George Takei's blog on the BSA reaffirmation of the ban on LGBT Scouts & Leaders

reply to post by HandyDandy


We already determined that Sandusky was gay and hiding it behind his marriage. It's hard to find the ones hiding like that, but the self proclaining homosexual admits openly he likes males. I'm very serious here people, BSA is a Christian group and if homosexuals push it and push it and somehow the government steps in then the homosexuals will be all alone in the BSA.

reply to post by HandyDandy


So you are saying that it is impossible to have friends that disagree with your lifestyle? I think light is being shed on why you people equate disagreement with hatred.
I assure you I have very good close friends, and family members as well. Generally speaking if I personally know a gay or lesbian person and we are not friends it is because they cannot accept the fact that I do not agree with their lifestyle.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
BSA is a Christian group and if homosexuals push it and push it and somehow the government steps in then the homosexuals will be all alone in the BSA.

I'd rather stand all alone than stand with biggots.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

The word Sodomy comes from the word Sodom. It is non penis/vagina sex like anal and oral.

The term comes from the Ecclesiastical Latin: peccatum Sodomiticum, or "sin of Sodom" and derives from the Greek word Σόδομα Sódoma.[2] The Book of Genesis (chapters 18-20) tells how God wished to destroy the sinful cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. Two angels (literally "messengers") are invited by Lot to take refuge with his family for the night. The men of Sodom surrounded Lot's house and demanded that he bring the messengers out, so that they can "know" them. Lot protests that the "messengers" are his guests, and offers them his virgin daughters instead, but the Sodomites threaten to "do worse" with Lot than with his guests; whereupon the angels strike the Sodomites blind, "so that they wearied themselves to find the door." (Genesis 19:4-11, KJV)

en.wikipedia.org...

Get your facts straight. Yes it was destroyed because of sexual immorality but particularly homosexuality.

But angels aren't men, so how could it be homosexuality? Sounds like the angels blinded the men to protect themselves and Lot.

From your same source, it says that another theory is that "sodomite" refers to male shrine prostitutes who had sex with women in fertility rites.

And then there is the theory that the problem with Sodom was that "she" was arrogant, and didn't help the needy, again, from your source.

Not too much in the way of facts - just a lot of theories.

reply to post by HandyDandy


So now disagreeing not only = hatred, but it also = bigotry? I'm at a total loss. I guess you really cannot communicate with someone that has thought processes like that.

reply to post by jonnywhite


By ripping away Eagle Scout standing from a kid who worked years to get it, is very harmful, simply because he is gay.
And being gay has nothing to do with learning how to be an Eagle Scout.

They are applying on context to something that has nothing to do with that context.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
We already determined that Sandusky was gay and hiding it behind his marriage. It's hard to find the ones hiding like that

Exactly my point.

None of the children whom Sandusky molested were protected. And especially by a rule of no homosexuals.

He would have had no problem becoming your boy's scout leader, so the no homosexual rule doesn't stop pedophilia in the BSA now does it?

A number of lawsuits have resulted. A study of 50 lawsuits against the Boy Scouts of America showed that from 1986 to 1991 BSA and local councils agreed to pay more than $15 million in damages. According to federal tax returns, BSA payments to one law firm in Miami working on abuse cases were more than one-half million dollars; the BSA insurance reserve, from which the damages are paid, stood at $61.9 million.

en.wikipedia.org...

Seems the ban on homosexuals being a deterent of abuse isn't working out too well, eh?

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

You can Love someone deeply and sincerely that you do not like, and you can like someone passionately that you do not Love.
I do not have to like you or your lifestyle to Love you. According to the Bible homosexuality is perverse and weird. So that means I hate you? That is a very juvenile way to think.
I have friends that are gay and they are fully aware of how I feel about their lifestyle and I am fully aware of their views towards Christianity. I am there anytime they need me but they know to never ever attempt to gain my approval and I do not push my faith upon them.
However this is a forum discussing the issue so I have given my input.
I hate noone......

So I assume you call your gay friends weirdos, perverts and pedophiles to their faces? With a friend like that, who needs enemies, right?

Originally posted by Christian Voice
I assure you I have very good close friends

Do you call those close friends perverts to their face? I highly doubt they would be your "friend" if you did.

It's just human nature.

reply to post by HandyDandy


You are missing the point that BSA is a Christian organization and the Christian Bible says homosexuality is wrong. They are asking Christians to completely drop their beliefs. That's not right.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by HandyDandy

 

You are missing the point that BSA is a Christian organization and the Christian Bible says homosexuality is wrong. They are asking Christians to completely drop their beliefs. That's not right.

Does the BSA exclude Jews or Muslims? Atheists?

reply to post by Christian Voice


Than that means that the BSA will have to start screening all leaders to make sure they haven't had pre-marital sex.

Or is it the usual pick and choose to back up fear and bigotry?

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by Christian Voice

 

Than that means that the BSA will have to start screening all leaders to make sure they haven't had pre-marital sex.

