Avoiding Spiritual Burnout and Dark Night of the Soul

reply to post by BlueMule


Making the unconscious conscious is the art of mysticism. Anything outside of that is spirituality or religion or or pure nonsense.

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by BDBinc

 

I believe I've stated that exact thing no less than 3 times on ats so far.

But people asked me to write about spiritual burnout so I have.

Sometimes I use people's imprecise terms to move a conversation along but nearly always clarify.

Also 'spirit' can be used in multiple contexts which have different meanings.

So you know there is no such thing as "spiritual burnout" but people asked you to write about it so you are pretending there is such a concept, and in that telling them there is.
"Spiritual" can also be used in multiple contexts which have different meanings but that doesn't stop you from using THAT word.

reply to post by BDBinc


If you've read what I've written and comprehended it in the way it was intended to be communicated, then you couldn't say those words.

Do you wear red dresses?

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Yes, that reply was, to an extent, even more helpful than the other kind replies you have taken the time to provide.

First off, in case I came off as too "gee whiz," I simply find your communications wholesome, deep and welcome and in no way am I seeking a "teacher" external to myself... if such is possible. I hope that doesn't come off as too defensive, and rather defines the place my questioning comes from and possibly save time. But your views are certainly unique, thought provoking and I have boatloads of respect/affection for you.

One thing, of the many more inexpressible things the post(s) provoked in me, was a want of a more complete definition of compassion. "A formless fire of compassion" sounds dandy and properly mystic, but what do you mean?

I think of compassion as it is defined, like hugging someone in pain when you have had such a pain, and sincerely loving them enough to not want them hurting (to some degree) as you have. But isn't this sort of condescending and separating?

Not that I think compassion is wrong or that more isn't needed in this world, but in terms of a state that sets one free of self imposed bonds... well, can you elaborate a tad, please? Compassion separate from love? (insert smiley face to get across kind bemusement)


Edit x2: and also, it occurs to me in this line of thought I glean from your threads (and others thoughts, like R. Wilson's for example), that human verbal/written communication is almost nothing BUT memes and programming and thus incredibly difficult to use to attempt a state free of memes/ programing... another "finger trap?"

reply to post by Baddogma


I'm very impressed by your willingness to listen and consider things outside of the usual drivel.

There is genuine compassion and there is 'spiritual comoassion'. 'Spiritual compassion' is this hideous drek where a self-appointed guru 'smiles upon a poor lost soul' and perhaps transfers a little 'energy' and then pats him or herself on the back. This is obviously not genuine compassion.

Now genuine compassion is an automated response where one part of life reaches for another part of life and does what can be done..'illusion and all' without even thinking about the existence of any boundaries on the part of 'either party'.

When one learns who one is and this alignment becomes habitual then this becomes the nonconceptual fire of compassion.

If your compassion is 'yours' then it is not real compassion; that is mere pity.

Does that help?

reply to post by Baddogma


Yup on your edit.

Verbal concepts are what separate us from the other animals and at the core of all suffering.

When you learn how to stop craving the accumulation of self concepts and see it for the folly that it is then you become 'liberated'.

Once 'liberated' compassion comes naturally as the 'self maker' starts to see 'everything and everyone' as a pattern of interest for purposes of interaction (often to include compassion).

Does that clarify?

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by BDBinc

 

If you've read what I've written and comprehended it in the way it was intended to be communicated, then you couldn't say those words.

Do you wear red dresses?

I can say those words & I explained what is it that "burns out" ,its not "spiritual burnout "as there is no such experience, personal burn outs happen all the time.
How can you possibly know how your thread is being comprehended?
To me writing about spiritual burnout when the spirit does not burnout is incomprehensible.

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


I am glad you are impressed, my guru... heh (lightly chiding with "guru".. never again... sir?). But being free of memes and dogmas was a hard fought, many year long process and I wasn't even steeped in religion as a child... and that being said I am STILL neck deep in dogmas I correct myself about constantly.

Being human and having contact with other humans requires these dogmatic finger traps... on one level, anyway. The trick is attempting mindfulness about them, it seems. And adding a qualifying "it seems" or "maybe" to everything one utters can be tiring and get some weird looks... I should get a t-shirt with "maybe" on it... perhaps?

But, yeah, that clarification helped immensely. I hope to someday be that purely compassionate... without doubt or qualifiers or masturbatory asshole-ness.

This reminds me of a fairly recent episode where it seemed like an entity was trying to ensnare my belief through a stranger I met on the phone. He was a dying, mystic christian who was veeery smart and rational and through my own "compassion (qualified)" I helped this obviously lonely guy by taking his rather long phone calls.

