Disabled Pakistani girl may face death penalty for allegedly burning Koran

Originally posted by RimDaas
reply to post by butcherguy

 

I don't even think this is based on religion. This could be a false accusation, someone trying to get someone in trouble for their own personal reasons.

I should like to know, and you would be the person to ask. Some Islamic countries base the law entirely on religion. How is the Koran integrated into the law in Pakistan?
Thanks in advance for your answer.

reply to post by butcherguy


Let me give you one simple answer: It isn't.
Though Pakistan establishes itself as an Islamic Republic, they still don't operate under Shariah Law or the Quran. Instead, you see two sides controlling the country and the law.
One side is the fundies who don't follow the Quran and cherry pick out violent verses from the Hadiths and Quran to justify wars against the West and the government. One of these fundies was Zia Ul Haq, who although established the Blasphemy law, had good relations with the West.

Then we have the corrupt rich politicians who will use religion as a cover to gain followers. Then they turn their back on the people. They can be blamed for the extremism and attacks in Pakistan, since they have left the country in total devastation, with loadshedding, rising prices, poverty and little security.
Religion has been exploited very much is Pakistan. Lets pray for a better future in Pakistan.

Originally posted by HomerinNC
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

It's not as if America takes special, magic pieces of paper lightly either. Look at the bollocks the American right spout with regards the bible and the things they say and do because of what it says on that piece of special, magic paper. If it's not the bible, then how about fetishising another inanimate object? How do Americans feel about flag-burning? I've seen posts on here by Americans going kerrrraaaazzzzzy with regards to Muslims burning their stars and stripes. I wouldn't trust half this board with Muslims, after they'd had a four pack of blue ribbon with a rifle in the back of the truck.

Yeah, but we dont kill someone for burning a bible or burning a flag now, do we?

Hi,

The truth to this is somewhat different to what many posters have been saying. The state haven't said they will kill her, the religion doesn't say she should be killed. It was a mob more likely than not whipped into a state of righteous fury that wanted to kill her and other Christians.

This is like me coming onto your lawn and burning the constitution - some people may consider that an act punishable by death, some wierdos may even attempt it, but the actual court would (rightly) not be that bothered.

reply to post by butcherguy


Bible burning itself isn't the issue. It's the fetishisation of inanimate objects that's the issue. An object is neutral until people load it with meaning. Americans do this just as well as Pakistani Muslims. Flag burning is acceptable when Americans are doing it following the flag code. Other times? By non-Americans? Really? Why have a flag code in the first place if Americans haven't fetishised an inanimate object to the extent that it needs codes and laws to regulate its treatment?

Whether the law extends to execution is neither here or there. The crux of this story is that its about a backward mob mentality protecting a totem of some kind. A mob mentality which isn't specific to Pakistan and can also be found in America (and practically every country).

Stereotypes always have an element of truth in them. Although, actually beinga stereotype makes a person look sillier than a person referring to stereotypes.

Originally posted by something wicked

Hi,

The truth to this is somewhat different to what many posters have been saying. The state haven't said they will kill her, the religion doesn't say she should be killed. It was a mob more likely than not whipped into a state of righteous fury that wanted to kill her and other Christians.

This is like me coming onto your lawn and burning the constitution - some people may consider that an act punishable by death, some wierdos may even attempt it, but the actual court would (rightly) not be that bothered.

That's the point I've been making, right there. That mob mentality isn't a Muslim thing or a Pakistani thing. It's found all over, including, drum roll... America!

It seems to me that too many people are so quick to defend America, they're not paying attention to the story.

reply to post by RimDaas

Lets pray for a better future in Pakistan.

Indeed, it sounds like you need it.

Thanks for the first hand knowledge. It clears things up a bit for me, but sounds like it could be confusing to deal with there.

reply to post by stumason

No one is going to be executed and the girl was arrested for her own protection. If the Police had refused, the mob would have set upon her

Oh, well then,
What?

This makes it even worse, you mean to tell me there was an angry mob that was going to kill an eleven year old?

Originally posted by Merriman Weir
I don't believe any of this. Islam is the religion of peace and all this is lies.

Anyway, Marvin Wilson has stopped replying to my PrisonPal letters. I hope nothings happened to him whilst he's in that Texas prison.

Of course you do not believe it. Islam IS a religion of peace...BUT they fail to mention that it is PEACE for all Muslims after establishing a global caliphate. SO technically its not a Lie but its one of Omission.

reply to post by Merriman Weir

Bible burning itself isn't the issue. It's the fetishisation of inanimate objects that's the issue.

Sorry, I missed the part of the OP that outlined this as being 'the' issue.
You've covered it, so I guess the thread is dead.

