Understanding Religious Opposition

reply to post by AbleEndangered

Dude, we been through this already in another thread!!

You ready to get slammed again??

I feel this is an opportune moment to remind you that this thread isn't about me personally, so if you feel like breaking T&C's, then go for it.

Not that I think you could slam me if you tried.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


On this Wiki quote page:

en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein
en.wikiquote.org...

The word "God" comes up 118 times!! 118!!

How can you explain away these quotes from someone that obviously had a lot of "God" on the brain??

and again...

From the page you referenced:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_views_of_Albert_Einstein
en.wikipedia.org...

Einstein had previously explored the belief that man could not understand the nature of God. In an interview published in 1930 in G. S. Viereck's book Glimpses of the Great, Einstein, in response to a question about whether or not he believed in God, explained:

Your question [about God] is the most difficult in the world. It is not a question I can answer simply with yes or no. I am not an Atheist. I do not know if I can define myself as a Pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. May I not reply with a parable? The human mind, no matter how highly trained, cannot grasp the universe. We are in the position of a little child, entering a huge library whose walls are covered to the ceiling with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written those books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books, a mysterious order, which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of the human mind, even the greatest and most cultured, toward God. We see a universe marvelously arranged, obeying certain laws, but we understand the laws only dimly. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that sways the constellations. I am fascinated by Spinoza's Pantheism. I admire even more his contributions to modern thought. Spinoza is the greatest of modern philosophers, because he is the first philosopher who deals with the soul and the body as one, not as two separate things.[19]

Did you read them last time I linked it??



Do "Atheists" read??

reply to post by AbleEndangered


Yes, atheists read, comprehend... and question.

It is the questioning that religious people don't like, because all the religions have is a bunch of canned answers, and interpretations of canned answers.

Not everything can be answered from a single perspective.

reply to post by puzzlesphere


Too bad there is no such thing as an Atheist...

reply to post by AbleEndangered

How can you explain away these quotes from someone that obviously had a lot of "God" on the brain??

Are you saying I believe in God too? Because I type the word a lot. Not because I believe in one, but because I talk to so many people who do. People who are intent on convincing the rest of the world that their anti-science is just as good as science. Which, fortunately, it isn't. Ever tried Sweet 'n' Low? It's a sugar substitute. And it freakin' sucks. Not even close to matching the real deal. But it tries.

Kind of like science and religion.

Let's use another example. Just because you use the word "science" in a lot of your sermons, doesn't mean science actually substantiates your claims. Unless proof, words are free. Which is why Einstein ran into the word God a lot. Because no one had to actually pay to talk about it, which means every dolt who decided to match wits with him on concepts that offended their religiosity was able to do so with very little effort. Had they decided to exert some effort, he might have actually bought into their way of thinking.

But as I demonstrated with the excerpt I posted above, he didn't.

As to the rest of your post: "I don't know" isn't the same as "I believe in God".

So tell me, can you read? Because I don't think you do. I think you interpret instead of reading. "What can I do to this sentence to make it sound like it agrees with me?" That's the impression I get every time I read one of your posts. That's the process I see behind the words.

Nice try, but I'm still standing.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


I will help you!

Understanding God = Understanding the Universe!!

Simple, Right??

reply to post by AbleEndangered

I will help you!

Understanding God = Understanding the Universe!!

Simple, Right??

Understanding the universe = understanding the universe

And we're not even close.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


The Study of God helps in this effort...

Neglecting God as a variable destroys the Equation....

reply to post by AbleEndangered

The Study of God helps in this effort...

Neglecting God as a variable destroys the Equation....

Let me explain this to you in very simple terms to avoid any misunderstanding. There is, at this time, a universal equation. You already know this, although you may not know exactly the one I speak of. Here, I'll narrow it down for you.

The final step in the graph requires resolving the separation between quantum mechanics and gravitation, often equated with general relativity. Numerous researchers concentrate their efforts on this specific step; nevertheless, no accepted theory of quantum gravity – and thus no accepted theory of everything – has emerged yet. It is usually assumed that the ToE will also solve the remaining problems of GUTs.

en.wikipedia.org...

