UK risks 'turning inwards' over EU referendum - US official

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posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 12:20 AM
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reply to post by hotel1
 


We fought against and for each other at times. Every family has its issues. I met some good British troops in the sand box. I was willing and ready to die for them as soon as my fellow Americans. The other countries, France, Germany, even the Austrailians (from my position) didn't seem to keen to go "outside the wire" BUT, you were there when we asked, we owe you guys, (a gentlemans handshake and a warriors salute) if nothing else.


God bless the UK.




posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 12:26 AM
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reply to post by CJCrawley
 


Yeah, Sorry about that bro. We're trying to fix that but we have a lot of stupid people here. Some of us are hoping to have that problem gone in the not to distant future..... Once we're done with the broom and dust pan, you can have it.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 12:34 AM
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reply to post by LEL01
 


As an American, Let me warn you. If one of your politicians says our president (Obama) backs or supports anything,... It ain't a good deal for ya'll.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 05:50 AM
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Originally posted by LEL01
reply to post by tdk84
 

Do you have any idea what the mistakes are that they're saying France has made? I'm clueless as to what they're talking about so I don't even know what to look for to find out.

My concerns about leaving but going back to a trade agreement which is what we voted for in 1975 (not me) is that they still have a certain amount of control over us. We would still have the farming and fishing regulations, we really need to be in control of our own food supplies.

I know the other 26 countries won't want us to leave because of the money we pay into it but I'm sure there must be people in all of those countries who also don't want to be part of it.
I can't see why we can't be in control of our own countries but stand together if/when we are in trouble or under threat.



Its mainly to do with François Hollande the new Socialist President, he's very different to Nicolas Sarkozy, although its been going on a long time.

Basically without boring you, Francious hollande has a growth agenda... like labour did. They theory of spending money to get the economy going again.

German Chancellor Angela Merkel wants fiscal restraint, hence the now natural alliance that could be made with the Torries, very similar models. They dont want growth financed by more debt.

Mr Hollande did a few other things like lowering the retirement age, blunders in speeches, he elected Jean-Marc Ayrault, a longtime ally and Germanophile prime minister, deep differences on how to resolve the euro crisis.

Basically its the Germans who want to surrender national powers to tighten fiscal discipline's. The French dont like this as much as the British.

Hollande suggested Merkel is preoccupied with domestic politics.

It was stated the Franco-German relationship was the driving and "accelerating" force of the EU, Hollande said, "it can also be the brake if it's not in step."

This is just a short list, but basically the Germans are finding a lot more in common with the way Britian is run then France. They have stated Anglo-German relations are far more natural, mainly because the two strongest economic powers in the E.U agree on so many things... other then the national powers that is, to be negotiated.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 06:17 AM
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Originally posted by CJCrawleyWe can all talk about supposed benefits of membership (though I haven't noticed too many during the last 40 years), but the fact is this is a political union, not simply a trade agreement.

That means we will lose our sovereignty and become a mere state within a federation of states, ruled remotely out of Brussels.

This hasn't fully happened yet, but it will.


That's what Germany wants, its there grand plan to get spending under control but it wont happen... even France their "closest ally" doesn't agree. Actually its a very good idea to get spending under control and probably the best solution but who wants to give up the national identity and hand control to Brussels... no one.


We will lose our miles and have to accept kilometres (again, not happened yet but will).

Also, something perhaps not given too much thought by most people, but we could conceivably lose our language; most of us just assume it will be English because of US influence, though, with Germany at the helm, it could be German - there are actually more German-speakers in Europe than any other language.

Say the eurocrats in Brussels decide on German as the official language.

That means all official correspondence would have to be in German. Yes, we'd carry on speaking English, but would have to learn German....good enough to read and write it.

All letters, emails...

Good, eh?


You got to be kidding me, your majorly over exaggerating even if on the slightest of chance's power did go to Brussels this would never happen. Regional pride has never been higher, Wales, Scotland, Catalonia, Galicia etc

Where are you getting your information from? English Accounts for 51% of the E.U. population, the next closest is German but its miles off. Not to mention the Anglosphere 1800 M people speak English its the most dominant language in the world

Its second only to Mandarin for sheer numbers, but they have a lot of English speakers and its regionally isolated.


Not to mention many other types of interference in our everyday lives, as the EU strives to standardise life within the federation.


Again its mainly the Germans extreme views for austerity measure's unfortunately its a very good idea, but a huge percentage don't agree with it due to national pride and giving power elsewhere, It wont happen.


I have already noticed a lot more paperwork in my job, a lot more bureaucracy.


