Insane Michigan government announces plan to destroy ranch livestock based on hair color and arrest

Originally posted by WorkingClassMan
We have a big ferral pig problem in Oz cause of the lack opublic engageing in hunting these days now that our drought has broken the animals especialy pests are booming causeing all kinds of problems. I would have thought hunting would still be very popular in US and we know you got the fire power so are ferral pigs a real problem there and if so why?

I thought even domestic pigs turned into ferrals if released into the wild.

The situation varies by state. I live in Maryland and we do have pig farming but no known feral populations and only 2 known free range pigs, whatever that designation means. Our state laws are very strict on regulating the kinds of animals we can keep as pets or breed or farm so we don't have the comingling of the feral kind to long existing stock already taking place, for the government to invade farms and take action on. Our Department of Natural Resources encourages hunters to shoot feral pigs on sight on land they own or have permission to hunt on. I just looked all this stuff up for my state because I was wondering the same thing as you.

The situation in Michigan boggles my mind. Obviously feral pigs are a problem but if farmers keep their stock under control, I have a hard time understanding how the govt can just presume they are creating a problem and confiscate their livestock based on some sketchy criteria. I want to see how this really ends up getting enforced.

reply to post by azureskys

That's a nice area by the thumb. Haven't been down that way in about fifteen years or so.

OMG that's rude. And even biblical. Think of the profit who got the discolored sheep. Agenda 21 is outa control. Did we elect chairman MAObama?

"Change we can believe in"...y'all voted for him,now reap the whirlwind he's brought on us in the form of United Nations farm Plans and population adjustments

isn't there a law called "ex-post facto" that states that if you engage in a legal act, such as raising pigs, and the gov't decides to make it illegal, you are not breaking the law because you had already been doing it?

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by Viesczy

 

I wouldn't mind having a Feral Pig in my garden, I like pork. If the farmers pig comes on my land I now have possession. I would warn the farmer the first time it happens and tell him he owes me some pork for my damage. but will also tell him I will shoot it if he can't keep it from being in my garden. It is suitable replacement for my crops. People are responsible for their animals if they choose to keep them. I will not complain if a neighbor has animals if they aren't bothering me, they have rights also. If they are raising animals that are a threat to my family's safety that is different and I will attempt to use the laws to make sure adequate precautions are in effect.

The law here is that any hog not properly fenced and without a visible ear tag can be harvested by anyone at anytime using any method. We have no wild hog problems; I have never seen a wild hog even and I have 140 acres and hunt a lot.

As for the topic - as far as I am concerned if you are raising an animal for domestic use - it’s not friggin feral regardless of its breed characteristics.

People mix all kinds of breeds of things aiming for different characteristics that suit them. I mixed up some chickens because I wanted a flock that was better at foraging free range in the winter. They don't look pretty but they lay the # out of great eggs (pretty much one a day) even in the dead of winter. I sell a crap ton of eggs all winter long when my neighbors can't get theirs to lay. I call that a success.

I really think there will be, if the farmers get riled up this way, a movement to eradicate the state of feral natural resources personnel that is infesting Michigan.
The one that thought this one up is obviously not a farmer and probably thinks fast food is the only legal food on the planet.
Get a grip! Just too much kool aid.

reply to post by hawkiye
If any one wants to read the actual order er ISO www.michigan.gov... from the link