Now, your statement is that the separation between quantum mechanics and gravitation is both exclusively and conclusively determined to be an intelligent force whose description is most closely matched by that of the Christian Bible? Or just that it is exclusively and conclusively an intelligent force whose intention is to preserve our souls for...what?

See, the link I provided entails a clear and concise explanation of how the contents of that graph were established, and what is needed in order to finish the equation. What you've done is answer a question that has barely begun to be asked. Furthermore, you answered it out of emotion rather than actual reason. That's not science. That's desperation. Pure, self-serving desperation and a remarkable need to resist the natural processes of the universe. You're afraid of something, and you're afraid to even admit that you are afraid. That's why you've chosen to hide from even yourself. The perfect illusion is the one you don't perceive. The one that slips right by you.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Acts 17 KJV

27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

Colossians 1 KJV

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

2 Peter 3 KJV

1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:

2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

We do not understand Gravity. We do not understand the forces of the Universe.

All "I" can do is testify what I do know. The same way Einstein testified what he knew...

If I were to make this claim, then I would be bearing bad fruit!! But...

In the end, the cartoon that is questioning the cartoonist can only do so much, can only test so much.

For the cartoon lives on a plane that God can see and manipulate clearly while the cartoon scrambles to understood the manipulations of the cartoonist.

We can't exit our cartoon or simulation til our mechanisms cease.

We are all following the rules of the game that was made.

Every element of existence has to follow these rules of the simulation. The Parameters.

We can only Fathom what is on the other side, and we do a poor job of that.



For better understanding a person can only turn inward and ask their own conscience.

The sense of knowing Right and Wrong!!

I have spoke many times about this sense, it is a powerful one!!

-Theodore Parker
Outward judgment often fails, inward judgment never.

-Theodore Parker
Look at the facts of the world. You see a continual and progressive triumph of the right. I do not pretend to understand the moral universe; the arc is a long one, my eye reaches but little ways; I cannot calculate the curve and complete the figure by the experience of sight; I can divine it by conscience. And from what I see I am sure it bends towards justice.

We can never test the gaps...

Faith will fill them...



Unified Theory, Theory of Everything, Holographic Universe, Electric Universe, Living Universe. Muiti-verse...

We cannot see past our own Cellular Wall or Event Horizon like another member put it...

Cosmic background radiation
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_background_radiation
en.wikipedia.org...

Some good reads here:

resonance.is/
resonance.is...

hiup.org/publications/
hiup.org...

Papers on this page consist of:

Quantum Gravity and the Holographic Mass

The Schwarzschild Proton

Scale Unification – A Universal Scaling Law For Organized Matter

and more. You probably seen this page already from other posts I have done.

The author of these papers is a known UFOlogist and man of Faith....

reply to post by AbleEndangered


Yeah, I'm done with you. You promised me a good challenge, but you're not even taking this seriously. If all you have to offer is this gobbledygook, then I'm out. There's no point to arguing with a casette player.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

AfterInfinity
reply to post by AbleEndangered

 

Yeah, I'm done with you. You promised me a good challenge, but you're not even taking this seriously. If all you have to offer is this gobbledygook, then I'm out. There's no point to arguing with a casette player.

Very Good!

Haha, I didn't stumble into your trap!!

Can't take it that a book that old can be so informative?....

I find it burns some peoples eyes to read it!!

-Albert Einstein
You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else.

You will be surprised at what is in the Bible:

Aliens
Flying Saucers
Motherships
Other Planets
Asteroids
Genetic Manipulation
Medicines & Health Topics
Diet
Diamagnetics

Science...

and on and on...



Reading is really good!

Read it, and you will see it.

Stop combating something you have no knowledge of!!

Flint - "It's better to tell the truth" - A G.I. Joe PSA
www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oMTBQAki_c
www.youtube.com...


and Knowing is half the Battle!!

reply to post by AbleEndangered


No, I just find that you don't make a very good conversational partner. You talk a lot, listen little, and don't think at all. This isn't a debate. This is you trying to make yourself look good. I won't play that game. See how good you look talking to an empty thread. Even the OP has left.

At the very least, we now understand why there is opposition to religion. Thank you for justifying the behavior this thread called into question.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


No, No, Thank you!!

