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originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul
a reply to: ScrutonEyez
Who was talking about an air to air missile?
See here
the jet itself may only reach 23K but the missile reach is 12K with a standard. so theoretically it could have taken it down.
The war in Ukraine will continue. Putin's Ukraine strategy is long term. Even winning Donetsk will change nothing. It is a civil war and border lines will reshape every day. Ukraine's economy will continue to slide down. We shall see how much money Europe is willing to pump into Ukraine.
Russian air force chief Lt. Gen. Igor Makushev suggested that the plane was shot out of the sky by the Ukrainians, using either missile systems or a fighter plane.
who said it had to be on page 1??
originally posted by: ScrutonEyez
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul
who said it had to be on page 1??
I don't know why you refered to page one in your response to me if that piece of info was what you were going for in the first place.
The point is that the person I responded too was acting like there was a crowd of people in here claiming that, but there wasn't, and your initial try failed, that much is clear.
In your new example, still noone claims that MH17 was brought down with ATA missiles.
Lol.
DONETSK, June 29, /ITAR-TASS/. Self-defence forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic have taken control over a missile defence army unit equipped with Buk missile defence systems, the press service of the Donetsk People’s Republic told Itar-Tass on Sunday.
So far, no details are available about the number and condition of the missile systems taken over by the self-defence forces. The press service refused to comment.
The Buk missile defence system is a mobile medium-range surface-to-air missile (SAM) system designed to defend field troops and logistics installations against air threats in conditions of heavy electronic countermeasures and intense enemy fire.
originally posted by: earthling42
a reply to: Zaphod58
It has been in the news that pro russians got their hands on a BUK-M1 after a battle with the ukrainian army, but that source is russian, so not very reliable.
On July 14, they shot down a military plane (antonov 26 flying at FL220) which has been filmed and placed on youtube.
What are the odds that some people who are pro russian and get their hands on such a powerfull weapon know how to operate it?
But they sure know how to use it and it is also used to shoot MH17 out of the sky.
A question which i ponder about, does this equipment give information about what type of aircraft is flying within reach of the radar? or is it simply a dot on their screen and do they simply shoot at any aircraft which invades their airspace.
MH17 was about 30 kilometers away when the missile was launched, so they could not have seen it, let alone that they could have seen it was being escorted by fighter jets.
The SU-25 has a ceiling of 7000 mtr, it will have great difficulty climbing to 10000 mtr (if it even can go that high) because of the aerodynamics.
It's a simple thing in aviation, the higher an aircraft goes, the higher the stallspeed is and eventually an aircraft will meet the coffin corner.
originally posted by: TDawgRex
Currently, I am leaning strongly in the opinion that the Rebels shot down MH17. Why?
- Because they have already shot down Ukraine aircraft in the area.
- They are rebels, and as such are not as disciplined a force.
- They have gained weapons through capture and have also been supplied weapons from Russia. This has been documented.
- The rebels have no air capability to speak of, especially in regards to the size of a Boing 777. So it make absolutely no sense for the Ukrainians to down a aircraft that was close to leaving their airspace anyways.
- The captured messages between the rebels, indicate that some one screwed up.
Any one with a ounce of common sense would realize that if this was to played out as a false flag op (PSYOP) would realize how bad it could backfire.
I think that this is nothing more than a case of a trigger happy rebel with tragic consequences.
originally posted by: earthling42
a reply to: Xcathdra
But how reliable is that source? it could well be that Russia has delivered this weapon while media spins it into seized from ukrainian forces.
originally posted by: jedi_hamster
so far, 99% of this thread is rumour mixed with throwing blame without evidence and constant attacks at everyone suggesting that kiev is responsible.
originally posted by: jedi_hamster
you really want the WW3 that bad?
seriously?
originally posted by: jedi_hamster
you'll get it, and the more you'll believe in the lies of your governments and the media, the sooner it will happen.
and you will cry over your own foolishness then, but it'll be too late.