Venezuela threatens Britain over Falklands as its president vows to side with Argentina

reply to post by gabrielxxx


So you have admitted that no Argentinian has ever lived there. Thank you, case closed.

Secondly according to the UN teritorial waters strech out 12 nautical miles. The Falklands is over 200 miles away. Besides proximity to a land mass does not automatically give you a right to them if they are already populated by another race.

The Falklands has 3000 permanent residents not 700, and yes they are a race of people. Wether there was 3 people or 3 million, it is still their land and their home.

reply to post by PrecogPsychicSensitive


Please research the history of the Falklands, and the desires of its citizens before blab-posting.

Originally posted by Tifozi
reply to post by Soshh

 

Current British policy revolves around deterring a second invasion. If this was entirely unnecessary then we would not bother.

Yes, because show of force has worked so well in world's history.

Because the Falklands aren't Hong Kong and the circumstances are completely different.

Really? I thought the Falklands were close to India.

Actually it is far more important to place such things into context and not blow them out of proportion.

Of course, who really cares where a few millions go...

This barrage of sarcastic comments does not do your argument much good. A persistent 'show of force' most certainly does work, which may explain why deterrence is a vital component of the defence policies of so many countries. If you know something that they don't then feel free to pass it on.

reply to post by clitty


mate, have you ever been here?
have you meet any argentinean in your life?

Let me remind you we all live in the same world... I dont think you belong to the high class of britain ppl. your lack of acknoledge let me see this.
Are you going to be the one shooting to us????
Like I told, my uncle is the bigger war hero here in Argentina. Go to ask him how feels to kill a lot of ppl... and them know their families , their sons... he killed more than 100 english guys at HSM invcible... but he never could sleep well anymore...
Maybe you dont know, but soldiers from both sides get together every year they can. They are a lot of friends between the two bands... they realize that war is a goverments things... Borders doesnt exist, are man made...
we all lve in the same place and we are all the same.
With these wars the only ones who looses everytime, are we, the ppl..
cause i dont going to get richier with the islands and i dont going to get poor without them....
Maybe you work for the goverment and you take a part of this..... if not, go back to work.

reply to post by michael1983l


"So you have admitted that no Argentinian has ever lived there. Thank you, case closed. "

No, I told you since 1833 , not never... read again....

reply to post by michael1983l


"Secondly according to the UN teritorial waters strech out 12 nautical miles. The Falklands is over 200 miles away. Besides proximity to a land mass does not automatically give you a right to them if they are already populated by another race. "
Depth mate depth....
Read about Argentienan sea..,
And wath about the monroe doctrin?? thats first i think...

reply to post by gabrielxxx


Your right, opposing soldiers have got together. The soldiers do not have the quarrel it is our nations that do. I have no doubt I would enjoy the company of many of Argentinas citizens and that they are honourable people.

That still doesn't take away the fact that we have to look after our people on the Falkland Islands and do what is best for them. It is their home, their Island. Lets just leave them to it.

reply to post by michael1983l


like I told you from that 3000 ppl, the half are latin americans working for english companyes and they dont leave there.... they go there to work for a season.
from the 1500, the half are military spending seasons there...
So you only have 700 kelpers... and the half are from another islands... only 50 families lives there...
Are you reading wath im posting or are you going to re ask everything??
Let me know your thouhgts about the two english invasions against argentinean continent before the invasion of the islands
And the self determination thing,,,, was before 1833.... and 1832 like i told you was ocupied by spanish...

reply to post by Soshh


Love is payed with love. If you don't want one-liners and sarcasm as responses, then don't ask for it. Or are you waiting for me to write a manifesto when you only answer a line?

A persistent 'show of force' most certainly does work

Yes. And putting a bullet inside someone's brain seems to be pretty much effective in killing them.

Wether these tactics work or not is irrelevant. If I'm unarmed and you have a gun, I'm not going to be much of an opposition, am I?

Funny enough, that's exactly the tactic used by criminals. Or are we also starting to philosophically debate if you have a right to own your things that just got stolen?

