The Most Effective Lie Ever Told. The Satanic Agenda Revealed. Urgent Message to All.

Originally posted by alkesh
I am dumbfounded by people who believe in a book that was written in the bronze age by people that KNEW the earth was flat and KNEW the earth was the center of the universe. So they must KNOW how the universe and everything in it came to be.

edit on 26-4-2012 by alkesh because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-4-2012 by alkesh because: (no reason given)

well, uh, hey - where is the center of infinity, anyway?..

the bi-bull, is quite evidently the sumerian epics of creation carried over from the destruction of babylon, by akhenaten, as moses, after his failed implementation of a monotheism in the 18th dynasty. can i get an 'amen'? can we stop worshiping their false idols and recognise that we are the centers of the universe?

stand and feel your worth, not cower at the threshold of the Unseen.

I thought for sure that you were going to talk about all of the subliminal messages on TV. I have one task for the ppl who are blind to the illuminati symbols in the music industry! Go to YouTube and watch Rihanna's video "S&M". Watch the video screenshot by screenshot and tell me what you see!

reply to post by uscitizen859


I have a hard time trying to fathom the fear that people have of "the Illuminati."
You have a secret society devoted to light...knowledge and logic.
The only way they could be a threat is if you're one of the three Abrahamic religions,
which focus on separating humans from each other and their wallets, and by promoting
ignorance and fear, as they do not stand up to critical thinking.

Truthfully, I'm more afraid of religious people than I'd ever be of someone who devotes their life to
pagan knowledge, and an understanding of science and the spirit.

The Illuminati has become the same kind of boogey man that religions love to create to keep people
afraid. So far, short of making some lovely architecture across the globe, and decorating a little currency, they've done nothing to elicit the level of fear associated with their namesake. Everything people throw out to compare them to "satanists" is just another example of how religion breeds ignorance.
Personally, if they do have a secret agenda, and that goal is to bring about an end to Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, all I can say is, "Where do I sign up?"


reply to post by autowrench


Stars to you, Auto... as per usual.

reply to post by smithjustinb


You lost me when you said "we can create peace on Earth". Speaking from the same Bible that you quote, it states that only God will bring peace to Earth after the tribulation and the last great battle. In other words, there is no way that WE, as in mankind, can create peace on Earth. You have already contradicted yourself. Another thing, at least according to the Bible, is that EVERYTHING NOT OF GOD is of Satan, so anything and everything is part of this Satanic agenda that you speak of, unless it is of God. Regardless, I find it hard to believe a book written by man, and that isn't to say that I don't believe in God, because I certainly do, just not man's dogmatic deffinition of God.

Originally posted by autowrench

Well, the local Christian crowd assures me that the Bible is literally true, and must me taken in a literal manner. So which is it then? It states plainly that God created evil. Did God lie? Rhetorical question, I know. Circular logic? Care to explain to me just what Isaiah 45 means then?

As I already explained, God created evil when he created Satan and his angels, but they weren't always evil. He created them in perfection first, then they rebelled.

Maybe this in depth article on Lucifer's rebellion will help you to understand how evil came about. But as I stated before, God created Lucifer and God created free will, therefore, it can be said that God created evil.

mcdonaldroad.org...

As for the rest of Isaiah 45, it is clear that He will make "the crooked places straight". This includes Israel. God is basically stating that He's had a plan for Israel all along and they will acknowledge Him yet. He will fulfill His promises to them and prove to them, once and for all, that everything He told them to be true, was the truth, even though they didn't listen to Him and turned their back on Him the first time. The other nations will recognize Him and acknowledge Him as well.

I just want to add that God wanted his angels and man to follow and worship him freely through free will. Unfortunately, it was through free will that evil was created. You have to know that Satan can't be too happy about the fact that man was given a plan of salvation and the angels were not. Once they chose to rebel against God, that was it for them. The angels were supposed to look after man and lead them, but some chose to corrupt them instead and God isn't going to forgive them for it.

Originally posted by Wonders

Originally posted by smithjustinb

Originally posted by BioSafe
I am trying to come to grips with what you are saying. The premise has merit. However can you please explain how Taking the life from another or forbidding liberty from another is good. How does greed fit into your equation? I get the general gist of your intent but am having a hard time bringing it all together.

We were made to be what we are. The point is accepting what we are. This includes the things we do. These things are going to happen probably for eternity regardless of what we believe. The point is, what are you doing? and how do you feel about being a part of a world where things like that happen? If we're ever going to find real peace, we're going to have to learn to accept that which is. Just because those things happen, doesn't mean if you were in their shoes you wouldn't have done the same thing. Who are we to judge? Its all about relativity, and all you can do is be you.

