American Muslims Stone Christians in Dearborn, MI

reply to post by TrueAmerican


They should have been arrested! They had one motive, and it did not involve religion, only bigotry.
SHAME ON THEM!

I have never questioned the legality of the protests, but for some reason that is what many posters rebuttals include? Is the morality of the protests simply indefensable? I think so.

Originally posted by dontreally
If the Muslims had any sense, and given the level of the vulgarity and immaturity in their remonstrations, I take it they have very little, they would have moved as far away as possible from those Christian protestors.

Of course, I understand their annoyance. But their response is a bit overboard. And the swearing, the tawdry use of F-uck, pu-ssies, implies a desire to foment a violent confrontation, and not avoid one.

The Muslim Festival attracts nearly 300,000 people annually...I would show restraint in painting the sum of the festival attendees with the brush or "if the Muslims had any sense". I have no doubt that what is shown in the video is the dramatic minority of attendees given the 300k that attended.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
By the way, as an atheist I have to say watching this video was a bit like watching monkeys fling poo at each other...I guess Darwin was right after all

Are you insinuating that because you are an atheist that you are exempt from flinging poo? Do you think your generalisation and mocking tone is not poo slinging?

reply to post by Indigo5


They look like smart ass kids messing with ignorant cultists.

Originally posted by Ilovecatbinlady

Originally posted by MrXYZ
By the way, as an atheist I have to say watching this video was a bit like watching monkeys fling poo at each other...I guess Darwin was right after all

Are you insinuating that because you are an atheist that you are exempt from flinging poo? Do you think your generalisation and mocking tone is not poo slinging?

Of course not...why should I be exempt? Doesn't make it any better though

No to the second answer too. Mostly because I'm not generalizing anything...I'm merely talking about the Christian protestors and the battling Muslims in the video.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
By the way, as an atheist I have to say watching this video was a bit like watching monkeys fling poo at each other...I guess Darwin was right after all

As an "Atheist" you are actually religious.
You believe there is no God, despite the fact it's impossible to know either way.
Therefore faith based religion.

This reveals your innate bias against Christians. Atheists in the USA tend to be like anti-Christian zealots who live and breathe causing trouble for Christians.

You are only on the Muslims side because you hate Christians.
If it were Muslims getting stoned by Christians, you would be on the opposite side.

That's not even a real opinion you have there. You are just fulfilling the requirements of your bias belief system/religion you call "atheism" where you pretend to know the ultimate facts of the universe and stuff.

No better than what you despise.

reply to post by ItsSocietysFault
so, rather than share with me since i asked, you choose to dismiss my request with ...

"Yeah I did actually somebody posted it and I quoted it and said thanks" ?

hey, thanks for the cooperation

point is, if you're referring to the Brandenburg decision, it is totally UNapplicable in this instance. try again.
none of the missionaries were advocating violence, yet, the muslims were engaging in it.

point of fact: since the NBP (new black panthers) are a well-established "hate" group, which has not been held accountable or legally liable for placing a nationwide bounty on another American, there is nothing these missionaries did that qualifies.

however, if the missionaries had been screaming things that advocate intentional destruction of the festival accomodations, rape/kill/murder all muslims, stuff like that, you might have a case.

the video doesn't stir my emotions one bit as i cannot view it.
this is about rights and no video is needed to clarify those.

It gets so confusing which is why I withhold the type of judgement you are trying to paint me into.

first, i'm not painting anything, i asked a direct question which you are avoiding.

it is not confusing, even moreso if the missionaries were older than 65yrs young.
if they were elders, then the children (Americans) should have been in cuffs, jailed and charged with the applicable "hate crime" they committed.
(and there are also laws that could hold their parents accountable cause they were present)

i am not picking any argument, i am discussing rights minus the frivolous religious emotional attachments.

Originally posted by muzzleflash

That case is about the "Advocacy of violence verbally".

This case we are talking about here, it's about actual real violence being used on the street and how religion is the main factor determining if it's ok to be violent or not.

Some religions cannot even get away with stating an opinion.
Others can get away with mob violence.

Apparently...

Again context is key.
If you watch the video you will notice that they asked the guy to not use his bullhorn anymore.
Unfortunately we do not have video of what they were saying. And who knows what they were saying to the crowd. It would be nice to see prior video of these guys spouting their message.
And written speech is still speech.



If your speech is about to cause imminent lawless action then it's not protected by the constitution.
Technically these guys are bordering on breaking the law. The police did the right thing telling these guys to leave.

Now if the protest were of a different nature . And the signs said that both christians and muslims worship the same god and we are all brothers or something similar.

