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The Origins of Aleister Crowley's Thelema, and the possibility that its an elaborate hoax.

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posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 07:56 PM
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reply to post by Baddogma
 


Indeed Aliester big up RAW!



well, the iconographic "smiley face" only became a meme in the 1960's (or early 70's) so I would argue that it is not meant to be that... and of course the 'ol beast was full of it, as that is the nature of magik and such thingies...


And thanks Baddogma for bringing information on smiley faces to the thread ٩͡[๏̯͡๏]۶
Kind of reminds me of the one in the Stele. Haha.




posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 08:12 PM
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Originally posted by delusion

Woud it be fair to say that Magick is simply a more theatrical form of Neuro Linguistic Programming (and therefore NLP is a less theatrical form of Magick)?

And Magick may be more powerful as a pschyo-therapeutic or psycho-manipulative tool in that it uses the power of imagination and memes drawn from tradition which are elaborated and embellished according to your fancy. Whether those traditions are correctly represented or are 'true' or or not is more or less irrelevant to getting results within your own mind.

What you say about writing until you discover your own true will sounds similar to Jed Mckenna's process of spiritual autolysis, which is the process of writing down ONE thing that is true.
It is in this process that one works through all that is false, until one is left with, literally, enlightenment.


Generally speaking, yes, that's exactly right. On the other hand, it appears that one can call on forces that appear to have an independent existence. It's a mystery.

But one can perform rituals without faith or visualization or any of the practices deemed necessary by NLP or New Thought -- and things happen.



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 08:49 PM
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I've seen the old documentry of aliester crowley, nothing too positive about that guy honestly. This guy inspired a lot of the 70s cults, Anton Lavey, etc, etc, . A man built around defining of laws of control, he has succeed, i've heard of people reading books about the guy, under the pretext that a women met him after he just did some heinous act. nuff said without being censored on ats



posted on Apr, 17 2012 @ 09:40 PM
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reply to post by AliceBlackman
 


Why does my true will have to make me cry?



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 02:57 AM
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Text Blackreply to post by Lagrimas
 


Well,The Stele is real, and Ankh-ef-en-Khonsu did exist, and he had a nephew, Anchhor, who resides
in the Museum of antiquities in Leiden, the Netherlands. Strange thing is that I visited that Museum when I first attended 'laboratoriumschool Rijnland' at the time they where building the temple in the entrance hall, they got it from Egypt as thanks for the help they lended when artifacts were saved at the time the Water Dam was build there.
After that I took the name ankhor as my name to save my games not knowing for ten years that this was actually the name of the mummie that was in Leiden, ten years later again I found out that Anchhor was actually the nephew of Ankh-ef-en-Khonsu. (Was in the video that was at the exposition when anchhor was restorated)
Strange thing is that after all this I discovered the theosophioc society, became aware of many symbols in my city (especially Hermes/Merdcury) www.xs4all.nl/~anchhor and became aware of many other things.
No, no aiwasse or whatever whispering in my ear, but something has happened in my life, which I can`t explain
exactly. O+-3~ )O+->



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 05:35 AM
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reply to post by anchhor
 


anchhor, you have a good story of people "on the path", because apparantly when you choose to learn and to know, then you are given the way. Or at least a way to take to see all the ways eventually, leading to the same place via routes adorned with different scenery.

And I like your battle cry for this thread. "The Steale is Real" Shout it from open windows looking down on rooftops lined with rooftop gardens. Or not.

Welcome to ATS, one of the fine places to play on the innernests.
edit on 18-4-2012 by Aleister because: edit



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 06:56 AM
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reply to post by Nemo418
 


indeed, i thought that as well. "do not change one pen sroke"!!!
i have a copy of the hand written origional,and interestingly enough,a typed translation by crowley.
does this mean he is disobeying his own law???