Why is the point of your thread convieniently on the 10th reply of the thread you posted? If you stated that the point of your thread was to tell everyone reading that they should just accept everyone and accept everything they do.."all you can do is be you", well you certainly seem to be trying to change some people, why can't they just be themselves? What are YOU doing? "Just because those things happen, doesn't mean if you were in their shoes you wouln't have done the same thing."

I'm not trying to change anything. I could care less how you live your life, that's not for me to judge. All I'm doing is sharing what I know and trying to show those who are unaware a way to lasting God-llike peace if they are interested. All I'm doing is sharing information because I have a strong drive towards truth and helping others also find truth. I am at peace whether you are at peace or not, so it doesn't really matter to me if you listen to what I have to say or not, for I am not the one your decisions affect. Do as you will. This message was intended for those who are looking for peace, but can't find it, not for those who have closed their minds due to cultural influences.

The bible is the most popular book of all time, each of us has a choice to pick it up and learn from it, there is a whole lot more to it than the story of Adam and Eve. I suggest you get off of your pedestal and try to understand what the bible teaches,

I'm not on a pedestal. And quit assuming that I don't already understand the Bible thoroughly. I do.

it wasn't written to teach people that, "Just because those things happen, doesn't mean if you in their shoes you wouldn't have done the same thing." Not only is that logic pathetic, it is, for many people, untrue. You call those who read bibles "bible thumpers",

Show me the quote where I called someone a "bible thumper". It didn't happen.

a derogatory term for those who study the bible, you are hypocrite, why not "just accept" and "love" bible readers

I do accept and love them. It is you who has not accepted me.

instead you are so ready to agree with that "become a satanist" reply. I can only hope that people will be smart enough and moral enough to know that what they do matters and not stand by and accept whatever happens like a lab rat because there are going to be plenty of other people who make positive differences in the lives of others, they won't "just accept" their situation.

edit on 10/01/11 by Wonders because: To add.

All that happens and has ever happened and ever will happened does so because God created it that way. Do you not see the ignorance in judgement? What are you judging when you judge? What are you calling bad? Would you look God dead square in his face and say, "God, I don't like what you made, it's bad, it should be different."? WOULD YOU??? Yes you would, because this is what you do every time you make a judgement. Who do you think you are? Are you not guilty of the same things Lucifer was guilty of? You think you can change the world to your liking... be a creator? Why would you want to? Is this creation not good enough for you? Are you dissatisfied? I'll ask again, who do you think you are? You sound like Lucifer to me. The one who thought he could do it better. HA! Who do you think you are?

Don't be a fool. Accept all.

Originally posted by WickettheRabbit
Before reading through every response, I had to get this out.

You say God made everything that exists.

Evil exists.

God made evil?

So...

Did God create evil or just the knowledge of it? Either way, if it exists, God created it. The wise know this and judge not.

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

Dear smithjustinb,

I believe Satan is a mental condition created by said circumstances. I believe this mental condition serves a purpose which I barely have the wisdom to discern, and I am thankful to have this condition and I accept it. I am who I am and we are who we are and we couldn't be anything else. The question is, how much longer are we going to be blind to the glory of our existence? How much longer are we going to be in turmoil wiithin ourselves? When will there be peace? When we learn to accept this... all of it.

The conflict is in our defining ourselves. Satan, if you believe he exists, is defined as a sentient being with free will. His goal appears to be to have us worship him rather than God.

Satan's goal was for us to have knowledge of good and evil. Every time we judge, we are helping Satan actualize his agenda. We are serving him because this is exactly what he wanted us to do. There is nothing to judge except that which is and that which is is the creation. The creation is what God has made. And we judge it? We humans are the ones who get to decide what is good and bad that God has made? Or is good and bad really a relative thing with no absolute definition and therefore a lie. Lies come from a deceiver. Imagine, you made some masterpiece artwork that you thought was the greatest thing. How would you feel if I came up to you and offered my opinion and my opinion was that your artwork looks like crap? Does it really look like crap? Not necessarily, that's my own relative opinion and means nothing. But you, the one who made it, got hurt.

Who do we think we are?... Judging?

Acceptance.

Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

You lost me when you said "we can create peace on Earth". Speaking from the same Bible that you quote, it states that only God will bring peace to Earth after the tribulation and the last great battle. In other words, there is no way that WE, as in mankind, can create peace on Earth. You have already contradicted yourself.

God is all that is. So I see no contradiction.

Another thing, at least according to the Bible, is that EVERYTHING NOT OF GOD is of Satan, so anything and everything is part of this Satanic agenda that you speak of, unless it is of God.

