Calling all atheists

A comment left by an atheist prompted me to create this thread. Usually, I wouldn't care and would just move on, but the comment angered me just a tad. It 'cut me to the quick', as it were.

The comment was left on a thread that was created by a Christian, and a follower of Jesus. It was a fairly lengthy thread and I read a good deal of it. The Original Poster was, imo, intelligent, logical and rational. A thinker.

Of course, within an hour's time, one of the local atheists posted the obligatory comment about how anyone who believes in "an invisible man in the sky" is an unscientific moron. The comment was just childish, and poorly worded to boot. Someone who can barely string a sentence together was chastising someone who had an obviously well-developed faculty for thinking.

Looking around the "religious" forums, I noticed about a half-dozen of these "atheist attacks" on "unscientific" Christians. Some atheists get really offended when someone believes in God, like it’s an affront to their dignity.

I’d like to put forth the following propositions to our resident atheists:

First and foremost…
Rejecting anything and everything that you consider theological, religious, or spiritual
doesn’t automatically make you “scientific-minded”. On the contrary, it makes you close-minded. It actually makes you unscientific. Real scientists seek the truth, and don’t reject something out of hand because it isn’t plainly visible or proven. A real scientist could look at a tree and at least entertain the idea that there could be a designer, an intelligence, a creator behind it.

Second….
There are people much smarter than you who believe in God. There are physicists, mathematicians and biologists with stellar I.Q.s who believe in a creator. Are they being scientific and unscientific at the same time? There are some deep thinkers out there who have pushed their very sanity to its limits, grappling with concepts that are beyond the realm of human understanding. They have stared into the abyss, and many have come away concluding there must be a God. How can these unscientific simpletons match intellects with the likes of Penn & Teller, the Las Vegas magicians who have avowed there’s no God?

Finally…
Feel free to believe that “spiritual” = “unscientific”. Go ahead and believe that when you die, it’s The End, and you’re worm food. Go ahead and believe, essentially, in nothing beyond our limited consciousness and awareness.
In your defense, it’s human nature to doubt. Even Mother Teresa had a ‘dark night of the soul’ where her faith was weakened. Many saints have experienced ‘spiritual dryness.’ The Apostle Thomas, the doubter, was the one who got to touch the wounds of Christ.

I’ll leave you with a quote from “The Count of Monte Cristo”

Edmond Dantes: I don't believe in God.
Abbe Faria (the priest): It doesn't matter. He believes in you.

reply to post by ColeYounger


I consider myself agnostic...does that count?

BTW...don't think for a moment that intelligence, even genuis level smarts makes a person any less gullible than the next..it doesn't.

You see, the thing about being online is that you have no idea who the person posting really is. I've seen it quite often and even though it's used by all groups I tend to see it pop up a lot in religious discussions. It's a type of bait and switch to promote agendas. Those comments that tend to really do a disservice to the party they represent can and may in fact be someone from the opposition.

For example: Der..religous peoples are dumb. I'm atheist and I"m smarter than yaou.. add expletive or any derogatory remark w/ no discussion pts.

Or:
I'm religious and I hate blank and I think that dinosaurs still walk and talk and are really evil demons and all atheists are going to suffer because....

These are simplistic but the convey the point. Who really benefits from those statements? Usually the opposition. So these types of comments are best ignored. It is amazing what the surrounding context of a post can reveal. In general be wary of anything that starts of with "I used to be" it is a common trust builder. At the end of the day an online post isn't really worth getting worked up over.

I believe in God but not in Organized religions such as Christianity and certainly not the Bible. I usually don't call people stupid but try to post why I think it's a bad choice. Deism, Spirituality, just a basic belief in a God is good enough for me. I don't need all the hatred and violence of the organized religions. But that's just my own opinion. I love to have a good debate about it...usually I lose though. lol Not a natural debater.

reply to post by DetectiveT

At the end of the day an online post isn't really worth getting worked up over.

Amen to that!

reply to post by amazing

I don't need all the hatred and violence of the organized religions.

Well said. I like to think God's love is unconditional. That's why I left the comment at the end.
"He believes in you."

reply to post by DetectiveT


Is an online post not really worth getting worked up over...or are you just saying that as a double bluff?

Christian, and a follower of Jesus.

That's redundant

the comment angered me just a tad

That's ok, religious people get angered easily, more easily than most actually. When lots of religious folks get angry it seems like lots of people die. Shame, that is, and maybe the reason that many people don't subscribe to religion in the first place.

Someone who can barely string a sentence together was chastising someone who had an obviously well-developed faculty for thinking.

There are some people that cannot write. Yet they are wiser than this forum combined. Stringing words together has nothing to do with whether or not they have a right to chastise others.