“By authority conferred on the Department of Natural Resources by section 41302 of the Natural
Resources Environmental Protection Act, 1994 PA 451, as amended, MCL 324.41302, and Executive
Orders 2009-45, 2009-54, 2011-1, and 2011-2, and in consultation with the Department of Agriculture,
it is ordered that effective July 8, 2011 the following section(s) of the Invasive Species Order shall be
amended as follows:
40.4 Additional prohibited species.
(1) Possession of the following live species, including a hybrid or genetic variant of the species, an
egg or offspring of the species or of a hybrid or genetically engineered variant, is prohibited:
(a) New Zealand mud snail (potamopyrgus antipodarum).
(b) Wild boar, wild hog, wild swine, feral pig, feral hog, feral swine, Old world swine, razorback,
eurasian wild boar, Russian wild boar (Sus scrofa Linnaeus). This subsection does not and is not
intended to affect sus domestica involved in domestic hog production.
(c) The department shall consult with staff from the Michigan department of agriculture on the
development of a phased compliance protocol for the implementation of this section.”
Pursuant to Executive Order 2011-1 dated March 13, 2011, the MNDRE was abolished and
its functions, including authority to administer Part 413, were transferred to the MDNR.
Pursuant to subsection 40.4(1)(c) of Invasive Species Order Amendment No. 1 of 2010, the
MDNR consulted with the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development (the successor
agency to the Department of Agriculture under Executive Order 2011-2) on the development of
a phased compliance protocol under this section. The MDNR publicly announced that under its
phased compliance protocol, it would defer determinations of compliance with the prohibition
added by Invasive Species Order Amendment No. 1 of 2010 until after March 31, 2012.

how many skipped this

This subsection does not and is not
intended to affect sus domestica involved in domestic hog production.

if it is in a pen and fed by some one then it is sus domestica even if it is any one of thees: Wild boar, wild hog, wild swine, feral pig, feral hog, feral swine, Old world swine, razorback,
eurasian wild boar, Russian wild boar (Sus scrofa Linnaeus) and we are to do what?? Deny Ignorance, not spreed false hoods.
After reading the states ISO it seems that even pen kept and hand fed are a no no to keep, have, or raise!

Ongoing advancements in science may provide additional phenotypic or genotypic tools to
aid in the identification of Sus scrofa. The MDNR may use these tools as they become
available.
The MDNR may use previous inspection data for a facility, as well as advertisements that
specify the existence of swine at a facility, as factors for determining whether a facility should be
inspected for prohibited swine subject to the ISO.

so then it seems the State is saying you have one of them then it must be destroyed, and or pay fine and jail time even though their is no mention of this in the ISO, it just stands to reason there is.

reply to post by bekod

if it is in a pen and fed by some one then it is sus domestica even if it is any one of thees: Wild boar, wild hog, wild swine, feral pig, feral hog, feral swine, Old world swine, razorback,
eurasian wild boar, Russian wild boar (Sus scrofa Linnaeus) and we are to do what?? Deny Ignorance, not spreed false hoods

No where does it say anything about them being in a pen being exempt. And several farmers free range thier pigs on their property and not in pens. Try reading the thread first and this has been dealt with already. The regulation gives them the right to declare any hog feral if it has a single trait listed!

You must of skipped this part:

"Possession" of the following live species, including a hybrid or genetic variant of the species, an
egg or offspring of the species or of a hybrid or genetically engineered variant, is prohibited:
(b) Wild boar, wild hog, wild swine, feral pig, feral hog, feral swine, Old world swine, razorback,
eurasian wild boar, Russian wild boar (Sus scrofa Linnaeus)

It says possessing them IS PROHIBITED! Not they are ok if they are in a pen being fed, you should learn to read. Then it gives its criteria for how they decide if it's feral and it only needs a single subjective trait. So yeah deny ignorance and read before you speak in ignorance...

Michigan Farmers!
Forget the hunting rifles!
Time to start filling thirty round mags...and tuning up the AR15s....
Time to stock up on ammo!
March 31 they are comming for your HOGS! Time to rally round your neighbours!
Set up a cell phone comms with land line back ups and keep informed as to whos getting busted for HOGS!
All small hog growers need to grapevine and stay in touch!
When they come to kill a neighbours stock, they should be met by armed men from all around!
This is the call.......................where are the Oath Keepers now?

reply to post by hawkiye
thank you for pointing out again what I pointed out after editing my post, I do not see what all the fuss is about, the state says a non native pig must go, as with any non native spices, now if the could go after... dandelions, but then what to make tea out of when TSHTF???

Originally posted by bekod
reply to post by hawkiye

 

thank you for pointing out again what I pointed out after editing my post, I do not see what all the fuss is about, the state says a non native pig must go, as with any non native spices, now if the could go after... dandelions, but then what to make tea out of when TSHTF???

edit on 28-3-2012 by bekod because: editing

Whats all the fuss? No pigs are native that is a ridiculous statement. The fuss is that the state can kill ranchers lively hood by declaring their stock feral based on BS criteria. There is no good reason for it except to eliminate competition to factory farms. As I said try reading the thread and watching the video instead of speaking in ignorance.