A lot more paper work everywhere, its the way the world is, doped up with healthy and safety and the nanny culture.

This will only get worse.


Oh, and we will completely lose control of our borders (if you think the New Labour years were bad, you aint seen nothing yet, kid).


As mentioned before you make it sold like this is a sole issue of the United Kingdom, its an E.U. wide problem. Border and immigration laws will be changed and modified, the E.U is so young, it needs time to get things right.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 06:33 AM
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I would like to hear some English folks from the North(west), north of Scotland, and how they think about European Regional Development Funds? The Northwest of England is one of 9 regions to qualify for Competitiveness and Employment funding.

Under the 2007 to 2013 programme, the region can receive €755.5 million of ERDF investment. Here''s a quote:




The Department for Communities and Local Government (DCLG) manages the European Regional Development Fund (ERDF) in England. This fund is focused on reducing economic disparities within and between EU member states by supporting economic regeneration and safeguarding jobs. According to DCLG since 2000, England has benefited from more than €5 billion of funding, with a further €3.2 billion being invested between 2007 and 2013 in local projects around the country. The Committee invited submissions from interested parties on the operation of the ERDF in England.


Then again a referendum is your call...

ERDF
edit on 16-1-2013 by Foppezao because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by Foppezao because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 06:44 AM
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This is nowadays, image the time when cities like Newcastle and Manchester where industrial ghosttowns.........



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 08:28 AM
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In reply to tdk84


Where are you getting your information from? English Accounts for 51% of the E.U. population, the next closest is German but its miles off. Not to mention the Anglosphere 1800 M people speak English its the most dominant language in the world


I'm not talking about the world, just Europe.

And in European terms, English is a minority language.

en.wikipedia.org...


German is the main language of about 90–95 million people in Europe (as of 2004), or 13.3% of all Europeans, being the second most spoken native language in Europe after Russian, above French (66.5 million speakers in 2004) and English (64.2 million speakers in 2004).


So.....

1. Russian
2. German
3. French
4. English

In 2004 at any rate, English was the 4th most spoken European tongue. I don't suppose a lot has changed since then in English's favour.

Russian, German, and French all have more native speakers than English.

Still confident about English being the favoured official tongue of the Fourth Reich.....er, sorry, the EU?


edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 08:57 AM
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Originally posted by tdk84




Oh, and we will completely lose control of our borders (if you think the New Labour years were bad, you aint seen nothing yet, kid).


As mentioned before you make it sold like this is a sole issue of the United Kingdom, its an E.U. wide problem. Border and immigration laws will be changed and modified, the E.U is so young, it needs time to get things right.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



I'm only interested in the UK, being a citizen thereof.

And if the EU "is so young, it needs time to get things right"

........let's wait till it's a bit older and wiser, shall we?
edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 09:53 AM
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Originally posted by CJCrawley
In reply to tdk84


Where are you getting your information from? English Accounts for 51% of the E.U. population, the next closest is German but its miles off. Not to mention the Anglosphere 1800 M people speak English its the most dominant language in the world


I'm not talking about the world, just Europe.

And in European terms, English is a minority language.

en.wikipedia.org...


German is the main language of about 90–95 million people in Europe (as of 2004), or 13.3% of all Europeans, being the second most spoken native language in Europe after Russian, above French (66.5 million speakers in 2004) and English (64.2 million speakers in 2004).


So.....

1. Russian
2. German
3. French
4. English

In 2004 at any rate, English was the 4th most spoken European tongue. I don't suppose a lot has changed since then in English's favour.

Russian, German, and French all have more native speakers than English.

Still confident about English being the favoured official tongue of the Fourth Reich.....er, sorry, the EU?


edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)


Thats wrong... or should I say not interpreted correctly.

German accounts for 16% of the population by first langue. Beating English which is at 13%. Where English wins is due to the popularity for English as a Additional language or an L2 language. 38% speaking English as a second & only 11% for German.

Those stats are from 2012, you can see how German has increased from 13% to 16% from 2004 but still far lower then total English. As mentioned it accounts for 51%, far higher then any other.

en.wikipedia.org...

That page gives a break down of all language's. English is the dominant Language in both Europe and the world.

Just look at all the foreigners who post on this forum, not only speak but write pretty good English.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 10:01 AM
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Originally posted by CJCrawley




Oh, and we will completely lose control of our borders (if you think the New Labour years were bad, you aint seen nothing yet, kid).


As mentioned before you make it sold like this is a sole issue of the United Kingdom, its an E.U. wide problem. Border and immigration laws will be changed and modified, the E.U is so young, it needs time to get things right.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



I'm only interested in the UK, being a citizen thereof.