Get off your high horse. (just my opinion)

Honestly it sounds to me as though you're angry that people don't believe in your God.

reply to post by ColeYounger

First and foremost…
Rejecting anything and everything that you consider theological, religious, or spiritual
doesn’t automatically make you “scientific-minded”. On the contrary, it makes you close-minded. It actually makes you unscientific. Real scientists seek the truth, and don’t reject something out of hand because it isn’t plainly visible or proven. A real scientist could look at a tree and at least entertain the idea that there could be a designer, an intelligence, a creator behind it.

How do you feel about Zeus, Odin, Ra, Cthulhu or Vishnu? Have you ever brushed any of those gods off as imaginary, or nonexistent? If one were to place their faith in one single god, out of the thousands of other gods that are possible, wouldn't that person also be close minded and unscientific? If this is the case, then it only stands to reason that the true open minded person would either reject all gods, or accept all gods as being possible equally.

Second….
There are people much smarter than you who believe in God. There are physicists, mathematicians and biologists with stellar I.Q.s who believe in a creator. Are they being scientific and unscientific at the same time? There are some deep thinkers out there who have pushed their very sanity to its limits, grappling with concepts that are beyond the realm of human understanding. They have stared into the abyss, and many have come away concluding there must be a God. How can these unscientific simpletons match intellects with the likes of Penn & Teller, the Las Vegas magicians who have avowed there’s no God?

Appeal to Authority
The intelligence level of those that agree with you is completely irrelevant. There are many smart, and dumb people on both sides of the debate. What is relevant is evidence, which is something the religious side of the debate is seriously lacking.

Finally…
Feel free to believe that “spiritual” = “unscientific”. Go ahead and believe that when you die, it’s The End, and you’re worm food. Go ahead and believe, essentially, in nothing beyond our limited consciousness and awareness.
In your defense, it’s human nature to doubt. Even Mother Teresa had a ‘dark night of the soul’ where her faith was weakened. Many saints have experienced ‘spiritual dryness.’ The Apostle Thomas, the doubter, was the one who got to touch the wounds of Christ.

Thank you, i will continue to look at the world using logic and reason. I extend the same permission to you, feel free to believe that there is an omnipotent being looking down on you, saving a place for you after you die. While you are living your life preparing for the after life, i will be living my life like its the only one i get. What makes you happy does not make everyone happy and the same applies to me. We may see the world differently, but as long as we do not interfere with each other's lives, i see no problem with that.

DC

I think it should be noted that all the arguments between the religious and atheists are completely circular, and at this point have been argued so many times over, it's bordering on juvenile.

I don't care how smart the atheist is, and how strong the faith of the the religionist, by railing against one another in such a redundant manner just outlines how much of a setup the whole thing is.

If you look at all of the facets of the world, all the things there are for people to concern themselves with, there are very few issues that are not divisive.

For example, the legislature of Utah, where I currently reside has passed gay marriage legislation. Now it seems to me that in a place where religion runs so deep and is fundamental to so many people's lives that this legislation would serve to more deeply divide people ideologically than to preserve the rights of a subset of the population.

All the way down to the most trivial things, sports rivalries most obviously, are presented to us as ways to differentiate ourselves from one another, to make us feel unique compared to the other, when the importance lies in our similarities, not our differences. We take the bait willingly.

We continually look for a unifying theory by dividing things into their constituent parts. How can we find unity by separating everything we know?

reply to post by ColeYounger

Feel free to believe that “spiritual” = “unscientific”. Go ahead and believe that when you die, it’s The End, and you’re worm food. Go ahead and believe, essentially, in nothing beyond our limited consciousness and awareness.
In your defense, it’s human nature to doubt. Even Mother Teresa had a ‘dark night of the soul’ where her faith was weakened. Many saints have experienced ‘spiritual dryness.’ The Apostle Thomas, the doubter, was the one who got to touch the wounds of Christ.

Is there any reason to believe otherwise save for perhaps to satiate the vain desires of an irrational fear?

ColeYounger

Edmond Dantes: I don't believe in God.
Abbe Faria (the priest): It doesn't matter. He believes in you.

Natural Selection doesn't require anyone to believe in it either.

When next confronted with a life or death situation, whether yourself or someone you care about, choose between calling Ambulance, or Praying.
See which one works better.

Riddle: How many Atheist threads in succession does it take, in respect to a preceding thread before a holiday season, to deem an initial Atheist thread before a holiday season redundant in a 3-week time frame on ATS?

Answer: All of them except for an initial one months prior a holiday season.