Then yes I would wholeheartedly agree with you.
But that is clearly not the case.
These guys came to start trouble.

Originally posted by muzzleflash

Originally posted by MrXYZ
By the way, as an atheist I have to say watching this video was a bit like watching monkeys fling poo at each other...I guess Darwin was right after all

As an "Atheist" you are actually religious.
You believe there is no God, despite the fact it's impossible to know either way.
Therefore faith based religion.

This reveals your innate bias against Christians. Atheists in the USA tend to be like anti-Christian zealots who live and breathe causing trouble for Christians.

You are only on the Muslims side because you hate Christians.
If it were Muslims getting stoned by Christians, you would be on the opposite side.

That's not even a real opinion you have there. You are just fulfilling the requirements of your bias belief system/religion you call "atheism" where you pretend to know the ultimate facts of the universe and stuff.

No better than what you despise.

Well then, how would you qualify someone who doesn't believe in unicorns? Because both unicorns and gods lack any sort of objective evidence.

Where's the evidence? Not believing in stuff because of a lack of evidence doesn't make you religious

But fine...call me an agnostic then. I can't know for certain a god or gods don't exist...but if they do, we haven't found any evidence supporting that claim.

Honestly, right wing religious zealots of all religions are the ones who have permanently destroyed the folly of religion. Really.

If the folks were truly peace loving, the religiouso folks are at least entertaining as they extoll talking animals, zombies and such, but toss in rabidly violent and entertaining because infuriating.

How unthinking, how devoid of logical, and bereft of intelligence are the faithful that actually believe the fiction from the past? You know that fiction was dreamt up as a way to assume control of masses when there wasn't a "reason" that those looking to assume control should have that control?

Don't they realize that there is no god. No Allah. No Yahweh. No Jesus (as savior). It is all excrement. What rubes we are when in masses.

Derek

reply to post by jiggerj

In a public place? Does this mean because I'm white I can't go to a Spanish festival? Since I'm french am I banned from a German Oktoberfest? Should I stay away from Italian and Chinese restaurants? Come on!

You are welcome to attend and have a good time, just don't disrupt the thing and be disrespectful.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

I don't condone violence at all...and yes, they overreacted. But clearly the blame can't be put solely on them.

If a Muslim walked up to a Christian like that with a megaphone in a predominantly Christian neighbourhood...how long do you think would it take until the first punch is thrown??

Whoever throws the first punch when they are not being threatened with physical harm is the guilty party. Freedom of speech demands we respect those opinions and views that differ from our own, even if they are being shouted in our ear or interrupting our festival.

reply to post by grey580

If your speech is about to cause imminent lawless action then it's not protected by the constitution

here's an idea ... when and only when the New Black Panthers are prosecuted for placing a nationwide, monetary bounty on the head of a fellow American, you can use that legal precedence, but, even then, considering the facts alluded to in this case, you still won't gain any grounds for assault.

edit to add:

These guys came to start trouble

so ?? that happens on every corner of America, every day ... still doesn't allow for random assault.

Ok when i read the thread i was like oh yeah those muslims here they go creating trouble again but really, i was trying to read the signs these guys brought to this rally, and yeah no matter what rally you would go to from whatever race, but you start calling other races "Thieves" and "Murderers" you deserve what you get. They are lucky they left that place in one piece, if i was a muslim and present at the rally, There would be some serious ass kicking from my end. The stupid thing is these guys bring this # to a place where there are so many kids, i didn't see too many adults in the muslim crowd, i mean really you wanna preach your hate message to KIDS. Pretty stupid.

What did these Christians expect to happen?

Let's get to some of the facts here... this is a Muslim Festival, and these Christians are there to hold up signs and tell these Muslims how their religion is wrong and the Christians religion is correct.

So now let's take religion out of the mix... what if this was a Gay Pride event, or a Black Pride type of event, and the KKK shows up to protest? NO one would care if the gays threw bottles out at the KKK. No one would care if Blacks threw bottles at the KKK.

So why should I care if Muslims throw crap at Christians? Fact is, if the Christians were not there putting down the religious beliefs of another religion, no one would have thrown anything.

Sometimes when you go looking for trouble, you find it.

See this is just it, [I posted the two long posts regarding Leftist supporting Islam], so many here are debating Christianity and Islam, blah blah blah

but you see, That's just it, that's what they WANT you to do, because it's Distracting from the Very real issue. Back a few pages, someone posted a photo of these protestors, with their signs, etc., OK, offensive, yea...

but HOW about the thousands of protests in Western worlds, where Muslims go to Christian or Pagan or even SECULAR events, and do the

SAME DAMN THING.