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 06:58 AM
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reply to post by Lagrimas
 


The wikipedia page says the stele was moved "around" 1902, not in 1902, and was added by one editor with no citiation. It was probably added because related articles say that the museum moved their material to the main building, but none of the wikipedia pages are clear about how long it took to move everything and when exactly the museum closed. These would be historical points you can research with the current historians of the Cairo museum, their records department, etc.

Crowley writes that in 1904 he and his wife visited the museum that the stele was eventually moved from, and saw it there and then met with the curator. Depending on how long it took to move everything, which wings or rooms were set up to receive exhibits, and other whims and wherefors, it may be easy to track when and where the exhibits came to their present location. "Around" 1902 is like saying "sometime in the 1950s", and until someone (you?) gets definitive documented or paper proof of when objects were moved from one museum to the other, the "around" will remain somewhere "around" meaningless as related to accuracy.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 05:27 PM
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reply to post by TiM3LoRd
 


l wonder how can people research people without looking out to see who he’[she]’. was

www.youtube.com...



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 08:24 PM
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reply to post by Aleister
 


Ok well assuming the Stele was with the other items in the Egyptian museum of Antiquities when it got moved then it would have happened like this:

wiki Boulaq


The Egyptian Museum of Antiquities was originally built in 1835 near the Asbakiya Gardens. The museum soon moved to Boulaq in 1858 because the original building was too small to hold all of the artifacts. In 1855, shortly after the artifacts were moved, Duke Maximilian of Austria was given all of the artifacts. He hired a French architect to design and construct a new museum for the antiquities. The new building was to be constructed on the bank of the Nile River in Boulaq. In 1878, after the museum was completed for some time, it suffered irreversible damage; a flood of the Nile River caused the antiquities to be relocated to another museum, in Giza. The remained there until 1902 when they were moved, for the last time to the current museum in Tahrir Square.


As you can see, it was due to the moving of the whole museum again in 1902 that the Stele was moved to Cairo.

I have yet to contact the Cairo museum, but I intend to do so by email. Ill be back with the results of course.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 09:13 PM
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Originally posted by reficul
reply to post by AuranVector
 


Liber CCXX 31:
for these fools of men and their woes care not thou at all! they feel little;what is, is balanced by weak joys;but ye are my chosen ones'


Sounds Nietzschean. I'm sure Crowley considered himself an ubermensch who could look down on everyone else.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by Aleister
reply to post by Baddogma
 



and kudos on posting anything re: Robert A. Wilson because he ruined many perfectly normal lives ...thank whatever powers might exist.


Ah, a beautiful line about RAW. If anyone on this thread hasn't read Robert Anton Wilson's material, he was a giant in passing along "occult" data in well-written language. He loved Crowley, and features him in some of his books, and was able to pass along much of Crowley's teachings in, again, well-written and understandable language. Well, enough rambling about RAW for one post.


I loved RAW too. Twenty years ago, I was reading quite a bit of RAW. The ones I could find in my house:
The Illuminatus Trilogy, Cosmic Trigger Vol. 1 &2, The Historical Illuminatus Chronicles Vol 1,2, & 3, The Illuminati Papers, Ishtar Rising, and Wilhelm Reich in Hell.

There are a LOT of his books I never got around to reading -- I wish I had more time to read.

He was a beautiful spirit.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 09:31 PM
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Originally posted by Jordan River
I've seen the old documentry of aliester crowley, nothing too positive about that guy honestly. This guy inspired a lot of the 70s cults, Anton Lavey, etc, etc, . A man built around defining of laws of control, he has succeed, i've heard of people reading books about the guy, under the pretext that a women met him after he just did some heinous act. nuff said without being censored on ats


Crowley was a very complicated being. He just doesn't fit neatly into any particular box.

“Crowley may have been a brilliant writer and a splendid poet but as a person he was simply a nasty piece of work.”

“Crowley’s name stank; not only because of his association in the popular press with black magic but because of the indubitable fact that for years he had lived ‘upon involuntary contributions from his friends’, as one of them told his biographer, John Symonds.”