Argentina provably hasn't done a thing because they know they will lose in any confrontation. That is not a diplomatic tactic to prevent hostilities, that's plain an simple intimidation.

I am not bashing/criminalizing the UK, nor it's policies. I'm using analogies to make my points understood.

which may explain why deterrence is a vital component of the defence policies of so many countries. If you know something that they don't then feel free to pass it on.

Like I said, you call it deterrence. I call it intimidation.

Semantics, I know...

But to me, it would be more beneficial to take things to the negotiations table once and for all, and make a real effort to come to agreement, than to make an habit of sending powerful warships to an area that doesn't even belong to the UK national waters.

reply to post by gabrielxxx


I don't agree with the British Empire's previous invasions, however the British Empire no longer exists and we are left with what we have now. Those people living on the Island have been living there since Birth and their parents before them. What exatly do you suppose you should do with those people should you claim the Islands as your own?

Is living on a land for 200 years mostly unopposed not enough to claim that place as your home?

What people are forgetting is that those people living on the Island are human beings and as far as they are c oncerned that is their home, their community that they have built. Why does anybody have a right to kick them out of it? They have already offered a resource share treaty of which your nation rejected.

reply to post by michael1983l


look after??? thats wath your goverment want you to think.
The kelpers are second hands citizens of the crown, they get mad a lot of times with the crown for the money they sent to them to the islands and their rights...

I answered every question you make me.
Please let me know what you think about the two invations of your country to my country and if they repare on the self determination of the ppl from here..

Originally posted by gabrielxxx
reply to post by michael1983l

 

"So you have admitted that no Argentinian has ever lived there. Thank you, case closed. "

No, I told you since 1833 , not never... read again....

No you said that was Spanish people not Argentinian.

reply to post by gabrielxxx


I have already told you what I think, I didn't agree with them but it is long in the past and there is little I can do about it now.

As for your comment about the "kelpers" you seem to have little regard for them anyway and you still haven't told me anything that would convince me or an international court that you have any legal right to the lands.

Originally posted by Tifozi
reply to post by BRITWARRIOR

 

Personally I hate rating agencies. I think they are the current economic cancer that is threatening a lot of world economies. To me, it's beyond belief how an agency (connotation on "agency") says "it's like this" and everyone acts on it, even more if you consider how catastrophic some of their claims and ratings have been. But I wouldn't feel much safe if I was brit... France was laughing at other european countries until it got served it's fair share. I just stated that because recently there have been some concerning news regarding UK, like the debt record...

Its totally necessary things would be chaotic with out it, not really sure what else to say i tend to avoid these type of political debaits all together

Yes, but like I answered to another post, I think the whole problem is around the fact the UK thinks it needs a strong military presence there. You can lower the impact of said costs in your military budget... But if you didn't send any warships at all, you would be saving even more money, and not just accepting it as an inevitable cost, or making a routine out of it.

Ah ok with you now... its not a strong military presence, there is far more presence in country's like Germany, or even Cyprus, its just another location where troops are based, even the task force sent in 1982 was tiny compared to what they had/have globally, the fact is all that's was necessary was sent, the handful of assets currently stationed there is only sufficient to hold of another invasion force for 24/48hours, there would be just a handful of marines there like last time when and if relations improve

I don't want to seem like I'm spiliting hairs just to make a point, but to me that doesn't make sense. If they are not a threat in terms of military power, then why send stuff like nuclear submarines, and the latest destroyers? Why not deploy there, permanently, the destroyers that are usually in that area as routine, and use the new destroyers for...whatever? Argentina is seeing this as an "aggression"(lack of better word), to the point where other South American leaders start taking sides. I take what they say (especially Chavez) with 2 tons of salt on top of it, but it does show a new concern that we haven't seen for at least a decade.

The new destroyers are eventually replacing the old 70s built type42s its just changing over, there are 7 type 45s and orders for more, also 7 astute class nuclear sub 3 of them in service or doing sea trails, there has always been a presence there with all of the above The Royal Navy is just updating that's all, its not aggression each sub has its designated patrol areas, its politics of course Chaves will spin it as aggression to drum up public opinion & hopefully another term all i can say is go see/find out for your self, its just routine, did you know Russia fly's and sails its own bombers/ships on routine missions very close to the UK, its not aggression and we don't label it or see it as so, as much as the papers tried to spin it as cold war part 2, thats like the UK throwing a tantrum should the up the technology.