ALL THE TIME, ALL THE TIME

with signs that say Death to all Infidels, Death to America, Holocaust awaits, and all the other Hate Garbage they spew,

and ALL WITH PROTECTED RIGHTS.

All of it,

have you Once seen the Westerners STONE THEM? NO, not once, and Why,?

Because one, our cowardice governments who care nothing more than about greed and gold and water [water will be huge] are allowing this # to happen...because of the BANKS [Sharia Banking]

where the Gold is stored in vaults, etc.

Two, because of the Trade with SLAVERY deals the West has made, that and the mass debt to China...

so, I'm sorry but boo hoo, you know, they have some Hate Speech thrown their way,

I'm sorry but you know, it's HATE SPEECH when you come onto This land, and demand that you have a right to CUT OFF YOUR WIFE'S HEAD,

it's HATE SPEECH when you come onto this land, and demand that YOU have a right to KILL YOUR DAUGHTERS WHO DON'T WANT TO MARRY YOUR PERVERT 'SALE' OLD MAN FOR MONEY

it's HATE SPEECH when you come onto this land, and demand that YOU have a right to send your daughters to Somalia and have them castrated--and forced into marriage at the age of 9

it's HATE SPEECH when you come onto this land, and demand that YOU have a right to FORCE others to not eat pork lest it offend you [in UK they did just this], demand that YOU have the right to have Fridays off while YOU stand there and call Latino women whores, sluts, and insult THEIR RELIGION, [done in This nation--at Meat Packing plants]

it's HATE SPEECH when you come onto this land and demand that YOU have the right to mass rape, gang rape, and that the courts don't prosecute because YOU think that YOUR religion and You are SUPREMACY over all--

you know, to hell with that crap. YOU aren't Supreme, it's That simple. And I for one, Won't bow down to you and kiss your ass,

not to YOU Islam, not to YOU Christian zealot, and not to YOU totatitarian leftist nutjob or pedo wank or any other Supremacy asshole.

Not to YOU either right wing asshole--you know, to me it's same thing...

but don't give me this crap, about oh poor Muslims n Michigan who have been TERRORIZING neighborhoods and #ting on people's rights...oh yes, they have,

and Especially in Europe [they should kick your asses back to where you came from, Seriously]

and then Insist on Liberal laws to Protect you while YOU abuse human rights and spew Hate Speech on a day to day basis...including by the Acts you do,

I am FED up with seeing girls killed because they want a Choice in Who they marry, I am Sick of seeing small children sent off to be castrated, I am Sick of seeing Asian women enslaved by Muslims and tortured, gang raped, with impunity..I am Sick of it,

and that's not even a Fourth of the human right abuses...labor abuses, women's rights abuses.

I stand NOT as Christian or American or Western, I stand as a Human...and the Human Right abuses, have Got to go--and That includes Islam,

and if that's Hate Speech for you, too damn bad. I'm willing to fight for it--be it YOU, be it some other Fascist thug, no matter what religion, and That is the issue right there,

I get Sick of hearing the Death to Jews #, sick of it. I get sick of seeing women jailed for being raped, I am really Sick of the GENOCIDE AND HOLOCAUST in Sudan that is IGNORED,

BY MUSLIMS

do something about your OWN IMPERIALISM, YOUR OWN ABUSES TO YOUR OWN RELIGION EVEN, before you point at the West about hate speech, etc...that's Why we have Freedom of Speech,

if you Don't like it, then GO BACK HOME...because NO American, no European, would get by with the garbage in YOUR nations, EVER, that you have gotten by with here.

China and Russia wouldn't even put up with it--try throw stones at Them,

Americans need to get some balls, seriously, it's really sad that it takes the fundie fanatics, to SEE what's wrong with this picture, and I don't agree with them, whatsoever...where that whole 'my dick is bigger and my gawd is bigger, blah blah blah', but

Nazi's marched, Jews came out--you didn't see Them throwing stones...

Originally posted by redneck13
Freaks are all for the Muslims that had no grounds to physically attack them by throwing things
In this country you can walk anywhere in the public domain and say anything you want to
That is what is in our constitution
This country is in piss poor shape

Hail you great crusader, i have a question for you.

You are taking a walk with your mother and father through the park near your home. Suddenly out of nowhere appears a man and starts insulting your mother. Your father slaps the man, what do you do ? Would you protect the man and his "freedom of speech" or would you help your father ?

reply to post by grey580





Those signs are provocative, and it is attack on the freedom of religion and case of "stand your ground" if I ever saw a reason.

These bigots surely mean trouble and they could have started shooting the festival goers.

You don't go into a synagogue and start goose stepping while insulting the Jewish religion. The same thing goes with a Muslim festival.