In other words, Crowley was blackmailing people. That paid for his “retirement”.

From “The Rebirth of Witchcraft” (1989) by Doreen Valiente, page 60 & 61.



posted on Apr, 18 2012 @ 09:57 PM
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reply to post by Lagrimas
 


I want to mention the number 11, which comes up in “The Book of the Law” a couple of times.
It’s something that comes up repeatedly in my life – I know I’m not alone in this experience.

It started for me about 20 years ago, when I noticed that the number 11 (& multiples thereof) kept popping up in my life.

If I was looking at a digital clock, I would see 11:11 or 1:11, 2:22, 3:33, 4:44, 5:55. It amazed me, as if my subconscious knew exactly when to look at the clock.

Eleven would pop up constantly in my life – to the point where I wondered if it was some type of message.

I noticed that in the Sufi tradition, the first 33 beads of the Masbahas (garland or mala) are broken into 3 increments of 11 beads. (There are 99 beads in the Masbahas, marked into three sections of 33 beads each.) So if you don’t have time to chant 99 times, you can chant the name 11 times, on up in increments of 11 or 33.

In contrast, the Hindu Mala consists of 108 beads.

When I was initiated into a particular long mantra, the teacher had us chant the mantra 11 times as part of the initiation.

This is where it comes up in “The Book of the Law”:

I:60. “My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us.
The Five Pointed Star, with a Circle in the Middle, & the circle is Red, My colour is blank to the blind,
but the blue & gold are seen of the seeing. Also I have a secret glory for them that love me.”

The colors Blue & Gold are highly significant in the Yogic tradition. It’s the color of the “Blue Pearl” – supposedly a marker in one’s spiritual journey.

II:16 “I am The Empress & the Hierophant. Thus eleven, as my bride is eleven.”

Line II:16 is obviously a reference to the Tarot, but the numbers do not add up. The Empress is the number 4 and The Hierophant is the number 6 (Tarot values, I did not add up the values of the letters).

Interestingly, “The Empress” is Venus. “The Hierophant” is Taurus – Venus rules Taurus and the Moon is exalted in Taurus. A coincidence?

But if you look at Key 11, “Justice”, this is associated with teaching. Crowley most definitely saw himself as a teacher – “The Teacher” of the New Aeon.

The 11th sign of the zodiac is Aquarius which is linked to “The Star” card (Key 17), obviously linked to Nuit – the star-clad goddess.

“The Star” card is also associated with questing, research & experiment – very apropos to Crowley.

Incidentally, Crowley was 11 years old when his father died – a major turning point in his life. Crowley hated his mother.

Crowley was also born between 11:00 PM and 12 Midnight.

There are 11 words in “Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.”
edit on 18-4-2012 by AuranVector because: to re-format
edit on 18-4-2012 by AuranVector because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 06:36 AM
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reply to post by AuranVector
 


probably correct. when ha was mountain climbing in the hiymlayas,he referred to his dark skin guides as 'coolies'!



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 08:14 AM
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reply to post by Lagrimas
 


The 1902 date in that article also comes from wikipedia, where people really have to research the history page of an article to see where the data comes from. I'm just not sure why Crowley would mention seeing the stele in the other museum in 1904 if it was already moved, which, I guess, is one of the points you make with this thread. Moving an entire museum must have been a huge undertaking in 1902, and they probably used horse drawn carts instead of motorized horseless carriages to move everything, which sounds like a tedious process if large stone objects were involved. Could have been that the move wasn't completed yet, and the big stone exhibits were the last to be moved because they were such a bother. For sure you have brought up interesting mysteries with this thread!



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 11:32 PM
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Originally posted by AuranVector
reply to post by Lagrimas
 



I:60. “My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us.
The Five Pointed Star, with a Circle in the Middle, & the circle is Red, My colour is blank to the blind,
but the blue & gold are seen of the seeing. Also I have a secret glory for them that love me.”

II:16 “I am The Empress & the Hierophant. Thus eleven, as my bride is eleven.”