Move along folks, nothing else to discuss here.

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

Bible burning itself isn't the issue. It's the fetishisation of inanimate objects that's the issue.

Sorry, I missed the part of the OP that outlined this as being 'the' issue.
You've covered it, so I guess the thread is dead.

Move along folks, nothing else to discuss here.

Sarcasm or stereotypes? On tonight's show, we discuss which is worse!

Bible burning wouldn't be the issue as it's about the Koran. The Koran is a book made up of nothing more than wood-pulp and ink, exactly the same as the bible. In that sense, it's no different from the bible or Darwin's origin of the species or the Yellow Pages. What makes a book 'special' is the attachment to it. Another poster mentioned the constitution. The actual object is just paper with ink on it. Nothing special at all. Paper with ink on it is burned and even shat on, every day. So what makes me #ting on the actual constitution or burning it any different from doing that to any other piece of paper, or any other inanimate object? It's what the thing represents and the fetishisation of it.

Muslims go bonkers over the mistreatment of the Koran because of the fetishisation of it. The meaning and privilege they attach to an other-wise mundane inanimate object. The same thing happens with American flags, the written constitution and so on.

It's not a hard concept to follow.

Originally posted by yuppa

Originally posted by Merriman Weir
I don't believe any of this. Islam is the religion of peace and all this is lies.

Anyway, Marvin Wilson has stopped replying to my PrisonPal letters. I hope nothings happened to him whilst he's in that Texas prison.

Of course you do not believe it. Islam IS a religion of peace...BUT they fail to mention that it is PEACE for all Muslims after establishing a global caliphate. SO technically its not a Lie but its one of Omission.

PRO-TIP: Once you've finished watching your V for Vendetta DVD for the 30th time, google "sarcasm".

Typical.

this is not Russia!

Someone pointed out in another thread dealing w/ the same news issue that I agree with....

Where we're her parents? I also can't believe that the pakistanis people don't understand down syndrome?

Something smells here....

reply to post by Stormdancer777


Yes. A mentally ill man was killed a while ago for desecrating on the Quran. He was burnt.

Originally posted by leosnake
this is not Russia!

I can imagine the consequences if someone did in Pakistan mosque that these idiots have done in Moscow church. punishment would instantly without any court

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Oh, well then,
What?

This makes it even worse, you mean to tell me there was an angry mob that was going to kill an eleven year old?

No, actually, this changes the whole premise of the thread. She is actually being protected by the State against a baying mob of religious idiots, not facing execution for perceived "blasphemy" (that such a crime even exists in the 21st century should be considered blasphemy....)

Originally posted by Merriman Weir

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Merriman Weir

 

Bible burning itself isn't the issue. It's the fetishisation of inanimate objects that's the issue.

Sorry, I missed the part of the OP that outlined this as being 'the' issue.
You've covered it, so I guess the thread is dead.

Move along folks, nothing else to discuss here.

Sarcasm or stereotypes? On tonight's show, we discuss which is worse!

Bible burning wouldn't be the issue as it's about the Koran. The Koran is a book made up of nothing more than wood-pulp and ink, exactly the same as the bible. In that sense, it's no different from the bible or Darwin's origin of the species or the Yellow Pages. What makes a book 'special' is the attachment to it. Another poster mentioned the constitution. The actual object is just paper with ink on it. Nothing special at all. Paper with ink on it is burned and even shat on, every day. So what makes me #ting on the actual constitution or burning it any different from doing that to any other piece of paper, or any other inanimate object? It's what the thing represents and the fetishisation of it.

Muslims go bonkers over the mistreatment of the Koran because of the fetishisation of it. The meaning and privilege they attach to an other-wise mundane inanimate object. The same thing happens with American flags, the written constitution and so on.

It's not a hard concept to follow.

I have no argument with your statement regarding 'fetishisation'.
I have a problem with your statement that it is 'the' issue.
I think there is a lot more to discuss than what you have characterized as 'the' issue.

Honestly, this is nothing all that surprising.

For starters; it's Pakistan.

Further, Americans and other western nations like to 'bend' or 'interpret' their laws. "Obviously, the laws weren't intended to apply the same to people who have impaired cognitive function." - A concept not shared by much of the rest of the world. The law is the law and it applies equally to all citizens unless there is a specific provision made (such as in the case of children under a certain age or who have not completed a sort of 'passage into adulthood').

Whether the individual understood his/her actions is typically irrelevant.

Although all law enforcement is ultimately subject to human subjectivity - Western nations are known for having very high degrees of subjective influence on their laws that many other nations just don't have.