International law has shown itself futile, especially during the last decade. The UN, who supposedly are in charge of enforcing it, simply don't give a crap or are unable to do anything against those who disrespect it. The matter of fact is that, if it was an easy to solve problem, it would be solved by now.

I agree, but we must try to have some for of international laws even if its not yet fore filling & doing what its supposed to be do, its sure as s*** isn't at the minute tho, otherwise we all may aswel go back to being animals living in caves or in fortified castles, give it time, and after enough repeated mistakes someone may come good for a change,

reply to post by michael1983l


"I don't agree with the British Empire's previous invasions, however the British Empire no longer exists and we are left with what we have now."

Im glad that you are not agree with them, but you are agree with the invasion of our island who were habitated by the same pll from the continent. ok!

"Those people living on the Island have been living there since Birth and their parents before them. What exatly do you suppose you should do with those people should you claim the Islands as your own? "

Like the ppl who live in Taiwan you say?
Our goverment propose them to stay on the islands, we are not like you that banned us from the islands...
They can stay as part of argentinean terretory or go back to the UK.


Mate, England make a lot of bad here. Belive me, im not jocking, and you know what? I love UK! I been there more than ones. Last year i been there, i love english ppl, they are so educated... I love the beattles the rolling stones, all argentina loves them! because ppl have nothing to do with their goverments!!!
The thing its start to realize that! the TV sell us lies , you are clever enought to know it!
The only thing we want is the UK goverment stop stealing from us! Our oil our fish, our land...
It's XXI century, colonies and kings are old fashioned...

reply to post by michael1983l


mate, thats the same.... hahaha...
Please, read some history...

reply to post by gabrielxxx


Yes there is no reason our people cannot enjoy each others culture. But let me set aside one little misconception, it is not the UK Stealing your Oil or your Fish. Any oil of fish extracted by the Falkland Islanders in their waters is the property of their government, not the UK's. They have been there for 200 years that is about 4 generations, nobody not even the UK has a right to tell them who rules their nation. They choose by themselves, just like you choose your government to run Argentina.

Maybe the sollution would be to have an Argentinian government run for election in the Falkland Islands and if they get voted in then they have the right to do what they wish with the Islands.

reply to post by gabrielxxx


michael i already told you about the monroe doctrin for go to international court... Even the USA is asking to UK to start the chats with the Argentinean goverment...
Like you did in the past, you bring your ships, not yours diplomatic guys...

And lets make some history!
Who are the biggest pirates in the world?
England!
Who have a pirate for commander of their own navy?
England!
Who was the biggest pirate ever?
Sir Nelson!
Who came to south America and try two times to invaded Buenos Aires?
England!
Who came here and invaded the island because they need and strategical point in the south atlantic?
England!
Who invaded Asia?
England
Who invaded Australia?
England!
Who invaded north america?
England!

And your PM said that we are the colonialist.... come on!!!

The monroe doctrine is a US document, it is not part of international law.

Damn I thought we were starting to have some common ground, I never expected us to agree but maybe meet in the middle. Appears I was wrong.

Michael, dont worry, nothing it's going to happen... There will be no war between our countries...
Argentina doesn't have an army and the UK is sinking with all europe...
They are only trying to you don't see when they get all your money from your bank. They did it here, the same banks you have there.So they will do it there... belive me.
If you are a little bit clever you will realize that we are living two very differents moments in ours countries...
Our economy is getting bigger and yours... well the same thing that all Europe and USA...
So they need to do this things, in your case, to get you out of the real big problem. And here they are doing this like "look at us now! we makes bussines with china, india and russia and we dont need anymore to be slaves of England or USA" ....

If you think that was OK to invade an island more than 5000 miles aways from your own country and talk about self determination of the citizens... let me say you are nothng different to your president who call us colonialist when your country owns more colonies than nobody...