Line II:16 is obviously a reference to the Tarot, but the numbers do not add up. The Empress is the number 4 and The Hierophant is the number 6 (Tarot values, I did not add up the values of the letters).

Interestingly, “The Empress” is Venus. “The Hierophant” is Taurus – Venus rules Taurus and the Moon is exalted in Taurus. A coincidence?

But if you look at Key 11, “Justice”, this is associated with teaching. Crowley most definitely saw himself as a teacher – “The Teacher” of the New Aeon.

The 11th sign of the zodiac is Aquarius which is linked to “The Star” card (Key 17), obviously linked to Nuit – the star-clad goddess.

“The Star” card is also associated with questing, research & experiment – very apropos to Crowley.



I need to correct this. I wrote "blank" instead of "black":

I:60. “My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us.
The Five Pointed Star, with a Circle in the Middle, & the circle is Red, My colour is BLACK to the blind,
but the blue & gold are seen of the seeing. Also I have a secret glory for them that love me.”

I'm also having great fun going thru "777 and Other Qabalistic Writings of Aleister Crowley".
I haven't looked at this in a long time.

This is what Crowley had to say about the Prime number 11:

"The general number of magick, or energy leading to change."

Hebrew Gematria (which is what Crowley used) can be frustrating.

However, I did find by using "Simple English Gematria" (where the number value of each letter is ordinal),
That Empress+Hierophant = 11.

What a coincidence. I wonder if even Crowley would be surprised. Well, maybe not....

For simple numerology, I normally use the Chaldean instead of the Pythagorean -- this ordinal "Simple Gematria" looks interesting.



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 11:48 PM
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Originally posted by Violetshy
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I've read parts of The Book of the Law, and found it beautifully written....



I had great fun going thru "The Book of the Law" to pick out the prettiest phrases (IMHO):

I:14. Above, the gemmed azure is the naked splendour of Nuit;
She bends in ecstasy to kiss the secret ardours of Hadit

I:15 “… they shall bring the glory of the stars into the hearts of men.”

I:26.” …So she answered him, bending down, a lambent flame of blue, all-touching, all penetrant, her lovely hands upon the black earth, & her lithe body arched for love, and her soft feet not hurting the little flowers…”

I:28”…breathed the light, faint & faery, of the stars…”

I:59 “ …my hair, the trees of eternity.”

I:64. “I am the blue-lidded daughter of Sunset; I am the naked brilliance of the voluptuous night-sky.”

II:3 “In the sphere I am everywhere the centre, as she, the circumference, is nowhere found.

II:4 “Yet she shall be known & I never.”

II:6 “I am the flame that burns in every heart of man, and in the core of every star.”

II:9 “Remember all ye that existence is pure joy; that all the sorrows are but as shadows; they pass & are done; but there is that which remains.”

II:20 “Beauty and strength, leaping laughter and delicious languor, force and fire, are of us.”

II:22 “I am the Snake that giveth Knowledge & Delight and bright glory, and stir the hearts of men with drunkenness



posted on Apr, 19 2012 @ 11:58 PM
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Originally posted by Violetshy

I've read parts of The Book of the Law, and found it beautifully written.



I think there are better examples of Crowley's beautiful writing than "The Book of the Law" -- and writings better known:

Here’s a better example of Crowley’s poetry:

Hail, Aradia! From the Amalthean Horn
Pour forth thy store of Love; I lowly bend
Before thee, I adore thee to the end,
With loving sacrifice they shrine adorn.
Thy foot is to my lip, my prayer upborne
Upon the rising incense-smoke; then spend
Thine ancient Love, O Mighty One, descend
To aid me, who without thee am forlorn.

Addressed to Tyche, Goddess of Fortune.
From “A Witches Bible Compleat” page 41.


I love “The Charge” – it’s beautiful.

“As Gerald (Gardner) originally had it (The Charge), this was derived partly from Charles Godfrey Leland’s ‘Aradia’ and partly from Aleister Crowley’s ‘Liber Legis’ (Book of the Law).”

