Common Lies That Satan Tell

reply to post by AfterInfinity


I worry for you AI, I think you're in danger of hardening your position to the point of no return "after infinity"..

Please read that story I offered, it's so insightful.

reply to post by NewAgeMan

I worry for you AI, I think you're in danger of hardening your position to the point of no return "after infinity"..

I would rather be absolutely and irrevocably terminated than live forever without respite. I am of the firm conviction that I can run out of things to live for. I would rather not confirm this through experience and find myself unable to do anything about it. That would be a special kind of hell for me, one that is decidely unworthwhile given the BS I'd have to go through to earn it.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


As far as I can tell it is too late, it having already been decided from the get-go that it's infinitely better for there to be something and the possibility for growth, and experience, from life to life, than nothing at all. In other words that we're already in eternity, already "after infinity" and almost certainly framed within the context of a monistic idealism (where consciousness is primary, not matter) and therefore, the possibility for annihilation, as per the folly of the person who commits suicide for example, has already been ruled out as valueless.

As to God and heaven, it's probably best not to assume a terminal boredom, but that we might get to anticipate a new creation with lots of novel forms to play with in a context that just keeps on getting better and better maybe even to the degree that one might at some point if they (we) so choose, safely be able to "pass away" with confidence and for all the right reasons, not according to their own selfish will and limited conceptions, but according to the perfect will, in which case there is likely to be yet another pleasant surprise in store.

My concern for you is that you may have already locked yourself into a hardened position based on a type of conceit - please read the story and you'll know what I mean. And yes I'm aware that it's allegorical.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


I'm not assuming anything. I response according to context, and you are a Christian, are you not? Then again, it's not like all Christians have a universal concept of what heaven or hell is like. Consistency has never been a major priority with you people.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


There is a rational basis to posit it's existence, along with the notion that there is and can be no marriage between heaven and hell.

You're the one with the user name "after infinity" after all..

AfterInfinity
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

I worry for you AI, I think you're in danger of hardening your position to the point of no return "after infinity"..

I would rather be absolutely and irrevocably terminated than live forever without respite. I am of the firm conviction that I can run out of things to live for. I would rather not confirm this through experience and find myself unable to do anything about it. That would be a special kind of hell for me, one that is decidely unworthwhile given the BS I'd have to go through to earn it.

You can't and (if you got there) didn't "earn it". Why can't you understand that concept (unmerited Grace, forgiveness)?

Just one last little minuscule twist of a lie is what the "devil" would like you to swallow don't forget.

Do you presume that outside of heaven is nothing without the possibility for conscious awareness however feeble?

If "heaven" is the domain of limitless possibility, then it's rather more likely that you would have the freedom to choose your destiny in that domain/realm, but you are so conditioned by your own bias and conceit that you would be just like those ghosts in the story who refused to stay and got back on the bus for the ride back to hell.

I am learning much from it, and there's plenty in there that reminds me of you, and so my thoughts turned to you and to a potential predicament that is brewing for you as you continue to harden your position.

If you do choose to read the story, you may note, with some delight, that many in hell are "Christians", even those bent on proving the existence of God but who care nothing for God. One Pastor who ended up in hell for apostasy was hell bent on returning there to start a new speaking ministry directed to any and all who would listen. He had no interest of course in actually getting to see the face of God Himself (the Reality) while in heaven. It's absolutely hilarious imho. I thought it might be up your alley.

Best Regards,

NAM

#5. You can be a God

#12. God hates you

You know what I find interesting?

People abssolutely and confidently knowing what everything is all about...LOL

Oh and OP...there are many paths to Jesus/God whatever you want to call him/her/it.

Get over yourself.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

I'm not assuming anything. I response according to context, and you are a Christian, are you not? Then again, it's not like all Christians have a universal concept of what heaven or hell is like. Consistency has never been a major priority with you people.

edit on 15-11-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)

Do you think maybe we don't have consistency is not that we are inconsistent, but that we can never have a firm grasp of what all is there? How do you explain infinity if you have never experienced infinity?

