London Mosque Fire: Police Investigate Cause

Can't even attempt to condone this.

But I do understand why it might have happened.

In the aftermath of Lee Rigby's murder we heard the usual sound bites from the usual quarters.
But in reality what have they done?

A big, fat nothing.

People want to see clear and decisive action from the government in eradicating the extremists from our midst.
People want to see Muslim moderates house cleaning.

Obviously we may have to wait and see exactly what sort of action moderate Muslims take against the extremists within their communities.

We expect immediate action from our politicians - but they've been spectacular in their usual inaction.

If this is proven to be someone from EDL or someone using EDL then that person(s) should be dealt with in accordance with our hate crime laws and be given the maximum possible sentence.

Leaders of EDL have condemned the attack, exactly the same as Muslim leaders condemned the Woolwich murder.
They too have a repsonsibility to expel the extremists in their organisation.

Massoud Shadjareh, chair of IHRC, said: "Muslims feel scared right now and it is completely understandable.........
".........More needs to be done to protect the Muslim community."

www.bbc.co.uk...

If this becomes something of a trend then I'd agree with that, just as many non-Muslims feel scared now and feel that more needs to be done to protect their community.
Cuts both ways.

And the continued government inertia leads to more confrontation as the two sides become more and more alienated from each other.
Or the government comes down with a sledgehammer.

Either way, whose interests are being served?

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood


But Lucius,I know more than a few muslims who would help any stranger out in bind,and who have zero interest in making the whole world sharia rule.
Not all muslims want the next caliphate,at least not the ones I have met over the years.
Most are fellow countrymen and women,what ever their faith or origins of birth may be,who wish no harm to our society.

But the few bad eggs make the news,and the masses react as is the program.

Originally posted by Silcone Synapse

London Mosque Fire: Police Investigate Cause

news.sky.com

The letters 'EDL' - the initials of the English Defence League - have been found scrawled on an Islamic community centre which was destroyed in a suspicious fire in north London.

Counter-terrorism officers with the Metropolitan Police have been drafted in to investigate the blaze in Muswell Hill, amid fears it may have been started deliberately in a racially-motivated attack.

Most of the roof of the two-storey Bravanese Centre in Coppetts Road, which was being used as a mosque, collapsed in the fire.

(visit the link for the full news article)

bigotry and intelligence are never seen in the same company
it could be possible that some drunken bigot did this
or radical muslims stirring the pot

if there's no CCTV footage due to a "malfunction"
i'd say it was none of the above
and go with gov sponsored FF in the works

reply to post by Silcone Synapse


I am sure we all know benevolent muslims. Let me rephrase that:
I know some great Bangladeshi men and women around my town. I've had some great conversations with them, I have been the recipient of great kindnesses (and great currys!).
These guys, however, are businesmen. They came to Britain seeking work and opportunity, and they found it because they worked hard for it. And they've had to compromise alot to get where they are.
These are shrewd people. And the fact is, their god is not allah, but Money.
They will not be seeking the death penalty for someone who commits apostacy from islam. They are not religious muslims.
But when you consider the way they regard their women and women in general. It's not good. It's oppressive. This is cultural islam, and this is just one example I could think of. When you put both together (religious and cultural islam) you have a dangerous mix.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

Look at all the sheer horrid brutality in terms of conflict in the world today. Do you see a pattern?

i certainly do
but one has to be "insane" to see it


the "sane" can't or won't
too busy perhaps

gran bretan in 10 years
unless they all go completely "insane"


[just replace goldstein with the muslim of the week ]

This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

Originally posted by hotel1
This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

a majority of muslims want sharia law in the uk, they might not hate our way of life but they want our ways to become their ways. I agree burning is not the way.

Originally posted by symptomoftheuniverse

Originally posted by hotel1
This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

a majority of muslims want sharia law in the uk, they might not hate our way of life but they want our ways to become their ways. I agree burning is not the way.

Are you basing your response on personal experience ?

reply to post by hotel1


I agree.
But this boils down to a clash of cultures, and somebody/some people somewhere are using it as such for an opportunistic purpose.
This serves no good. A culture of lawlessness that calls itself the law of this country has a dark scheme in its thoughts that doesn't benefit the people it contemptuously purports to represent.
Like it or not, it's still about culture. Some just don't mix.
And then there are those out there who are paid to ensure they shall never mix.

Love your GOD with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and love your neighbour as you would love yourself.
Most 'religions' would argue those 2 thought trains are incompatible.
So I challenge you:
1: Who is your GOD?
2: Who is your neighbour?

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

Based on what you have posted those are two very fair questions and I would not trivialise them by answering quickly and glibly. So I would request that you grant me some time to consider what you have asked of me and then reply in a befitting manor.

reply to post by hotel1


Sir, I am going to bed now. It's late and I'm tired.
I appreciate your response, and I reciprocate with giving you whatever time you desire for a response.
Mine will be forthcoming when I've slept.
Goodnight from UK.

Originally posted by hotel1

Originally posted by symptomoftheuniverse

Originally posted by hotel1
This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

a majority of muslims want sharia law in the uk, they might not hate our way of life but they want our ways to become their ways. I agree burning is not the way.

Are you basing your response on personal experience ?

yes i am. You can too. Just ask the taxi drivers. Simples. Talk to the muslims.

reply to post by Lucius Driftwood

Sir
Sleep well I am also in the UK and like you I prefer to discuss a subject when the need to sleep is not clouding my thoughts.

