Why do Christians believe in a God that has "chosen" the Jews

reply to post by Logarock

This may sound good but its a logical fallacy. It is entirely possible that God has favorites or people that He is closer to than others. However the truth about Gods relationship with Israel is rather complicated.

Israel is known in the Bible as God's first born (nation). God's relationship with Israel is like that of Ishmael and Isaac, Esau and Jacob.

God always selected the second born son to carry his flag for him based on the pedestal that the Israelites always placed on their first born sons. Their first born always received the highest honors in government and temples while also receiving double inheritances. God decided to turn it around for the kingdom he was creating.

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by Internet Explorer
If god exists he doesn't have favourites. I seriously take the bible with a grain of salt.

This may sound good but its a logical fallacy. It is entirely possible that God has favorites or people that He is closer to than others. However the truth about Gods relationship with Israel is rather complicated.

If god existed we would be as close to him as an ant. Whats bizarre is people believe there is some sky deity that cares what you eat, on what day of the week, who you have sex with and in what position while being pleased over repetitive ritual. At least he stopped asking for animal and human sacrifice tho.

Originally posted by Redarguo

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by Internet Explorer
If god exists he doesn't have favourites. I seriously take the bible with a grain of salt.

This may sound good but its a logical fallacy. It is entirely possible that God has favorites or people that He is closer to than others. However the truth about Gods relationship with Israel is rather complicated.

If god existed we would be as close to him as an ant. Whats bizarre is people believe there is some sky deity that cares what you eat, on what day of the week, who you have sex with and in what position while being pleased over repetitive ritual. At least he stopped asking for animal and human sacrifice tho.

He doesn't care about those things, another fallacy, a straw man.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Redarguo

Originally posted by Logarock

Originally posted by Internet Explorer
If god exists he doesn't have favourites. I seriously take the bible with a grain of salt.

This may sound good but its a logical fallacy. It is entirely possible that God has favorites or people that He is closer to than others. However the truth about Gods relationship with Israel is rather complicated.

If god existed we would be as close to him as an ant. Whats bizarre is people believe there is some sky deity that cares what you eat, on what day of the week, who you have sex with and in what position while being pleased over repetitive ritual. At least he stopped asking for animal and human sacrifice tho.

He doesn't care about those things, another fallacy, a straw man.

I know that's my point, why religious people believe he cares about such things, that texts that claim such are frankly ridiculous. Take away the ritual and whats left of any religion?... rational thought.

reply to post by ThinkingHuman

Gentile" is the Jews' derogatory term for Christians (and believers of other religions)

It's not derogatory. Gentile comes from the word Goiim, which means "nations", those that aren't Jewish.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Redarguo

 

50 AD to 150 AD does not constitute HUNDREDS of years after Christ's death, considering that Christ died between 32 AD - 34 AD.

And his own link and quote affirmed that some of those text that emerged during that first century period were "apostolic in origin".



He debunked himself.

reply to post by Deetermined


He referred to them as His "excellency" as well, chief of Nations ect. Then later He said that He "adhored the excellency of Jacob". They ended up rather disgusting Him and He kicked their asses. Called them a bunch of whore sodomites.

reply to post by Redarguo


No, I never said God doesn't care Bout things. I said what was mentioned is grossly exaggerated or misrepresented.

Which is a fallacy, of the straw man variety.

Originally posted by Logarock
reply to post by Deetermined

 

He referred to them as His "excellency" as well, chief of Nations ect. Then later He said that He "adhored the excellency of Jacob". They ended up rather disgusting Him and He kicked their asses. Called them a bunch of whore sodomites.

Yup, and punished them several times for their idolatry. He also said He would redeem them and gather them again from the nations He would scatter them to.

Originally posted by octotom
reply to post by ThinkingHuman

 

Gentile" is the Jews' derogatory term for Christians (and believers of other religions)

It's not derogatory. Gentile comes from the word Goiim, which means "nations", those that aren't Jewish.

I agree that the term is not derogatory, but there is a belief religious law only extents the the Jewish people and there fore to kill goiim is not murder. The kings Torah is one such book that remotes this. Same with Christians and heretics or Moslem's and infidels.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Redarguo

 

50 AD to 150 AD does not constitute HUNDREDS of years after Christ's death, considering that Christ died between 32 AD - 34 AD.