Is infinity a constant recycle? That still means life here is limited and finite. Life begins and life ends, here, on this planet. There is no infinity here. That's what we are trying to explain, life is finite. If this is all there is, then you are finite, and still trying to fathom an infinity.

The one thing all Christians and Jews are consistent in, that side, that world to come, the spiritual realm is infinite. We say "that world to come" means that it is being prepared infinitely for us. You living or dying here, has no bearing whatsoever on that infinite world. Your imagination or lack of has no bearing. Your intelligence has no bearing. The infinite always has been and always will be, regardless of the faith system talking about it.

We have gotten only a tiny taste of that, and in that makes us realize and understand that in our finite nature, something is there that is infinite. That is infinite in design, purpose, intelligence, everything. Do I have to exist for the infinite to exist? I say no, because I recognize I am finite. But if the soul is infinite, then it must come and go to an infinite place.

Neither belief or non-belief is infinite, you may believe one day a thing and the next day another. So even if your belief is finite, then what bearing does it have on what is infinite? This planet was here the day before you were born and will be here the day after you die. Did it take you believing it for the planet to exist?

reply to post by WarminIndy


True, and it's already been pointed out - this side of the veil, even the best and most consistent imagery ie: washed robes, wedding feast, little people exalted, self-exalted people embarrassed etc. as good as it is, and as valid as it may be, are all SYMBOLIC, and not the thing itself. We know that, he knows that. His comment was therefore disingenuous and spiteful nothing more. Personally I'm getting rather used to it, and instead of irking me, it's moving me to pity and a deep sadness for my fellow man and brother.

reply to post by 2WitnessesArrived


I agree with your sentiment, but I have to tell you that Isaiah 14:12 is written in the Hebrew as sarcasm toward the fallen king of Babylon, not Satan. This is one of the most misunderstood and misquoted verses in the entire Bible. Besides, Satan doesn't fall from Heaven until Revelation 12 right before the tribulation kicks off in Revelation 13. Until that point Satan goes between Earth and Heaven as seen in Job 1.

NewAgeMan
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

True, and it's already been pointed out - this side of the veil, even the best and most consistent imagery ie: washed robes, wedding feast, little people exalted, self-exalted people embarrassed etc. as good as it is, and as valid as it may be, are all SYMBOLIC, and not the thing itself. We know that, he knows that. His comment was therefore disingenuous and spiteful nothing more. Personally I'm getting rather used to it, and instead of irking me, it's moving me to pity and a deep sadness for my fellow man and brother.

And for the Christian, we believe Christ came from infinity and returned to infinity. That where He is, we will be there also. He tore that veil.

That's greater than we can even imagine. What we thought was a finite human, was in fact an infinite being. That's the source of conflict then, "how can this man say he is infinite?" In the finite mind of those men, who said they believed in an infinite God, refused to believe that the infinite was real, even though they said it was. That is the same conflict today. Those Jewish leaders were not just Jewish, they were men with limited human understanding. We have to remember that they were men.

And that is the same thing said today "How can this man be infinite?" But not only that, said we could be as well. That's what is even more amazing about it all.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Not an expert in animal behavior, but on my way to becoming an expert in human behavior.

Theory of Humaniqueness

“Animals share many of the building blocks that comprise human thought, but paradoxically, there is a great cognitive gap between humans and animals,” Hauser says. “By looking at key differences in cognitive abilities, we find the elements of human cognition that are uniquely human. The challenge is to identify which systems animals and human share, which are unique, and how these systems interact and interface with one another.”

Recently, scientists have found that some animals think in ways that were once considered unique to humans: For example, some animals have episodic memory, or non-linguistic mathematical ability, or the capacity to navigate using landmarks. However, despite these apparent similarities, a cognitive gulf remains between humans and animals.