I read the actual document (link), and it seems they are looking to control feral boars, not domestic pics that might be free roaming. Now, I don't know about Michigan, but I know in both Florida and Texas, these animals are a problem. Some in Texas, in fact, grow to seriously HUGE size, and they can be very dangerous. I have SEEN wild ones in Florida, near shopping centers and homes. Even some basic research shows that these animals can cause a lot of damage. Here is the first of a lot of links I found, listing some good reasons that Michigan might want to round up these animals - link. So, I don't know that I can see this as some attack against people, rather than an attempt to resolve a problem before it gets worse. I have an uncle that at last used to raise hogs (no idea if he still does), and he had them pinned. NO farm, no big business, just for his use, but they didn't roam free, and no, he was NOT rich, far from it, in fact. You might even say he's just the sort that Jeff Foxworthy jokes were made for. In any case, why could these owners not simply keep their animals pinned, as he did?

I live in the woods in a corner of a county that is near the corners of two other counties by just a couple of miles. Over in those other counties, just a few miles a way, they were having a big problem with feral pigs. Pigs are very destructive to gardens and natural forage. These got out of a paid hunting preserve, under a fence I believe.

The folks around there trapped most of them, dressed them out, butchered them up and put them in the freezer. I never saw a wild pig on my property or found any evidence of there being any in the area so they must have gotten it under control.

I was under the impression that any domestic pig that gets loose and runs wild is considered a feral pig, feral hog, or feral swine. They will go back to the wild state and after a few generations they show wild traits including coat colors. If so, that would mean any pig of any kind, including the pot bellied pig, that is not penned up in a barn, with tags and a genetic testing report, is considered feral and must be destroyed.

P.S. I have some pig in the freezer from my neighbors who raised them. I got it for doing them a favor, but we do favors back and forth anyhow. Also I have seen and heard ZERO, and I mean ZIP about this on the local news, in newspapers or from anyone I know around here!

Detroit is in Michigan.'nuff said

reply to post by MichiganSwampBuck


The problem with the feral pigs does come from escapes from these hunting preserves and rarely from farmers penned pigs. The reason is that the fences of the hunting preserves go into the woods and falling trees damage these fences. Hunting a pig in the field isn't a sport either, so the fences wind up being susceptible. A farmers fence is farther from the woods so is less susceptible. The farmer usually wants to have view of his animals so predators can be seen.

The problematic thing is that the hunting preserves are mad they are being targeted and the law has to be applied to farmers now. The situations are different. There is still a chance that a farmers pigs might escape but the risk is way less. This should be taken into consideration by the government, this is the rational way of thinking. The people in government have to learn to think rationally. People have to learn to think rationally.

more great legislation from the group who will call a helicopter on you for riding a 4-wheeler down a TANK (yes, military tank) trail with 2+ft deep track trenches on each side (almost unride-able) because "4-wheelers destroy the trails" or outlawing deer baiting because they found like one deer with wasting syndrome thus causing deer population to explode causing god knows how many car accidents and other problems.

Great job DNR, keep up the great work with our tax dollars

reply to post by DankKing420

michigan farmers are probably some of the most heavily armed people in the country i dont see it going down like that.

Pretty much ANY farmer/rancher is likely armed to some degree.
But unless a farmer is going to have a shootout with a bunch of feds (and lose), this would be fought more in the political arena than with weapons.

As long as those opposed can shed some media light on it, it will die a quick death.

reply to post by fenceSitter


I knew there was more to this story, thank's for pointing out the actual language in the bill.

reply to post by AlreadyGone


all this is a blatant example of state officials being bought off by corporations. i too live in nc and down east we have alot of pig factories where hundreds of pigs are housed in these inhumane warehouses all there lives never seeing light of day and to me that is just unnatural. when i lived in wisconsin we used to have the most fun when we would go to pig farm to get a pig for slauter for our family going in to fenced in woods and tring to catch a 5 hundred pound pig .