And if the EU "is so young, it needs time to get things right"

........let's wait till it's a bit older and wiser, shall we?
edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)
edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)


edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)


My point is if all countries in the Europe are experiencing the same problem it will obviously be fixed.

and your also missing my point... although the E.U is young and made mistakes these factors will obviously be fixed soon due to the explicit nature of a E.U wide issue, it wont and cant be allowed to carry on. They have been talking about an immigration fix.

For example the issue is far higher then anything the UK has in Germany, don't you think they will want this changing just as much as Britian, it will be resolved.
edit on 16-1-2013 by tdk84 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 11:47 AM
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reply to post by tdk84
 

Thanks for that information, it's not a good idea to get into debt, it won't solve anything.

I'm sure the EU will just fall apart sooner or later, it's all about money, power and control.
I think it would be better to get out while we are all still on friendly terms than to wait for the big fallout when it will be impossible to sort anything out.

The money problems will never get sorted out because the people at the top take most of it for themselves and leave the workers struggling to survive.

I see the EU as a stepping stone to the NWO, the one world government, bank, police and armed forces. This is why I think they keep saying it's important the EU and the Euro don't fail, I wouldn't want to be around for that if they get that far.


edit on 16-1-2013 by LEL01 because: Added a word.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by murphy22
reply to post by LEL01
 


As an American, Let me warn you. If one of your politicians says our president (Obama) backs or supports anything,... It ain't a good deal for ya'll.


Thank you for the warning, I know we're all in the same boat and they're all working for the same Puppet Master. This is all just a trick, they'll never give us the referendum we want and even if they do they would just make us vote again if we vote the wrong way for them.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by tdk84



German accounts for 16% of the population by first langue. Beating English which is at 13%. Where English wins is due to the popularity for English as a Additional language or an L2 language. 38% speaking English as a second & only 11% for German.


I think most people (myself included) would agree that English has to be the likely preference, though there's no absolute guarantee on this.

One thing's for definite: there will be one official language for the union, it's inevitable.

Whatever that language turns out to be, it's going to enrage millions of people who don't speak that language.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by tdk84



German accounts for 16% of the population by first langue. Beating English which is at 13%. Where English wins is due to the popularity for English as a Additional language or an L2 language. 38% speaking English as a second & only 11% for German.


I think most people (myself included) would agree that English has to be the likely preference, though there's no absolute guarantee on this.

One thing's for definite: there will be one official language for the union, it's inevitable.

Whatever that language turns out to be, it's going to enrage millions of people who don't speak that language.



posted on Jan, 16 2013 @ 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by tdk84






My point is if all countries in the Europe are experiencing the same problem it will obviously be fixed. and your also missing my point... although the E.U is young and made mistakes these factors will obviously be fixed soon due to the explicit nature of a E.U wide issue, it wont and cant be allowed to carry on. They have been talking about an immigration fix. For example the issue is far higher then anything the UK has in Germany, don't you think they will want this changing just as much as Britian, it will be resolved.


One problem that can't ever be fixed is the fact that this is a political union and not merely a common market.

We didn't join a political union in 1973 nor vote to stay in a political union in the1975 referendum.

Obviously, the country would have overwhelmingly rejected that proposition.

Which is why they will overwhelmingly vote to leave the EU, given the opportunity.

And quite rightly so.

edit on 16-1-2013 by CJCrawley because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2013 @ 05:00 PM
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Cameron has cancelled the speech we've been waiting for. Oh well, it's not as if he was going to give us that vote anyway.
Sky News



posted on Jan, 22 2013 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by LEL01
 


The big speech is finally happening tomorrow in London.



posted on Jan, 22 2013 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by tdk84
 


Are you hearing this news tonight?
He is going to give us the in/out referendum in 2017/18.
I won't hold my breath, a lot can happen in 4/5 years, he might not even be PM after the next election.
I guess I'll have to wait until tomorrow to hear what else he has to say.



posted on Jan, 23 2013 @ 04:17 AM
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I'd like to quote Margrete Thatcher here, when confronted with the german reunion. What she said is what should happen when the UK leaves the EU:
"I want my money back"

And this whole germanophile stuff here is hard to read, really. The War ist now nearly 70 years over, get your attitude straight, the Germany and german people nowadays have nothing in common with the Third Reich, nor do we want something to do with these guys. And we are sooo tired to hear that stuff over and over and over again.
And when I have to guess, the UK won't survive long without the money from Brussels.
edit on 23/1/2013 by Talliostro because: (no reason given)





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