More US Deployments

reply to post by hp1229


When did the USA care about wasting money? We give Israel 2 billion a year, that's a waste of money. A waste of mine & your tax dollars. I'm quite sure that World Force for Good is steaming that way. Nothing like a nuclear aircraft carrier off your coast.....rattlin the sabres.

Originally posted by camaro68ss
God i really hope this dosent spin out of control.

What no one is thinking, if we do go to war with NK, China will have a great excuse to sale its 1 trillion dollars in US bonds. China needs a reason to sale those bonds and this is it! If that happens, say good bye to the US global reserve status. Welcome to the greatest depression.

That would be bad for China as well. They are in the first year of the new leadership and they do not want a financial crisis. Remember that main reason the Chinese have all these bonds because of a Chinese policy designed to benefit China, i.e. the currency peg against the dollar which has resulted in a strategic deindustrialization of the USA. They can sell all those bonds and not buy more but they can't maintain the currency peg. Their exporters will complain if they give up the peg.

If they decided to sell anyway, in the present circumstance, the Federal Reserve would buy all the bonds the Chinese sell (because the Fed can print dollars) to avoid large scale disruptions. Now they have dollars and have to do something with them. A dollar is economically equivalent to a zero-coupon Treasury bill [other than being legal obligation of the Fed instead of the Treasury] in effect so it is changing long term bonds for short term bonds.

What will they do with the dollars, buy US stocks? They could buy euros in mass and change the EURUSD exchange rate. Europe's manufacturers will complain about that.

reply to post by Hopechest


If anyone needed liberation its the people of NK , unfortunately we have set a bad example with how afghanistan and Iraq was conducted...........

And this is coming from someone who was boots on the ground on more then one occasion in both areas......

Granted we did do some good in those countries...........but we should have definitely gone about it a different way......and the police actions afterwards.........

The handling of the aftermath of both confrontations, and the micromanagement, and inability to LET US be effective in our missions and military actions left many of my brothers and sisters wounded and dead...

I dont want to see that again.........

I will say however we would be looking at a different strategy here all together........how some of our more incompetent military leaders would handle this, im not sure

NK has always been more of an immediate threat to not only themselves but their neighbors , then some of the other countries we have put ourselves in.......

We have done a disservice to the world and the people of NK by not taking care of it years ago............

With SK right there to work the scene, it's different from a stand-alone attack.

NK makes too many problems and are asking for it.

Disturbing report, OP.

I was noticing earlier this week that there were aircraft overhead, and they were quite noisy. We are not in a flight path and I never hear aircraft, unless it's a crop-duster or the occasional helicopter. So to hear numerous large aircraft like that, several times in one day, was quite unusual.

I was thinking they were military, and so your post makes perfect sense to me. If they were coming out of Dyess AFB in Abilene, we would be underneath their flight path towards Guam. As the crow flies, Abilene isn't too far away.

I can't speak for anybody else, but I'm getting mighty tired of war.

Originally posted by mbkennel

Originally posted by camaro68ss
God i really hope this dosent spin out of control.

What no one is thinking, if we do go to war with NK, China will have a great excuse to sale its 1 trillion dollars in US bonds. China needs a reason to sale those bonds and this is it! If that happens, say good bye to the US global reserve status. Welcome to the greatest depression.

That would be bad for China as well. They are in the first year of the new leadership and they do not want a financial crisis. Remember that main reason the Chinese have all these bonds because of a Chinese policy designed to benefit China, i.e. the currency peg against the dollar which has resulted in a strategic deindustrialization of the USA. They can sell all those bonds and not buy more but they can't maintain the currency peg. Their exporters will complain if they give up the peg.

If they decided to sell anyway, in the present circumstance, the Federal Reserve would buy all the bonds the Chinese sell (because the Fed can print dollars) to avoid large scale disruptions. Now they have dollars and have to do something with them. A dollar is economically equivalent to a zero-coupon Treasury bill [other than being legal obligation of the Fed instead of the Treasury] in effect so it is changing long term bonds for short term bonds.

What will they do with the dollars, buy US stocks? They could buy euros in mass and change the EURUSD exchange rate. Europe's manufacturers will complain about that.

edit on 6-4-2013 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2013 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2013 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2013 by mbkennel because: (no reason given)

The USA is an economic superpower. Some things never change.

Originally posted by Gazrok
The E-6B's are curious though. I can't see the need for them as command and control centers in the area, seems there would be plenty enough of that with the bases and carrier groups. A bit puzzling. I'm assuming there is some other role for them to play.

