The Pledge of Allegiance is Brainwashing

Originally posted by gangdumstyle
reply to post by Watersbottles

 

Either way if you do not like the pledge of allegiance to America then get the !!HELL!! out...
If your child goes to a public school, get them the !!HELL!! out.. Homeschool, send to a private school
that does not say the pledge, go to mexico, iran, iraq, move go if you do not like it... Remove your children
if you do not like it. Simple as that..

Congratulations, you just failed the test of true patriotism. Instead of standing up for the rights that the Constitution grants people and for their freedom to choose not to recite a sacred nationalistic oath, you instead would choose to deny your fellow Americans of their basic rights, demanding that they leave the country of their birth. Don't bother claiming to be a patriot...I'm not sure you know the real meaning of the word.

Originally posted by signalfire
How many people here supporting the mandatory recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance every school day in every school in the country (until the kids wise up and refuse to anymore) which includes the phrase 'one nation' also support secession of their particular state because *they* are trying to take away your gun rights, etc????

The pledge is to the flag....a symbol of our nation, it's people and our freedom.

Last time I checked nobody was pledging allegiance to the usurpers in government.

Nice try though!

reply to post by Sparky63


The pledge isn't mandatory...calm down. And there is nothing wrong with saying "Love it or leave it" either.


And for the record....

NO, Mr. President, you’re doing it wrong!




This is how it's done, Sir!

reply to post by Watersbottles


OP is directly making things up to fit their agenda here..
We know these types around here..


This agenda is not for a peaceful and intuitive conversation, but to brainwash in itself,
the posters who are younger and more prone to believing things they read on the internet
by American hating goons....

Either way if you do not like the pledge of allegiance to America then get the !!HELL!! out...
If your child goes to a public school, get them the !!HELL!! out.. Homeschool, send to a private school
that does not say the pledge, go to mexico, iran, iraq, move go if you do not like it... Remove your children
if you do not like it. Simple as that..

I disagree that it is a bad thing. We need to dedicate ourselves to humankind, civilization, to the best parts of our species.. The pledge of allegiance is a pledge to an idea....

"I pledge allegiance... to the flag... of the United States of America...and to the Republic, for which it stands, one nation, under god, with liberty and justice for all"

The flag represents the idea....it represents the need for a Republic...in our case....a Constitutional republic. We need to be unified....one nation. We need liberty and justice for all....

Why is that bad and how can you disagree with the ideals set forth within it? Do you hate the dream? Do you hate the great experiment that was "liberty and justice for all"?
I think you do...and I can think of a few places that might fulfill your goals...China, Cuba, North Korea....want more?

If you have a problem with the "under god"....tough crapola...I don't believe in the God that most sheep do, but I am not ready to say that a supreme mind is not out there...not yet.

The pledge of allegience, national anthem, etc are just brainwashing techniques used in very similar fashion to how cults use brainwashing techniques to make their members feel like they're part of something.

Repeating the pledge every single day, as a group, and making sure that the entire country is indoctrinated through the school system is exactly that - brainwashing.

Originally posted by babybunnies
The pledge of allegience, national anthem, etc are just brainwashing techniques used in very similar fashion to how cults use brainwashing techniques to make their members feel like they're part of something.

Repeating the pledge every single day, as a group, and making sure that the entire country is indoctrinated through the school system is exactly that - brainwashing.

There is A LOT of brainwashing going on in the public school system...I agree with you.

The pledge of allegiance is the LEAST of our worries!

Just because you learn to say the pledge of allegiance doesn't make it god. My family is more important to me than the country. I still have morals way above those that are required by law. Honesty is not presently revered in this country, that is something that is going to change shortly. The greedy and power hungry are exposing themselves because their confidence is too high. They THINK they have everyone over a barrel.

reply to post by rickymouse

The greedy and power hungry are exposing themselves because their confidence is too high. They THINK they have everyone over a barrel.

While I agree with your sentiments I must again point out that the flag doesn’t represent the usurpers in DC…it represent the American people and our freedom and sacrifices.

Don’t allow the flag to represent all that is wrong with America! It represents all that is RIGHT with America.

Originally posted by Sparky63

Congratulations, you just failed the test of true patriotism. Instead of standing up for the rights that the Constitution grants people and for their freedom to choose not to recite a sacred nationalistic oath, you instead would choose to deny your fellow Americans of their basic rights, demanding that they leave the country of their birth. Don't bother claiming to be a patriot...I'm not sure you know the real meaning of the word.