And his own link and quote affirmed that some of those text that emerged during that first century period were "apostolic in origin".

He debunked himself.

exactly not written by the apostles but based on documents supposedly written by them, ie the apostles did not author the bible.

reply to post by Deetermined


Start reading it with discernment.

Begin with 32 30.

And then dive into many of the articles on this site, and there is quite alot of mention of Paul.

www.spiritofthescripture.com...

It clears right up.

The problem is, turning it outer. Because GOD is the highest and purest, kindest, most healing and wonderful LOVE in existence, and turning it outer turns God into the opposite. The trap, so to speak. And this has been done intentionally.

The early Christians, the real Christians, were gnostics.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical


Yup, and punished them several times for their idolatry. He also said He would redeem them and gather them again from the nations He would scatter them to.

Yes right and I don't mean to belabor the point but it helps understand the relationship between Israel and God.

He even said once that He could have chosen any other nation of the world and they would have served Him with passion. And that although He had showed them many mighty works they remained form the beginning a pain in the ass.

And they will be gathered after some large scale enlightenment that drives them to repent and be profoundly ashamed of themselves.....Ezekiel.

Originally posted by Redarguo

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by Redarguo

 

50 AD to 150 AD does not constitute HUNDREDS of years after Christ's death, considering that Christ died between 32 AD - 34 AD.

And his own link and quote affirmed that some of those text that emerged during that first century period were "apostolic in origin".

He debunked himself.

exactly not written by the apostles but based on documents supposedly written by them, ie the apostles did not author the bible.

That's blatantly false. Textual critics and scholars affirm the apostolic authorship of most of the NT books. However some were written by people who interviewed the disciples like Luke. And some others were written by apostles who became believers after the resurrection, such as Christ's two half-brothers James and Jude and Paul.

reply to post by Unity_99


No they were not, Gnosticism isn't even close to being compatible with the God mentioned in the OT and Paul wrote Collossians specifically against the Gnostics.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Redarguo

 

No, I never said God doesn't care Bout things. I said what was mentioned is grossly exaggerated or misrepresented.

Which is a fallacy, of the straw man variety.

So the bible is not the word of god? Glad we agree.

what is exaggerated by the way

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

f a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them.Leviticus 20:13

- And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.Genesis 8:20


Nevertheless, among those that chew the cud or part the hoof, you shall not eat these: The camel, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. And the rock badger, because it chews the cud but does not part the hoof, is unclean to you. Leviticus 11:1-47

Add to that Jesus was sent to earth purely to be sacrificed for " our" sin, along side the metaphorical cannibalism and blood drinking.

Originally posted by kryton
I've always wondered the same.

If their god does give favor to jews over Christians, then why be a christian and not convert and become "better" in god's eyes?

Without the bible quoting head games, I think it's obvious to most observers that at least jews think that god favor's them over Christians.

So why would you join the second best group worshiping this god?

Why would anyone join either group?

Deities are notoriously unreliable.

reply to post by Redarguo

So the bible is not the word of god? Glad we agree.

Okay, apparently the term "straw man" is foreign to you. Here, allow me to define terms:

Description of Straw Man

The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual position and substitutes a distorted, exaggerated or misrepresented version of that position. This sort of "reasoning" has the following pattern:...

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person.

Straw Man Fallacy.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I know what a straw-man is but sure use it to avoid the issue. stawman much?

You said what I claimed was not the word of god, the bible says it is. so am I correct or is the bible wrong. Its a legitimate question I thought you were saying that the bible is exaggerated, your not being to clear and evasive.

reply to post by Unity_99

The problem is, turning it outer. Because GOD is the highest and purest, kindest, most healing and wonderful LOVE in existence, and turning it outer turns God into the opposite. The trap, so to speak. And this has been done intentionally.

How does projecting love outside of yourself turn God into the opposite of love?

I think you're confused.

Focusing on yourself doesn't lead to God.

Focus on God first and others second.

All of this "focus within yourself" theory is only putting you into a worldly trap of selfishness.