Makes me wonder where the subs are...

Although maybe they are just for the airborne threat systems....

EA-6B's can scramble the radar on SAM (surface to air) missile launch sites, as well as destroy them, to clear the way, so to speak, for the aircraft to follow.

Let's hope it doesn't happen.

reply to post by Hopechest


First, to even reply I need to separate NK from China. While the future might yet see them falling together opposite of us -- they are simply not the same. Neither in terms of the situation for their people (despite China's human rights record) nor their ability to wage war with the U.S. So, I will leave China off the table for this conversation because barring the kind of out and out WW you recently argued would never be seen again -- we aren't going at it directly with China. Since, while I do view a WW as possible it isn't something I want -- I will focus only on why we can't just "liberate" NK.
1. Sovereignty. Yes, this is a principle issue not a logistics issue. But what right do we have? NONE. If we wouldn't want another force to come here we shouldn't send another there.
2. Expense - unless you consider the beating drums of war to be a cover and front for an economic reset/escape hatch, etc. for the Western World (and there is an argument that it could be) we just don't have the cash for this right now.
3. Will to war -- or lack thereof. Barring a serious attack on the U.S. the people are tired of the war. Tired of international lack of gratitude/lack of respect/hate/and being called a bully. Why should we put our troops at risk...again...
4. Logistics: and this is the big one. If we are there to "liberate" we can't use the big (nuke) guns. If we can't use the big guns we are talking about the real possibility of boots on the ground in massive numbers. What kind of mortality rate do you think we are looking at there? There are those who believe that number is high -- too high. The same kind of high that figured into the original decision to use atomic weapons against Japan. But, we are there to "liberate" so we can't use nukes... So more extended deployments - and when we run out of those troops what's next -- a draft. Again barring major actual impact to U.S. from NK not going to be accepted.

In short this is a very serious and very bad situation. Of course we can do massive damage to NK. But at what cost? And that's before we even consider how that would make China react...

Originally posted by Ironside800
reply to post by Plotus

 

I got the impression he was referring to the US and China working together against North Korea???? Not taking on China at the same time as taking on North Korea. I couldve read that wrong but i think you might have?

If that's so, my mistake, sorry.

Originally posted by camaro68ss
Its also reported that NK asked all foreign embassies to evacuate NK at once. That NK cant promise there safety

I was thinking this was strangely traditional and polite move from a nation that is apparently telling the world to go screw themselves... Something doesn't quite add up.

Originally posted by McGinty

Originally posted by camaro68ss
Its also reported that NK asked all foreign embassies to evacuate NK at once. That NK cant promise there safety

I was thinking this was strangely traditional and polite move from a nation that is apparently telling the world to go screw themselves... Something doesn't quite add up.

Haven't you figured it out yet?

The USA is on the way and someone gave the 28 year old a ' heads up '.

He is doing what he can but it's not good enough. The clock is ticking.

reply to post by Darkrunner


These aren't EA-6Bs though. That's the confusion, they're E-6B Mercury aircraft.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by VaterOrlaag
reply to post by Hopechest

 

It is up to the citizens of North Korea to decide that, not the U.S and not China.

We really need to get out of the business of "liberating" other nations.

Normally i would agree BUT North Korea is an exception. Dont forget the fact that NK has concentration camps. If I was in North Korea and dared raise my ire against the Dear Fatboy I would be likely sent there or worse executed but so would three generations of my family. Think of it like this, Dachus many times over spread over North Korea. So people cant do anything about the leadership in North Korea. The control and brainwashing is total.

Originally posted by McGinty

Originally posted by camaro68ss
Its also reported that NK asked all foreign embassies to evacuate NK at once. That NK cant promise there safety

I was thinking this was strangely traditional and polite move from a nation that is apparently telling the world to go screw themselves... Something doesn't quite add up.

You gotta admire NK, for all their apparent stupidity they are doing what only one other country did (Iceland), told the Western Powers to GFTM which is pretty good going.

The world is burning, it's keeping me warm.

"They pull a knife, you pull a gun. He sends one of yours to the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago way."

Jus' sayin'.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by GargIndia
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

The US can still fail to defend South Korea despite best intentions.

If even one nuke goes through and destroys SK city; there will be a feeling afterwards that US did not deploy anti-missile systems despite having them, and thus left the security of SK to chance.

You may see and realize my words in near future. Please note down my words somewhere so that you know the truth sometimes comes from most unexpected places.