Kind regards.

Originally posted by ispyed
reply to post by andy06shake

 

I've only bothered to look at three of your links. Bugger all about muslim immigrants. I did find the link about 7 year old romany kids offering sex absurd. The person making these claims did not report them to the police (suprise suprise)

Are these links supposed to justify the EDL setting fire to the Somali leasure center? If they were, you've failed miserably.

If you don't find the subject matter contained within the links i've posted pertinent to the situation transpiring in the United Kingdom that's your look out. As you have said you didn't even bother to view all of them.

If it had been Christian religious extremists that cut off some poor Muslims head there would have been riots in the streets and churches burning. You know it, I know it, and so does everyone else.

I have already said i don't condone the burning of any religious institution, however I can understand why others may feel the need to take action.

These people refuse to integrate into our society and are destroying our local communities. I have added a link below for you to ponder if you have the time or inclination!

www.youtube.com... (Short version, only 4mins)

www.youtube.com... (Long version, 57mins)

Another thing as to your implication that i'm somehow trying to promote/justify the English defence league, im Scottish!

I fail to see how you can stick up for any religion in this day of age that requires the complete and utter annihilation or conversion of all others. This is a basic tenet of Islam, convert or kill the infidel, there is no middle ground!

And please don't come back with some gibberish regarding the crusades or whatnot, its called progress something the Islamic religion is sadly lacking these days!

Originally posted by symptomoftheuniverse

Originally posted by hotel1
This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

a majority of muslims want sharia law in the uk, they might not hate our way of life but they want our ways to become their ways. I agree burning is not the way.

This is a dangerous myth perpetuated by people with dangerous agendas. The majority of Muslims do not want Sharia law in Britain, what they want is something very different. They just want the option to live their lives according to certain aspects of Sharia law, aspects that effect no one and do no harm to anyone and never will.

Very few people want to force anything on anyone (some obviously do, but they really are a very small minority). The majority of Muslims just want 'laws' to govern social aspects of their own lives, they don't want to change our democracy, criminal justice system or even our civil laws. They just want the people that want to, the muslims who want to, to be able live a life that they feel comfortable with.

99.99% of people are happy with this up and down the country, it's a shame the 0.01% make so much noise about it the other way.

reply to post by bates


"This is a dangerous myth perpetuated by people with dangerous agendas. The majority of Muslims do not want Sharia law in Britain, what they want is something very different. They just want the option to live their lives according to certain aspects of Sharia law, aspects that effect no one and do no harm to anyone and never will."

Buddy I think you may find rather a lot of women out there that would argue that Sharia law is both detrimental to their health and education never mind their sense of wellbeing.

Lets see female circumcision, forced arranged marriages, mercy killings/beatings the list goes on all according to Sharia law!

Why should they not just have to abide by the same laws as the rest of us?

There can only be one code of laws i'm afraid anything else promotes anarchy and does nothing more than destabilise our nation even further!

Originally posted by bates


99.99% of people are happy with this up and down the country, it's a shame the 0.01% make so much noise about it the other way.

You of course have some proof of this percentage?

reply to post by andy06shake


Here you are, purposefully misunderstanding.

You pluck out the worst aspects of sharia law, and offer them up as the reasons why Muslims wanting to live their lives in a way they feel comfortable with is wrong.

Very few Muslims actually believe in any of that stuff you post, and virtually none of them believe they should become law in Britain.

Originally posted by khimbar

Originally posted by bates


99.99% of people are happy with this up and down the country, it's a shame the 0.01% make so much noise about it the other way.

You of course have some proof of this percentage?

It's not a real percentage, it's just an expression as you well know.

The majority of people are happy about this, very few aren't. Just those that aren't seem ot make a lot more noise than those that are.

Why would a normal person be bothered about how someone else lives their life if it doesn't affect them in the slightest?

Originally posted by bates

Originally posted by symptomoftheuniverse

Originally posted by hotel1
This is not the way to effect change. I am a patriotic and proud Englishman who in my professional capacity works alongside hundreds of people from the Middle East many of whom are Muslims, and I can assure you that they do not hate us nor do they hate our way of life.

If you see something wrong in this country burning Mosques, Synagogues, or Churches will not bring about the change you want to see. If you start down that road you will find nothing at the end of it, no satisfaction, no change, and certainly no justice.

a majority of muslims want sharia law in the uk, they might not hate our way of life but they want our ways to become their ways. I agree burning is not the way.

This is a dangerous myth perpetuated by people with dangerous agendas. The majority of Muslims do not want Sharia law in Britain, what they want is something very different. They just want the option to live their lives according to certain aspects of Sharia law, aspects that effect no one and do no harm to anyone and never will.

Very few people want to force anything on anyone (some obviously do, but they really are a very small minority). The majority of Muslims just want 'laws' to govern social aspects of their own lives, they don't want to change our democracy, criminal justice system or even our civil laws. They just want the people that want to, the muslims who want to, to be able live a life that they feel comfortable with.

99.99% of people are happy with this up and down the country, it's a shame the 0.01% make so much noise about it the other way.

yes they do,they do want sharia law in this country, i live in a muslim area,they do ,they do they do. Wake up. They want sharia law and everything that goes with it.