist, .... you name it... certainly a Christian shouldn't be forced to bake cakes for "heathens."
- One of them is an atheist? They shouldn't even be allowed in the shop much less buy a cake.
- Has the woman ever been divorced? The Bible clearly says that's the same as marrying an adulterer. They don't seriously expect a Christian to make them a cake, do they?
- Will there be shrimp cocktail, lobster, or escargot served at the reception? It needs to be documented in advance that the caterer will definitely NOT be providing this or they shouldn't even be asking for a cake.
- Will the groom's tux have tassels? If not, No cake!
- Does the baker have proof that the woman won't be menstruating at the time of the wedding? How can someone possibly bake a wedding cake without knowing that?

There's probably more stuff, but that's all I can think of at the moment. Evangelicals need to get together and come up with a formal wedding cake application and background check to allow this to all be performed correctly. Otherwise, who knows how many bakers could end up in hell over this?