Hauser presents four distinguishing ingredients of human cognition, and shows how these capacities make human thought unique. These four novel components of human thought are the ability to combine and recombine different types of information and knowledge in order to gain new understanding; to apply the same “rule” or solution to one problem to a different and new situation; to create and easily understand symbolic representations of computation and sensory input; and to detach modes of thought from raw sensory and perceptual input.

Just an opposing view to you to pick your brain with.

WarminIndy

And for the Christian, we believe Christ came from infinity and returned to infinity. That where He is, we will be there also. He tore that veil.

Yes, how astounding!

We tend to forget about that when considering the demarcation point between the here, and the hereafter.

Turns out we're already in eternity or infinity now (after infinity) and at any given point we may leave the hell of our own making, which was locked from the inside (LOL!), and begin the process of moving into heaven or the domain of the holy of holies (domain of absolute freedom in the freedom to freely LOVE).

This is why C.S. Lewis my new favorite writer has pointed out that there are no ordinary people where the people we meet and interact with, are either some sort of splendor in the making we can hardly imagine, or a monstrous nightmare that we will at some point be forced to ignore altogether and leave behind. It's already a rapture, where some are being left behind in the fog of darkness, while others are in the process of being glorified, who though they are in the world are not of it, and who will still be standing within a frame and a context we cannot yet imagine, when the last star of this creation winks out of existence.

And in either case, whether the destiny is heaven or hell, from that POV, once fully ensconced, it will be like that's the way it always was, because it's timeless, spaceless, flowing backwards from the end state.

Many NDE experiences bear this out in one way or another, except for the fact that they did not remain where they found themselves to be.

There is nothing that is not.

There is no escape.

We're either in a type of hell of our own making or on our way to the objective truth and the Reality as it really is. The veil between subjective isolate consciousness and the absolute objective reality has been torn from top to bottom.

The implications of this fact cannot be understated.

We would also be well served I think to consider the Bible whole and complete, meaning that on the other side of the "dark night of the soul" of Revelation in it's horrific and destructive symbolism, it's safe to turn to the last page and behold the happy ending.

Otherwise, as far as I can tell we fall victim to a trap designed to test our mettle, where you have all these so-called "Christians" waiting anxiously for a level of death and destruction not seen since the great flood.

Satan has already been bound and thrown into the abyss or outer darkness, and what we're seeing at most is the final thrashing around in the chains of Christ's reason and logic.

I think that what we are beginning to discover, even beyond Paul's legalism is a "Good News" or a Gospel of which we can barely even begin to fathom in it's farthest reaching implications and significance.

Jesus understood that we (our souls) are immortal beings and did everything that was necessary to preserve and hold in reserve the resurrection life, something that we would be very wise to begin to enter into while still on the way, to prepare for the thing itself, which comes to us all.

The material world is but a very very dim reflection of a much much greater REALITY, and again that's the reports we get back from the NDE'ers, that this is the shadow world (mortal, corruptible), by reflection, and the hereafter is the REAL one.

This fact of life is either very scary, even terrifying, or, a joy and a celebration and a triumph of which we had no prior conception.

It brings me to tears of repentance and then to the laughter and love by the hand that wipes away the tears from my eyes, oh Lord have mercy on my soul.


Best Regards,

NAM aka Bob

P.S. It's not an intimidation however, not a should and shouldn't, but a what is and what ought to be on the ground of all being and becoming and where we come up short, and where we fall there is authentic forgiveness in a Justice matched in it's height and breadth only by it's tender Mercy.

It's nothing less than the free gift of Life itself as it really is, and that's no lie.

NewAgeMan
WarminIndy

NewAgeMan
It's not an intimidation however, not a should and shouldn't, but a what is and what ought to be on the ground of all being and becoming and where we come up short, and where we fall there is authentic forgiveness in a Justice matched in it's height and breadth only by it's tender Mercy. It's nothing less than the free gift of Life itself as it really is, and that's no lie.