Sorry sparky,
THIS IS NOT A TEST....
I repeat,
THIS IS NOT A TEST...

This is a small minority trying to impose their dislike for this country, its pledge,
the freedom and tradition TO SAY IT on the larger majority..

Sorry you failed to recognize this is not a pledge to a flag,
IT IS HONORING all the people who died for it, for your
freedom in American, for your freedom to piss on their graves...

reply to post by Malcher


in my initial reply to you i was somewhat agreeing re the idea that we all have some programming in us - though ofc jingoism is over the top nationalism... regardless i feel all of us have *some* degree of nationalism in us, though maybe national pride would be more accurate.

so no, we dont all have some jingoism in us!

i think most peeps can pick out a bunch of things about their country of birth or residence/whatever that they feel proud of in some way, but if you examine things, pick a country, (pretty much) any country... and if you cant find a thing about it that you would be proud of if you were from there, then i think you would be being pretty dishonest.

sometimes i feel compelled to defend the british monarchy a bit for example, now the ins and outs of that are way off topic ofc, but the point is, i think the monarchy is a stupid idea that kinda works, and in a daft way i'm also proud of it though i would cheer it's end. heck, i've even been a bit proud when i've had a few beers and see english yobs on the news rioting after a football game abroad and fighting foreign coppers (very rare nowadays). totally stupid, but sometimes it stirs the english spirit in me, and i cant defend those emotions and often condemn them in others!

how did i end up succombing to that? in part it has to be my upbringing, god save the queen, ruling the waves and all that crud - we all buy into it a bit at times... but it's basicly a load of crap.

and why get a bunch of kids to swear to a flag - what does it achieve? it looked plain weird when i used to see a bunch of kids in china or russia doing similar stuff on TV during the cold war, and it's just as weird when i see it in the US to be frank....if it's all so awesome wont they realise that themselves with out being forced to say it by rote?

Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by babybunnies
The pledge of allegience, national anthem, etc are just brainwashing techniques used in very similar fashion to how cults use brainwashing techniques to make their members feel like they're part of something.

Repeating the pledge every single day, as a group, and making sure that the entire country is indoctrinated through the school system is exactly that - brainwashing.

There is A LOT of brainwashing going on in the public school system...I agree with you.

The pledge of allegiance is the LEAST of our worries!

You said it. I'm very thankful that when we have kids, we have the option of home schooling them and will be taking this upon ourselves.

What made me laugh was a report the other day that we've had "the highest level of Grade A passes ever recorded" in North America recently, at about 48% of all exams taken being passed at an A grade. Which I find hilarious, given the fact that most high school grads can't make change without a till or a calculator to tell them how much. Just because schools are making exams easier, doesn't mean kids are smarter because more are being graded more leniently.

Originally posted by Jeremiah65
I disagree that it is a bad thing. We need to dedicate ourselves to humankind, civilization, to the best parts of our species.. The pledge of allegiance is a pledge to an idea....

"I pledge allegiance... to the flag... of the United States of America...and to the Republic, for which it stands, one nation, under god, with liberty and justice for all"

The flag represents the idea....it represents the need for a Republic...in our case....a Constitutional republic. We need to be unified....one nation. We need liberty and justice for all....

Why is that bad and how can you disagree with the ideals set forth within it? Do you hate the dream? Do you hate the great experiment that was "liberty and justice for all"?
I think you do...and I can think of a few places that might fulfill your goals...China, Cuba, North Korea....want more?

If you have a problem with the "under god"....tough crapola...I don't believe in the God that most sheep do, but I am not ready to say that a supreme mind is not out there...not yet.

edit on 2/4/2013 by Jeremiah65 because: (no reason given)

Interesting idea. However, that pledging to an idea is better for all. However, I bet if you ask most kids these days reciting the pledge to explain what that recital actually means in relation to the pledge, let alone what the pledge actually means, very few of them would be able to tell you.

Originally posted by Jeremiah65
I disagree that it is a bad thing. We need to dedicate ourselves to humankind, civilization, to the best parts of our species.. The pledge of allegiance is a pledge to an idea....

"I pledge allegiance... to the flag... of the United States of America...and to the Republic, for which it stands, one nation, under god, with liberty and justice for all"

The flag represents the idea....it represents the need for a Republic...in our case....a Constitutional republic. We need to be unified....one nation. We need liberty and justice for all....