AbleEndangered
reply to post by AfterInfinity

 

You will be surprised at what is in the Bible:

Aliens
Flying Saucers
Motherships
Other Planets
Asteroids
Genetic Manipulation
Medicines & Health Topics
Diet
Diamagnetics

Science...

and on and on...

 

Reading is really good!

edit on 7-11-2013 by AbleEndangered because: additions

Interpretation of the Bible seems to be largely based on what I would call "reading into," not just "reading." People can read all kinds of things into these texts and filter or manipulate the words to suit their agendas. How do you "know" that your interpretation is the correct one when there exist so many differing (and often wildly contradictory) perspectives on what the Bible says and means? I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of Christians would disagree with you about at least part of what you believe about the Bible, God, the universe, etc. and it isn't like you're the only person in history who has studied and thought deeply about these matters. Why should I believe your version of "The Truth" above anyone else's?

reply to post by opopanax


Which element are you contesting isn't in the Bible?

All of them?

Then read it and prove to me it isn't in there!!

luciddream
OP is telling skeptics to not question?

No. OP was asking skeptics why they spend so much time and energy opposing something they don't even believe exists. Question answered... mostly, it's to deny what you perceive as ignorance. Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder, though. One man's ignorance is another man's truth. No proof can be found for either viewpoint; thus, no amount of bickering back and forth will ever change anyone's mind. The issue will settle itself eventually, no matter how much debating is done. Makes it all seem rather pointless to me.

The religious fora are for religious people to discuss religious matters with other religious people, but it's never possible to do so because every thread gets overwhelmed with the non-religious opposing the religious. Yes, there are far more of you. We are the minority. We need a place where we can just sit and talk quietly amongst ourselves. Why won't you let us have that?

Thought Provoker

luciddream
OP is telling skeptics to not question?

No. OP was asking skeptics why they spend so much time and energy opposing something they don't even believe exists. Question answered... mostly, it's to deny what you perceive as ignorance. Ignorance is in the eye of the beholder, though. One man's ignorance is another man's truth. No proof can be found for either viewpoint; thus, no amount of bickering back and forth will ever change anyone's mind. The issue will settle itself eventually, no matter how much debating is done. Makes it all seem rather pointless to me.

The religious fora are for religious people to discuss religious matters with other religious people, but it's never possible to do so because every thread gets overwhelmed with the non-religious opposing the religious. Yes, there are far more of you. We are the minority. We need a place where we can just sit and talk quietly amongst ourselves. Why won't you let us have that?

You do...on dedicated Christian sites...where you can all agree...

Within this fora...ATS, topic heading is Religion, Faith and Theology...not Christianity, Christianity and Christianity...why are you ignoring this? Religion is not just Christianity, and that is not the topic heading...what are you reading wrong?

Å99

AbleEndangered
reply to post by opopanax

 

Which element are you contesting isn't in the Bible?

All of them?

Then read it and prove to me it isn't in there!!

I did not contest any of the specific elements you mentioned. I posed some general questions, which you (unsurprisingly) disregarded. I have read the Bible. I highly doubt I could sway your beliefs even if I wanted to, which I don't. I was just curious to hear your reasoning re: how you "know" you're right.

On a different note, quoting scripture ad nauseam to non-believers or those who disagree with you is, I believe, more likely to come across as off-putting than it is to convert or convince. It's a good way to "preach to the choir," though.

akushla99
Within this fora...ATS, topic heading is Religion, Faith and Theology...not Christianity, Christianity and Christianity...why are you ignoring this? Religion is not just Christianity, and that is not the topic heading...what are you reading wrong?

Christianity is A religion. This forum is one of only two on ATS dedicated to religious discussions (and faith, and theology). Christianity distinctly falls into that category. I don't see any forum called "Christianity;" thus, this one is by default the only place on ATS where general non-conspiratorial Christianity-centric threads may be started, and every one of them gets invaded. How many threads are there in this forum that focus on Islam, or Buddhism, or Shinto, or Satanism? Damn few. By and large, the threads focus on Christianity, denominational and non-, because that's the dominant religion of the English-speaking world. If ATS had been started in China instead, this forum would probably not have very much in it related to Christianity. Can't you see that what you're doing is no different from someone walking into a library and yelling "Why are there so many books in here??"