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Originally posted by filledcup
minimum wage is problematic in itself. it serves as a safety against those who would decidedly give you 50 cents an hr if they could get away with it because of their greed. but also makes them feel justified in their capitalist transactions that they are following the law and as long as they are they have no motivation to raise their employees salaries out of the kindness of their heart.. lol
but what is a minimum wage job? a garbage collector? while other "more important jobs" pay more? but where would a company be if the garbage collector refused to pick up the garbage? and it piles up outside the company attracting stench and disease from flies and bacteria? suddenly in that scenario the importance of the garbage collector is realized. in effect.. all the garbage collectors of the world can hold this entire capitalist system to ransom to the detriment of every living man woman and child. but they surely arent paid $30 an hour.
people should be paid for their time that they contribute to the development of society in any field. time should have the value. the human resource giving of it's time and energy away from home and family etc. if $30 an hr is a feasible and acceptible payment for a decent standard of living, then everyone should be paid at least $30 an hr. and noone should be working hard and still cannot afford basic comfort and financial independence.
Originally posted by SallieSunshine
When I was young I had a temp job at a high-end department store and it was really the first time I had ever been around rich people. Some of them were nice but a significant number or them were rude, impatient, insulting- a couple of people I witnessed throwing temper tantrums because they wanted something RIGHT NOW and not in 5 minutes. I went away from that job thinking "no wonder people hate the rich- they have so much to be grateful for yet so many of them are negative and hateful."
Of course there are bad people in all walks of life. There are bad poor people, bad middle class people, and bad rich people. There are also good people in every walk of life. You just have to remember that when you choose to hate a group of people you don't injure them nearly as much as you injure yourself with your negative thoughts. So stay positive! Don't focus on the fact that other people have more than you. Focus on what you can do to improve your life if you are not happy with it the way it is.
Sal
Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Is the POORs hatred of WEALTHY ($$$) people legitimate and morally justifiable?
Originally posted by Xtrozero
I agree that there should be no minimum wage jobs, but that comes down to what skill does the job need and how many people would be willing to do it.
The average pay for a garbage collector is 22 dollars an hour or 43,000k per year. It is a physical/dangerous job that not everyone can do.
Maybe, but what are you willing to pay for that hamburger that the 30 buck an hour flipper made? We have had low to high paying jobs for a 1000 years, why is it different today? Why is it different today than lets say 30 years ago?
What makes a job that anyone can do and needs one day of OJT to learn with zero responsibility worth 30 dollars?
I get your point, but I would not hire people because I want to pay them for their valued time they give me, I would hire people as to what they can provide to my company during that time that is scalable in pay to how much an asset they are.
Originally posted by opethPA
I am of the belief that their needs to be class competition.
Not everyone is capable or willing to do what it takes to be successfully, financially viable or whatever measure of being wealthy people want to apply.
Their are horrible, evil people that kill, rape, steal and general do terrible things and are poor in life just like their are wealthy people that do those same things.
I am not saying this is the point of the OP but I do not understand the desire some on ATS have to vilify someone for being successful or happy professionally. I don't understand why some folks here assume that being homeless is somehow more noble then living in a nice house.
All that being said... I don't think a poor person should hate a wealthy person nor do i think a wealthy person should hate a poor person.. Both groups should despise the criminals that exist in both types , and everything in between, of life.
Originally posted by SallieSunshine
I worked my share of crappy low-paying jobs- even with a college degree. I lived in fear of my car breaking down because I had no extra money for repairs and no credit cards. More than once I pawned my sewing machine so I could pay a bill or buy a box of oatmeal. Once I only had a couple of dollars in my bank account and I needed it to buy food - the bank wouldn't give it to me- the only way I could get it was to close my account so that is what I did. So yes I've been through some hard times where I was scraping by. I thought to myself "hmmmm, how can I remedy this situation? I know! I'll go back to school and get a degree that qualifies me for a higher-paying job." So that is what I did- got a student loan and went back to school. Now I don't have to worry so much about getting things fixed when they break down. Hating the rich and moaning about how little you make isn't going to make your life better. You either have to reduce your costs somehow so that you are comfortable with the salary you make, get yourself a part-time job in addition to your full-time job, or get some training so that you will qualify for a higher paying job. Heck there are millions of enterprising illegal aliens in this country with their own businesses- they work as maids, landscapers, food truck owners--- they work hard because they started at the bottom with nothing but the will to succeed. Some of them only have a few sentences of English that they know and yet they make more money than some American who flips burgers for a living and whines about it.