True... I think 'best intentions' and/or 'best efforts' are what matter there. If war breaks out, South Korea WILL lose 10's of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people in the first few hours. There isn't much question on that. 13,000 Artillery pieces and rocket units all aimed at ONE city won't leave much worth calling a city for long.

North Korea has estimates (supplied by defectors back into the 90's) of 6-10 *MINUTES* for Seoul to be in ruins and able to overrun and bypass for the Dash to the Southern Coast and physical conquest of the land area. U.S./Allied reports I've read from the same recent past and dealing with the same tactical situation as they face today estimate 60 *MINUTES* for the ruin of Seoul. There is nothing the U.S. can do to stop that unless the North is either riddled with potential defectors who short circuit that whole thing ...or their ammo fails to function. I'm not betting on either.

The thing is...... There were somewhere around 25,000 to 27,000 U.S. Servicemen in the same general area and inside South Korea. I understand by reading contemporary reports that when General Custer had his command all but annihilated during the Battle of Little Big Horn, the nation was in shock. Well.. they'd be in collective need of valium by the handful with news we just LOST almost 30,000 people (and I have little doubt, there are more than that now...recall those 'out of the blue' call ups for Marines and others over the past 14-21 days?).

If it's losses while we did our best? The world can understand Military defeat just as it happened in the first rounds of the 1950's fighting, and may actually feel bad for us...though not NEARLY as bad as for South Korea. If we pulled resources or punches even a bit ...the World which matters which see that too and we may as well flush our whole upper Government, because no one works with US again for anything while any of them are still near power, IMO.

No one is ever doing anything but a full and 100% defense of the ROK, IMO.

Yeah except the very first paragraph of this thread indicates we intend to nuke them the minute they open fire which pretty much makes nonsesne out of the entire thought line here no offense. Sometimes coming to ats it gets a little frustrating in how people always predict Americas doom, it's like we sit here on a stupid frum and know something the Pentagon doesn't right... the Toys in place are obvious....our plan to handle this is obvious... if NK does anything serious we are going to drop a few nukes behind the line... there's no actual other option to stop it.

Cut it out... the REAL 8 minute option is all ours and that includes dealing with Russia and China... WE have the Emps lol, WE are the ones who have stuff on satellite in orbit WE are the ones with the Black Budget for secret weapons that exceeds the entire military budget of any nation on Earth...

reply to post by penninja


I haven't seen anything that says we're planning to use nuclear weapons on North Korea. In fact the odds are that we AREN'T going to, even if they have one and pop it off. The geography of the area is such that any residual from the nuke is highly likely to end up in Russia and China, who we're going to try hard not to piss off and drag into this.

Just because B-1s are involved doesn't mean that nukes will be.

Ummm, I am not sure where to put this or ask. So, I'm here.
I just heard a F18 take off from my small airport in north Phoenix. It was amazing to see as he was almost vertical after takeoff. I called the airport and asked about it. The gentleman said he just stopped there for the night. Uh, what? Why didn't he just stay at Luke AFB. The man said he wondered that too. He said or I said it was odd and we agreed it was very odd at an odd time. He was unsure of where he was going. He had a guess as to where but I missed it.
Strange military movement? He said they get one or maybe 2 a year but this was odd.

What do you guys think?

Chrystal,

Probably nothing, but could be the start ofww3.

I said or they said this, not me.

Zaphod will probably know whats what with anything airport/military craft.

Originally posted by Twilightgem
Ummm, I am not sure where to put this or ask. So, I'm here.
I just heard a F18 take off from my small airport in north Phoenix. It was amazing to see as he was almost vertical after takeoff. I called the airport and asked about it. The gentleman said he just stopped there for the night. Uh, what? Why didn't he just stay at Luke AFB. The man said he wondered that too. He said or I said it was odd and we agreed it was very odd at an odd time. He was unsure of where he was going. He had a guess as to where but I missed it.
Strange military movement? He said they get one or maybe 2 a year but this was odd.

What do you guys think?

edit on 6-4-2013 by Twilightgem because: (no reason given)

reply to post by Twilightgem


They occasionally stay at small airports, because some military bases (not sure about Luke) have instituted a Prior Permission Required to land there. They have to arrange for them to stop between their command and the military base they are trying to land at, to ensure that fuel and other requirements get paid, and the base in question doesn't get stuck with the bill for their stay there. If it was an unexpected stop, or Luke didn't have room, then he may have stopped over at the local airport there.