From “The Rebirth of Witchcraft” (1989) by Doreen Valiente, page 57.

The Charge of the Goddess

Listen to the words of the Great Mother, who of old was called Artemis, Astarte, Dione, Melusine, Aphrodite, Ceridwen, Diana, Arionrhad, Brigid, and by many other names:

“Whenever ye have need of any thing, once in the month, and better it be when the moon is full, then shall ye assemble in some secret place and adore the spirit of Me, who is Queen of all the Wise.

And ye shall be free from slavery; and as a sign that ye be free, ye shall be naked in your rites.
Sing, feast, dance, make music and love, all in My presence.

For Mine is the ecstasy of the spirit, and Mine also is joy on earth; for My law is love unto all beings.

Mine is the secret that opens upon the door of youth, and Mine is the cup of wine of life that is the cauldron of Cerridwen, which is the Holy Grail of immortality.

I give the knowledge of the spirit eternal and beyond death I give peace and freedom and reunion with those that have gone before.

Nor do I demand aught of sacrifice, for behold, I am the Mother of all living, and My love is poured upon the earth.”

Hear the words of the Star Goddess, the dust of whose feet are the hosts of heaven, whose body encircles the universe:

“I who am the beauty of the green earth, and the white moon among the stars, and the mystery of the waters, I call upon your soul to arise and come unto me.

For I am the soul of nature, who gives life to the universe.
From Me all things proceed, and unto Me they must return.

Let My worship be in the heart that rejoices, for behold – all acts of love and pleasure are My rituals.
Let there be beauty and strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence within you.

And you who see to know Me, know that your seeking and yearning will avail you not,
Unless you know the Mystery; for if that which you seek, you find not within yourself, you will never find it without.

For behold, I have been with you from the beginning; and I am that which is attained at the end of desire.”

From “The Spiral Dance” (1979) by Starhawk, page 90 – the original was written by Gerald Gardner and Aleister Crowley, then re-written by Doreen Valiente in the mid-1950’s.

The first two sentences of “The Charge” are obviously from “Aradia: Gospel of the Witches” (1890) by Charles Leland, page 6.



posted on Apr, 20 2012 @ 12:59 PM
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Originally posted by Dimithae
reply to post by Lagrimas
 


For those of you that are not aware of who Alister Crowley was, here is a brief explanation:
He was at the turn of the last century considered the most evil man alive due to his beliefs in antichristianity ,devil worship, and free sex.
Alot of devil worshipping cults got started after studying his beliefs and practices.Animal sacrifice, sex orgies etc were the norm with his group.
You can wiki him for any further info if your interested.


Devil worship? That depends on how you define "devil". One person's devil can be another person's god.

It wouldn’t be Crowley unless he had something to annoy the Christians with.

Just for you, some choice items from "The Book of the Law":

III:51 “With my Hawk’s head I peck at the eyes of Jesus as he hangs upon the cross.”

III:55 “Let Mary inviolate be torn upon wheels: for her sake let all chaste women be utterly despised among you!”

III:43 “Let the Scarlet Woman beware! If pity and compassion and tenderness visit her heart; if she leave my work to toy with old sweetnesses; then shall my vengeance be known. I will slay me her child:

I will alienate her heart: I will cast her out from men: as a shrinking and despised harlot shall she crawl through dusk wet streets, and die cold and an-hungered.”

III:44 “But let her raise herself in pride! Let her follow me in my way! Let her work the work of wickedness! Let her kill her heart! Let her be loud and adulterous! Let her be covered with jewels, and rich garments, and let her be shameless before all men!”

III:45 “Then will I lift her to pinnacles of power: then will I breed from her a child mightier than all the kings of the earth. I will fill her with joy: with my force shall she see & strike at the worship of Nu: she shall achieve Hadit.”

edit on 20-4-2012 by AuranVector because: (no reason given)









 
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