[insert your own comedic relief here]

**Edit**
After reading through the thread (after my posting) I see the idiocy start to seep in and hereby delete my post and participation in this thread. Thanks for trying Cole.

reply to post by canucks555

Christian, and a follower of Jesus. That's redundant

No it's not. Many religions are referred to as "Christian". It has become a generic religious term.
This person stated that Jesus was their personal savior.

There are some people that cannot write. Yet they are wiser than this forum combined. Stringing words together has nothing to do with whether or not they have a right to chastise others.

I explained in my post that the OP composed a very intelligent, well-reasoned thread. It was thought-provoking and insightful, yet the atheist just dismissed it as ignorant and unscientific. They sneered at it. I thought that was a bit conceited. Don't you?

Honestly it sounds to me as though you're angry that people don't believe in your God.

I don't know what gave you that idea. I didn't even give my opinion on what or who God is.
I stated clearly that I was put off by atheists who mock Christians as being 'unscientific'.

reply to post by Aphorism

Is there any reason to believe otherwise save for perhaps to satiate the vain desires of an irrational fear?

I happen to believe in a creator, a supreme intelligence, a divine force, a God. The descriptions are all just semantics.
I can assure you, my belief didn't arise from a need to satiate a vain desire.

reply to post by ColeYounger


When anyone says " There is no God. " or " God does not exist. " And actually
believes what they are saying, as if they know it to be true. They have not only
demonstrated a total disregard for how much they do not know. But have also failed
miserably to understand that the amount of what they don't know could be infinite.
So atheism is fine. Until the atheist opens his mouth or begins to write.

reply to post by ColeYounger

First and foremost…
Rejecting anything and everything that you consider theological, religious, or spiritual
doesn’t automatically make you “scientific-minded”. On the contrary, it makes you close-minded. It actually makes you unscientific. Real scientists seek the truth, and don’t reject something out of hand because it isn’t plainly visible or proven. A real scientist could look at a tree and at least entertain the idea that there could be a designer, an intelligence, a creator behind it.

Blindly following the words of men written 2000 years ago is the same thing as the above.

There are people much smarter than you who believe in God. There are physicists, mathematicians and biologists with stellar I.Q.s who believe in a creator.

Yet none of them are capable of proving the existence of God.

There are some deep thinkers out there who have pushed their very sanity to its limits, grappling with concepts that are beyond the realm of human understanding.

None of the things that scientists study are 'beyond the realm of understanding' otherwise, no scientific success or breakthroughs would have occurred over the last..forever.

Feel free to believe that “spiritual” = “unscientific”. Go ahead and believe that when you die, it’s The End, and you’re worm food. Go ahead and believe, essentially, in nothing beyond our limited consciousness and awareness.

I'm an Agnostic Atheist. I know the God of the bible doesn't exist, because God certainly isn't a single parent who writes books, cares what TV I watch or who I sleep with.

Here's where I stand. The God of scripture shows NOTHING but human qualities. Some of them quite dark if we look at the Old Testament. A god of that great power and standing would never act 'like' a human. The concept that we were created in 'God's Imagine' essentially means we are fake copies of what he's achieved through whatever means he has.

God didn't create a whole race of "God's", otherwise, what would he have to do?

I'm getting off off topic here, but you see where I'm coming from.

I’ll leave you with a quote from “The Count of Monte Cristo”

Edmond Dantes: I don't believe in God.
Abbe Faria (the priest): It doesn't matter. He believes in you.

A quote from a fictional character in order to drive home the teachings of another.

Quite well done.

~Tenth

randyvs
reply to post by ColeYounger

 

When anyone says " There is no God. " or " God does not exist. " And actually
believes what they are saying, as if they know it to be true. They have not only
demonstrated a total disregard for how much they do not know. But have also failed
miserably to understand that the amount of what they don't know could be infinite.
So atheism is fine. Until the atheist opens his mouth or begins to write.

I can say the same thing:

When anyone says " There is a God. " or " God exists. " And actually
believes what they are saying, as if they know it to be true. They have not only
demonstrated a total disregard for how much they do not know. But have also failed
miserably to understand that the amount of what they don't know could be infinite.
So Christianity is fine. Until the christian opens his mouth or begins to write.

sheeesh are YOU for real? Like really? It's OK for Christians to spew proof-less BS. But if a non-believer calls some out, were infinitely stupid?

I don't know what gave you that idea.

It is impossible not to notice the disdain in your thread towards atheists. The wording used, the way you've written it, the Calling out all Atheists title..

Of course, within an hour's time, one of the local atheists posted the obligatory comment

"atheist attacks"

In your defense, it’s human nature to doubt.



You're pissed that people don't agree with your mind set. Admit it.