Why is that bad and how can you disagree with the ideals set forth within it? Do you hate the dream? Do you hate the great experiment that was "liberty and justice for all"?
I think you do...and I can think of a few places that might fulfill your goals...China, Cuba, North Korea....want more?

If you have a problem with the "under god"....tough crapola...I don't believe in the God that most sheep do, but I am not ready to say that a supreme mind is not out there...not yet.

edit on 2/4/2013 by Jeremiah65 because: (no reason given)

Interesting idea. However, that pledging to an idea is better for all. However, I bet if you ask most kids these days reciting the pledge to explain what that recital actually means in relation to the pledge, let alone what the pledge actually means, very few of them would be able to tell you.

Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by signalfire
How many people here supporting the mandatory recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance every school day in every school in the country (until the kids wise up and refuse to anymore) which includes the phrase 'one nation' also support secession of their particular state because *they* are trying to take away your gun rights, etc????

The pledge is to the flag....a symbol of our nation, it's people and our freedom.

Last time I checked nobody was pledging allegiance to the usurpers in government.

Nice try though!

I thought the pledge was to the flag AND the Constitution?

reply to post by babybunnies


True enough. We tend to teach adherence rather than why it is important. It would appear on the surface that they are teaching subservience and not the reasons why we hold the symbolism so high.

I have no quarrel with what we are pledging. I believe in the Republic....the "Constitutional Republic"....I believe in "Liberty and Justice for all".

I see the flag as an icon that embodies that goal, that dream. I have no problem swearing an oath to the perfect ideal...it is what I would love...it is what I want. I am a man of Liberty...I believe in Justice. I know these things are painfully compromised in this day and age but it does not detract from their true meaning and value.

I just want to live free in a world of fairness and justice and I will pledge my heart to those ends....it IS the best parts of us...the human animal...

reply to post by seabag


You know, if we didn't get taxed on virtually everything, I'd be inclined to agree with you. The problem is, taxing the hell out of us and then expecting us all to pledge our allegiance to the system (Yeah, I see your "ideals" and "values" argument... but at the end of teh day the damn pledge is still intended to be allegiance to the current US system.) is the governmental version of the Stockholm Syndrome.

Your "voluntary" argument also falls on deaf ears. While legally correct, the group hazing (itself a form traumatic bonding) essentially dictates that the other kids will harass the dissenter into capitulating and joining in the pledge. It is the state taking advantage of the need to fit in occupying a very high position on children's heirarchy of needs. Since most children have the majority of their needs provided for them (food, shelter, clothing, entertainment) crap like the Pledge, and to a lesser degree P.E. Fitness tests and pep rallies, are intended to get the majority of the worker bees to goad the minority of bees (the dissenters) to change their position and become another faceless drone. In some cases it can even extend into general behavior with the schools using the majority to enforce their rules. (i.e. "OK Class, because Little Jimmy didn't sit still during reading time, we're not going to have free time today and will instead spend the time on this pop quiz. Everybody thank Little Jimmy for losing your free time." After school, Little Jimmy gets his ass kicked by his classmates for not falling into line.... exactly as his teacher intended when she called him out in class and issued his punishment to everyone else.)

Originally posted by babybunnies

Originally posted by seabag

Originally posted by signalfire
How many people here supporting the mandatory recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance every school day in every school in the country (until the kids wise up and refuse to anymore) which includes the phrase 'one nation' also support secession of their particular state because *they* are trying to take away your gun rights, etc????

The pledge is to the flag....a symbol of our nation, it's people and our freedom.

Last time I checked nobody was pledging allegiance to the usurpers in government.

Nice try though!

I thought the pledge was to the flag AND the Constitution?

It's all of those things.

What it's NOT is a pledge to government or to our elected officials.

I can understand that some people dislike what the government does...I'm one of those people...but I still love my country. The flag is a symbol of America not government misdoings.

I never got why I was pledging allegiance to a flag. I got the rest of it...just not the part of pledging allegiance to an inanimate object.

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by rickymouse

 

The greedy and power hungry are exposing themselves because their confidence is too high. They THINK they have everyone over a barrel.

While I agree with your sentiments I must again point out that the flag doesn’t represent the usurpers in DC…it represent the American people and our freedom and sacrifices.

Don’t allow the flag to represent all that is wrong with America! It represents all that is RIGHT with America.

That is very true.