Progression of the individual soul. Every life we fail to progress or balance we have to return in another body and future time period. We are programed to fail, if succeeded in the past life are doomed to failure in the next. This is entirely unfair. Life is not free, we are either stuck here in the Karmic Wheel trapped or we negotiated a human body to inhabit (at least one time and that could be the starving infant in Somalia); any body will do just to be able to say "I was a human once". Bodies are scarcities these days because the waiting line to soul inhabit is 100s of years and miles long.

AfterInfinity
reply to post by NewAgeMan

AfterInfinity
I would rather be absolutely and irrevocably terminated than live forever without respite. I am of the firm conviction that I can run out of things to live for. I would rather not confirm this through experience and find myself unable to do anything about it. That would be a special kind of hell for me, one that is decidely unworthwhile given the BS I'd have to go through to earn it.

You will live forever; cannot extinguish your spark, this planet and being a human has you hypnotised. THIS is not REAL, (3d 'feels' solid and is very convincing; but is just an accelerated learning tool). You will laugh at all of it once out of the trap of the physical body, and find out whats really going on beyond this dimension which only mirrors what you or that other realm really are (just more solid). There is so much more freedom beyond gross matter. You asked for this experience and when granted it are unhappy? NAM says you are gifted this life (no you fought to experience this), (a gift unwanted Id return to sender because of the VERY emotional highs and lows) you seem to be buckling under your original contract; a game you knew youd be playing right along with the rest of us.

IN REPLY TO akushla99

vethumanbeing
Washington is set out as a cross with angles, and you can percieve the connecting points up or down depending upon your stance. Bottom would be percieved as the goat head upside down. What is the point of this missive? No reason to keep ones guard up? I dont at all, as you are joking and need no armaments, maybe a trap door disposal mechanism (who pulls the leaver)? I answered your post 2 up; I dont believe in Satan and am having a problem with your inclination to bait others into a false premise to engage conversation that whittles without substance.

akushla99; this paragraph was not directed at you, it was directed to/at the OPs premise of thread posit (sorry for any misunderstanding).

reply to post by vethumanbeing


If freedom reigns supreme, then those who wish to perish and be irrevocably terminated will surely be granted their wish, but in the last instant they will surely know the truth, that this was by their own choice and not as a necessity, and so in the final analysis they will not be granted the last laugh, which cannot be silenced, nor the unending joy of heaven.

And God will say to them "thy will be done".

"There are only two kinds of people in the end: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those to whom God says, in the end, 'Thy will be done.'"

~ C.S. Lewis, "The Great Divorce"

NewAgeMan
reply to post by vethumanbeing

NewAgeMan
If freedom reigns supreme, then those who wish to perish and be irrevocably terminated will surely be granted their wish, but in the last instant they will surely know the truth, that this was by their own choice and not as a necessity, and so in the final analysis they will not be granted the last laugh, which cannot be silenced, nor the unending joy of heaven. And God will say to them "thy will be done".

As you allude to "God" will say "by thine OWN WILL you have done it to yourself". Freedom allows the choice to languish/perish in misery or to control/direct ones own existance. Its been accomplished, name all of the immigrants across contintinents and time periods that have improved their living conditions (countless). The last laugh will be as you say, after forfitting or loosing this material body to negligence or lack of WILL/ will have to qualify why they gave it up so easily or willingly; when it was so hard fought to occupy one in the first place. They choose, no one else can take the blame. What happens? Comedy Club stage revisit with a lot of cat calls; "YOU HAD NO CLUE", "COULD ONE NOT REALISE THE POINT OF EXISTANCE AS A HUMAN (in an actuarial averaged) 75 year time frame; wasnt enough to discover your purpose of being, or the fact you had a creator"? Tickets please, those that are darwinist amoeba slug types (NO VERTEBRA) get in free (5 drink algae minumum applies).

SisyphusRide
#5. You can be a God
#12. God hates you

I KNEW IT, God IS a psychopathic schizophrenic.