He had all the lines and was trying to "save my unbelieving soul" (convert me) and any laughter I had was "the devil of mockery possessing me" and by gosh, a few undeniably mystical/paranormal things happened that had me really wondering "Holy S*&T, what IF???"

I came to my senses before any real damage was done, but those few minutes of considering belief in even a loving higher power was intuitively a trap... and thus the resonance with much of what you say.

I've had run ins with nasty things without bodies, too... so as my experiences with the odd are so numerous, I've wondered if something craving belief was on a fishing expedition. Your idea of a human-soul collective perhaps? But again, that's a maybe dogma, heh, but helpful concept nonetheless.

reply to post by BDBinc


If people call it that and think about it that way I'm not going to be rude if they are sincere.

Besides as stated earlier there is some contextual based and gray area factors. I certainly wouldn't be an ass about shades of meaning. I don't see value in playing the peanut gallery game.

I am finished responding to this particular query.

Thanks.

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by BlueMule

 

Making the unconscious conscious is the art of mysticism. Anything outside of that is spirituality or religion or or pure nonsense.

That rings true. 'Making the void sentient'. But I'm not a mystic anymore. I'm a broken has-been. My mind and body is not healthy anymore, and my unconscious mind won't leave me the f*** alone.

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by UnifiedSerenity

 

I wouldn't dream of disturbing your solid convictions.

Thanks for your response.

KPB

I am just pointing our your logic problems here. You can believe what you want, but if you think I create evil because I believe in good, then it goes with logic that if you believe in compassion you are creating suffering.

I do believe your convictions are just as solid as mine, but at least I am not illogical.

reply to post by Baddogma


A concept usable as a thorn to remove other thorns can have value; but of course use it sparingly.

No, no harm using a general concept like "the field". The field or just the general uncompassionate nature of suffering people often loves to tear others down to make themselves feel better. There's no need to let that get you down. And also nothing wrong with just ignoring the field if you are so inclined. Not everything has to be a teaching opportunity.

Please don't call me a guru.

Love chatting with you. Drop me a pm sometime.

reply to post by UnifiedSerenity


Compassion is nondualustic.
"Good" and "evil" are either personal opinions or generic phrases.

I'm perfectly cool with you and could care less what your positions are; those are a personal matter for you only.

Thanks for stopping by.

reply to post by BlueMule


Awww BM, I feel compassion for ya, bro! I too have the dream meanies shouting at me so that I avoid sleep or drug myself (lightly) into repose to avoid remembering the hellish weirdness my mind (or whatever) creates.

Heh, I'd pray for you... but ... geez, no wonder folks seek powers to help the seeming powerlessness.

Edit: and have you ever just asked "yourself" to have more pleasant dreams? I ask because it occurred to me that I have NOT regarding my own difficulties. Hmmm...

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by BDBinc

 

If people call it that and think about it that way I'm not going to be rude if they are sincere.

Besides as stated earlier there is some contextual based and gray area factors. I certainly wouldn't be an ass about shades of meaning. I don't see value in playing the peanut gallery game.

I am finished responding to this particular query.

Thanks.

Incomprehensible.
No such thing as a "spiritual burnout" (only personal burn outs) .

reply to post by BlueMule


Your honesty is very refreshing and goes to show just how much potential you have to grow. You are in fact very fortunate. I'd take you over 1000 self appointed geniuses.

Let me know if I can help.

reply to post by KellyPrettyBear


Yup... and okay, no G word ... even joshing.

And the semantic and turbulent mystic pissing contests are amusing ... provided one doesn't have to expend energy and dry cleaning money playing in it.

Skoal.

reply to post by BDBinc


Please refer to my previous post.
Your incomprehension is a personal matter that is not of interest to me or I would imagine the dozen odd people who get this thread.

I wish you well; but I have no further interest in communicating with you. I have limited time like us all and that means I prioritize my time for people who are interested In interacting WITH me in a fruitful manner and not just attempt to spin useless minutiae into a fruitless exercise in self titilation.

But thanks for this life experience.

KPB

reply to post by Baddogma


If people want to piss on themselves thats fine with me. I'm not interested in melodrama. This is all about time management for me.

KellyPrettyBear
reply to post by BDBinc

 

Please refer to my previous post.
Your incomprehension is a personal matter that is not of interest to me or I would imagine the dozen odd people who get this thread.

I wish you well; but I have no further interest in communicating with you. I have limited time like us all and that means I prioritize my time for people who are interested In interacting WITH me in a fruitful manner and not just attempt to spin useless minutiae into a fruitless exercise in self titilation.

But thanks for this life experience.

KPB

Don't respond to the fact there is no such thing as "spiritual burnout ".