Sal
from filled cup:
alot of ppl are facing stress of the real world. and in the end it boils right back down to money. the wife is nagging. the kids need new bookbags and books, the car needs servicing, the price of groceries keeps going up and salary stays the same. this stress will translate into the work environment. so someone who is stressed from the need for money is damned because they need money.. lol. while the person who is from a more financially secure family and background will be less stressed and better able to focus on their job is rewarded for their good attitude. theyre just lucky!
Originally posted by HanzHenry
Originally posted by opethPA
I am of the belief that their needs to be class competition.
Not everyone is capable or willing to do what it takes to be successfully, financially viable or whatever measure of being wealthy people want to apply.
Their are horrible, evil people that kill, rape, steal and general do terrible things and are poor in life just like their are wealthy people that do those same things.
I am not saying this is the point of the OP but I do not understand the desire some on ATS have to vilify someone for being successful or happy professionally. I don't understand why some folks here assume that being homeless is somehow more noble then living in a nice house.
All that being said... I don't think a poor person should hate a wealthy person nor do i think a wealthy person should hate a poor person.. Both groups should despise the criminals that exist in both types , and everything in between, of life.
Competition in an UNFAIR environment is ------- get ready for it ------> unfair.. yeah PROMOTE THAT.. good MORALITY you have there!
Imagine you owner a pack of hunting dogs that did most of the work. Now, you can feed them all well and provide a good life.. OR, you can SAVE MONEY -------->i.e. INCREASE PROFIT!!! by having the dogs "COMPETE" for scraps.. sure, there WONT be ENOUGH to go around.. but hey, the dog that "works hardest" will get food....
and those other ones... they just didn't work/study hard enough! maybe tomorrow when they are MORE FAMISHED, they will EARN IT!!
great mentality! Me and Mine... that's all that matters...
Love the new attitude so many have, so much easier and less strenuous than doing something for someone WITHOUT seeking reward..edit on 25-8-2013 by HanzHenry because: words
Originally posted by oasisjack
The important thing you and many others seem to forget is you have never met a wealthy person.
What you have met is the next layer down the shady ones who worship the crumbs the wealthy drop by the wayside. The ones who enslave others with debt and low wages while catering and often times trampling the "poor" in favor of the wealthy.
You need look no further than your local hospital to see my point they will let a man die in slow agonising pain if he is poor yet will pump a rich man full of anything he wants for the common cold.
Heck there are millions of enterprising illegal aliens in this country with their own businesses- they work as maids, landscapers, food truck owners--- they work hard because they started at the bottom with nothing but the will to succeed. Some of them only have a few sentences of English that they know and yet they make more money than some American who flips burgers for a living and whines about it.
Originally posted by filledcup
i believe i answered the last question in my previous paragraph - giving where it can be afforded, in reasonable limits not to become a pauper or ruin ur business, and regulating salaries based on profit margins.
i understand the problem here. let me elaborate. minimum wage should be constantly raised to combat inflation. im not saying jump from $9 an hr or whatever it is now to a full $30-$50 an hr over night. but gradual increases with the objective of creating an economy where the lowest paying jobs still afford those in them a respectable level of dignity when they walk the streets. a man holding a job working 12 hrs a day and doing his best shouldnt be looked down upon because he cant afford say an iphone. or his clothes are tattered. or that he still uses an old jalopy and crt television.he should be able to afford his basic needs with comfort.