... Or that they have never eaten a ham sandwich or shellfish, or gotten a tattoo, or had sex with their wives while they were menstruating... but they can join if they own slaves.

reply to post by HandyDandy


Perversion is a concept describing those types of human behavior that are excessive or deviated from what is considered to be orthodox or normal. Although it can refer to varying forms of deviation, it is most often used to describe sexual behaviors that are seen by an individual as abnormal, repulsive or obsessive. Perversion differs from deviant behavior, since the latter refers to a recognized violation of social rules or norms. It is often considered derogatory and in psychological literature the term paraphilia has been used as a replacement,[1] though this term is controversial, and "deviation"[2] is now used instead by others

en.wikipedia.org...

You act like I called a homosexual something God aweful. Just calling a spade a spade.
Yes they know that that is how I feel.
Hey, if you can't have Christian friends then that's your business, myself, I can have friends that are not.
Let me ask this, if your child commits murder, do you hate your child? I doubt it, but you most certainly hate his sin or his crime. You still love your child. Do you call them a murderer, yes but still Love them.
To answer your question yes I have called them perverts, two think it's funny and wear it like a badge and a few others were offended but they also called me derainged for believing in something you can't see. Adults can be friends and disagree. But it seems that the hatred is coming from your side of the table apparently.

reply to post by HandyDandy


Yes they do, in their oath "On my honor I'll do my best to do my duty to God and my country",,,, atheists have been fighting like the homosexuals to gain entry to BSA. I seriously doubt muslims and Jews would want to join a known Christian group. I would imagine they would stick to groups from their own religion.

reply to post by kaylaluv


If you study it the Angels were in the form of MEN, which was pretty much the norm in the Bible. Study the original texts and wording and you will learn so much.

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by jonnywhite

 

By ripping away Eagle Scout standing from a kid who worked years to get it, is very harmful, simply because he is gay.
And being gay has nothing to do with learning how to be an Eagle Scout.

They are applying on context to something that has nothing to do with that context.

I honestly think you're so concentrated on the trees you do not see the forest. Of course this is stupid of them to kick him out in such a manner, but by doing that they're enforcing their rules and retaining their honor and the respect of their members. Obviously, these're just kids and adolescents and having stringent rules of these sorts without leeway is shoddy. A lot of kids don't know they're gay until they're adolescents at least. So this means that a good bunch of them that end up in the BSA will not run the risk of "coming out" until they're well into becoming eagle scouts. As you know, there's a policy in the BSA to not talk about your sexual orientation. So, if you're homosexual, you keep it to yourself. Of course, the scouts will probably talk anyway and somehow this news gets out and then the BSA has to follow its policy. My hope is that a friendlier method is found to deal with these incidents. But I wouldn't use it as an excuse to remove their rights as a private institution.

You do know that children and adolescents get harmed in all sorts of various organizations in various ways? Sports are widely known for the injuries. Growing children get stressed by it all easily. This is not to say we should look the other way and let them deal with it. We have to keep a broad but measured view on this. NOTHING in life is painless. Everything is earned and we make mistakes. In fact, we probably learn the most from our mistakes, not our successes. But how does this translate to children? Naturally, parents don't want their kids to make mistakes and suffer as a result.

This kid may be the one to grow up and make a new scouts organization that competes on the level of the BSA as a national symbol. So while you fixate on this blunder and all of the intricacies, I tell you that the forest is much bigger than you can see from your slight perspective. There's a larger potentiality outside our awareness, you see. Freedom happens to be an incubator of change and if you just step back and let people deal with it then you'll tolerate the BSA better. This change won't kill off the BSA (can't kill God!), but it will be the spring board for many alternatives to the BSA.

Again, here're some alternatives to BSA, and this will grow(!):
www.bsa-discrimination.org...

reply to post by kaylaluv


Again, you speak of things of which you know nothing of. The food thing was Jewish law, not Christian law. It never says tattoos are wrong. In Leviticus it talks about tattoos but it is about pagans tattooing the image of the deceased onto their bodies in an attempt to gain their essence or spirit. It says that John had the image of God inscribed on his leg, and it also says to inscribe the name of God on your palm or forehead. Sexual immorality yes very wrong, sex before marriage very wrong but that is where forgiveness comes in.
A homosexual can be saved but that sin will end at that moment. He may struggle and backslide but will strive to make it right.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by HandyDandy

 

So now disagreeing not only = hatred, but it also = bigotry? I'm at a total loss. I guess you really cannot communicate with someone that has thought processes like that.

Unless we have now changed the meaning of bigot, then I'd say it fits nicely.

big·ot (bgt)
n.
One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

www.thefreedictionary.com...

But you're not a bigot correct? You tolerate those who differ? By calling them perverts?

reply to post by HandyDandy


Wow, that word is really killing you. Yes, I tolerate them. Like I said I have friends that are gay. I tolerate them, I disagree with them.
Tell me, why does the word pervert offend you so much?