What is of God is the creation. The truth. What exists.
What is of Satan is lies. That which doesn't exist that we are led to believe does. If it exists as something true, it is not of Satan, it is the creation created by God of God. If it is a relative thing that you have convinced yourself is ultimate truth, it is of Satan.

Regardless, I find it hard to believe a book written by man, and that isn't to say that I don't believe in God, because I certainly do, just not man's dogmatic deffinition of God.

edit on 26-4-2012 by OptimusSubprime because: (no reason given)

We all gain wisdom and some of us have divine experiences, but our interpretations of them might not always be true. Man interpreted what they saw and wrote it down. That doesn't mean it didn't happen, but when they started adding their own opinions of what happened, that's where the falsehoods begin.

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by autowrench

Well, the local Christian crowd assures me that the Bible is literally true, and must me taken in a literal manner. So which is it then? It states plainly that God created evil. Did God lie? Rhetorical question, I know. Circular logic? Care to explain to me just what Isaiah 45 means then?

As I already explained, God created evil when he created Satan and his angels, but they weren't always evil. He created them in perfection first, then they rebelled.

The rebellion is in the judgement. It is in the belief that this isn't good enough and the belief that you think you can do better. Not you specifically, but just in general. Making us "eat the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil" was Satan's way of causing us to rebel with him. We are guilty of following Satan. If you can't see this, your blinders are up.

Originally posted by Deetermined
I just want to add that God wanted his angels and man to follow and worship him freely through free will. Unfortunately, it was through free will that evil was created. You have to know that Satan can't be too happy about the fact that man was given a plan of salvation and the angels were not. Once they chose to rebel against God, that was it for them. The angels were supposed to look after man and lead them, but some chose to corrupt them instead and God isn't going to forgive them for it.

I know the Bible might say that, but God is fair and just. Their is redemption and forgiveness for anyone, man or angel, who choose to forgive themselves and others.

The Bible says something like "on that day they will be cast into the lake of fire for eternity". Something like that. To me, this means, we're going to find peace with God, and they will continue to freely rebel. But they are not hopeless. There is peace freely given for any who will come to it.

reply to post by smithjustinb


I'm not sure I agree with you on this one. First of all, the angels knew God as their Creator and were living in all of His glory before they rebelled. If they knew the truth from the very beginning, and still chose to rebel, why should they be given another chance? At least for humans, we've never lived in perfection or have ever been given the knowledge that they had from the beginning, that's why God created a plan of salvation for us.

reply to post by Akragon


It is his life that shows us how to live, but it was in his death that he saved us.

For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit . . .1 Peter 3:18

PLPL

Originally posted by Minori
reply to post by Akragon

 

It is his life that shows us how to live, but it was in his death that he saved us.

For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit . . .1 Peter 3:18

PLPL

It doesn't make any sense how Jesus's dying can save any one. It does make sense how his teachings can.

If the purpose is to JUST be accepting - to fully have acceptance - then should we also accept does who do not wish to live and accepting life?

In the sixteenth century St. Augustine said, "Either God cannot abolish evil, or He will not. If he cannot, He is not all-powerful; if He will not, He is not all-God." He then went on to say, "Whence my ability to wish evil and refuse the good? Who placed this in me and planted the seedling of bitterness in me, since my whole being is from my most sweet God? If the Devil is the originator, then what is the source of the Devil?"

That is one of my favorite quotes from St. Augustine above. The question perplexed him as deeply then, as it does mankind today. I suspect the question will perplex man far into the future also.

Here is my thing. If there were no freedom (free will) then, and only then, could God alone be responsible for evil.

Here is one of my pagan blessings I say whenever I encounter "evil" usually within other people. Very rarely do I come across something not alive that exhibits evil.

In all is hell's abyss,
In all is heaven's grace,
What you elect and want,
You have in any place.
I wish for you love and peace.
Blessed Be

Originally posted by Deetermined

As I already explained, God created evil when he created Satan and his angels, but they weren't always evil. He created them in perfection first, then they rebelled.

Satan isn't a being, it's a word... a term from the Greek satanas, meaning an adversary or one who plots against another, and from the Hebrew satan, which means the same thing.

Maybe this in depth article on Lucifer's rebellion will help you to understand how evil came about. But as I stated before, God created Lucifer and God created free will, therefore, it can be said that God created evil.

Wrong. Christianity took a pagan idea (surprise surprise), in this case the original name for Venus the morning star, and made it evil, as they do with everything pagan that can't be assimilated into their faux creed. The name Lucifer doesn't even appear in the Torah, nor does it appear in the original Greek version of the New Testament.
As it was realized that fear would be necessary to herd people into churches to give up their freedoms and money, the idea of an "evil devil" was born, twisting the message of the Old Testament in order to make people afraid of Hell (which means "grave" in the old tongue).

New Testament Mistranslations 101:

Christians have traditionally interpreted Isaiah 14:12 to be Satan or the devil but the name Lucifer does not appear in the original Hebrew...instead it reads: "How are you fallen from heaven, O shining king, son of Dawn!"

It is referring to the Assyrian King Sargon II and his death. The name Lucifer was added later by Christian translators.

The Hebrew name azazel is used as a name for Satan. Azazel means Scape-goat and it is from this imagery that we get Satan with cloven Hooves and a goats head.

Reference to Azazel can be found in Leviticus 16:8-10

Job 1:7 and 8, the Hebrew name that is used is "adversary"....not satan.

1Chronicles 21:1 says in the Hebrew: The anger of the LORD flared up against Israel....
Weirdly, it was translated into "Satan arose against Israel......"

Psalms 109 isn't even talking about the devil and the name satan does not appear there ...the word is "accuser".

And again in Zechariah the word used there in Hebrew is "accuser" not the actual name Satan.

The name Satan only appears in some translations of the New Testament, not at all in the Old Testament.

So in a way, you're right. God didn't create evil, men did. The entire Christian faith is the source of Hell as an evil place, Lucifer as a monstrous deceiver, the entire threat of everlasting damnation. These are all Christian creations. The irony is, the rules that Christianity put in place to make these things seem like a legitimate punishment are broken everytime a Christian chooses the NT as their book of faith, everytime they go to church on Sunday, everytime they wear a cross, or hang a picture of Christ up in their homes, and everytime they pray to Christ instead of "God." In a way, the only ones who qualify for the Christian-created eternal damnation are in fact Christians, and not just bad Christians, but good ones as well.

reply to post by alkesh

I am dumbfounded by people who believe in a book that was written in the bronze age by people that KNEW the earth was flat and KNEW the earth was the center of the universe. So they must KNOW how the universe and everything in it came to be.

I didn't get the chance to read all the replies to this post throughout the pages, but I'll just throw in some facts and head out. I might be back to discuss the original post.

No verse in the Bible claims that the earth is flat - that is a misinterpretation of Isaiah 40:22. There is also no verse that claims that the Earth is at the centre of the universe; neither did the people back in that day believe it, for it was a claim made by the Vatican (or the Catholics I think) and that is the notion that motivated them to kill Galileo for his astronomical finds.

Originally posted by alkesh
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

very little wisdom offered in the bible..not anything anyone with lick of common sense or reason couldn't figure out on their own..

Try taking a good, hard look at the book of Proverbs. I think you'll be surprised to find that most of the things you call "common sense" or "reason" aren't things we can figure out on our own easily, or they may even teach the opposite of what you thought was "wise".

Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
In the sixteenth century St. Augustine said, "Either God cannot abolish evil, or He will not. If he cannot, He is not all-powerful; if He will not, He is not all-God." He then went on to say, "Whence my ability to wish evil and refuse the good? Who placed this in me and planted the seedling of bitterness in me, since my whole being is from my most sweet God? If the Devil is the originator, then what is the source of the Devil?"

That is one of my favorite quotes from St. Augustine above. The question perplexed him as deeply then, as it does mankind today. I suspect the question will perplex man far into the future also.

I am not perplexed. I fully understand the solution to this conundrum St. Augustine found himself contemplating. What I don't understand is why others are having a hard time seeing it. I guess religion (more accurately churches) has burned into our minds a depiction of God that isn't necessarily true, so if an idea is presented that doesn't correlate with our infinitely incomplete description of God, then it automatically becomes dismissed and the information becomes "perplexing". The solution to this so-called "perplexing" question is that God is just the creator. This is what God created. Your perception of the bigger picture is very limited, as is mine. God is not a "sweet God" only. God is also the wrathful God depicted in the OT. This is evident in the fact of the existence of wrath, as anything and everything that exists is an expression of the one creator's beingness.

Here is my thing. If there were no freedom (free will) then, and only then, could God alone be responsible for evil.

One thing that we are not free to choose is our overall tendencies. We have a tendency to do the things we do because of the nature of our created forms. Sure you might have some free will, but there are a lot of uncontrollable factors in life that determine our fate, such as gender, size, brain capacity, to name a very small few. Everyone has an ego. We're born with it, and it tends to make us do so-called "evil" things. So yeah, God's responsible. But that doesn't mean we're screwed, it only means we should try to understand. We can either judge and live in fear or accept and live in peace. The game will remain the same always, but its how we deal with it that matters. Are we gonna play like winners or hide under a rock?