It's time to Relocate Palestinians to Jordan: Two-thirds of Jordanians are already Palestinian

reply to post by GLaDOS


look up black september, maybe you will understand...
Here is a link:
en.wikipedia.org...

I agree, after re-reading your post I agree.....

even though I originally thought your post said "It's time to Relocate Pleiadians to Jordan" so while we're relocating the Palestinians to Jordan might as well relocate the Pleiadians too. Actually now that I think about it, this idea is about as realistic as relocating the Pleiadians, but I still agree, also throw in the Canadians to boot.

reply to post by CountDrac

You still don't get it. The Hashemites didn't rise to power backed up by a military coup or any of the sorts, they were chosen and agreed upon by the people, the people I'm referring to are the people that inhabited Jordan and Palestine under the british mandate. It was all considered one land and didn't have any borders like now and there wasn't anything called Jordanian or Palestinian they referred to each other as from east of the river or west of the river or just by naming the town they come from. So what I'm getting at is that the Hashemites draw their legitimacy from both Jordanians and Palestinians that consider themselves as one people till this day. Unless you have lived in Jordan or know any Palestinian\Jordanian who would like to say otherwise please share, otherwise all you are posting are opinionated facts. And do you really think that Palestinians in Gaza or the West Bank and refugee camps in Jordan want to take over Jordan? They have been suffering for a very long time to get back their homes,lands and their rights and will not give up and this is the true nature of the conflict not as you portray it. In support of what I said, in September 2011 the Palestinians demanded UN recognition and a Palestinian state on the 1967 borders and Jerusalem as the capital. And as for those "Palestinians" plotting to overthrow the king in Jordan, this is what they have been up to: Protests in Jordan

Originally posted by CountDrac
reply to post by Corruption Exposed

 

Again, israel is a recognized state by the UN, while the palestinians are not. My logic is based on reality and the current status quo, yours is based on your opinion...
Unless you can have the UN revert the decision they made 60 years ago i suggest you move on and live in the current reality...

Believe it or not the UN is not GOD it can say palestine is not a state but that won't stop it from existing and trying to legitimize it's self.

abkhazia and south ossetia anyone? or are they still georgian? /sarcasm

reply to post by CountDrac


Please provide your source/link (i.e., data) that indicates that 66% of Jordanians are already Palestinian so that I can further evaluate your OP and thread comments.

Thanks in advance.

reply to post by BurningSpearess


Here you go:

en.wikipedia.org...

Keep in mind this does not include the 341,494 that are in refugee camps in jordan

reply to post by CountDrac


From your source, bolded mine:

Of the diaspora, about 2.6 million live in neighboring Jordan where they are approximately half the population,

As you see wikipedia as reliable, I will propose this to you:

During the years 2004–2007, Jordan saw a rapid increase in its population due to the heavy migration of Iraqi refugees, an independent census carried in 2007, estimated that there are 700,000 Iraqis residing in Jordan, other estimates put them as high as one million Iraqis.[85] Estimates put the population of Jordan slightly over 6,300,000 as of the year 2009[86] (increasing from 5,100,000 in 2004).

UNRWA indicates that as many as 1,951,603 persons are registered as Palestinian refugees in 2008[87] mostly as Jordanian citizens. 338,000 of which reside in UNRWA administered refugee camps scattered across Jordan.[88]

So are you willing to admit that the headline of your OP is erroneous from the beginning?

A bit over 2 million out of 6 million doesn't equal 2/3; it equals maybe 1/3--but maybe my math is fuzzier than yours....

reply to post by ghash

I get kinda pissed off; cause most of the time the person saying it is depending on the fact that Jordan is a Middle Eastern country, so by common sense, it's definitely got human rights violations, dictators ruling the region, etc.

I believe you are entitled to your opinion and if you are happy under the system in which you live, then I am glad. However, my personal opinion comes from my ideological perspective. I believe in governance derived from the rule of law rather than traditional or charismatic legitimacy. My lifestyle and my political beliefs would not be synonymous with the Jordanian system, nor are they synonymous with the system in the country I am governed by.

And to be honest, forget all about who's right and wrong in terms of Palestine/Jordan/Israel. But in an ideal world, based on ethics, principle and common sense, a country like Israel would be dismantled; their shadowy nuclear program, constant harassing of neighbouring Arab countries, numerous unaccounted for war crimes, illegal settlements on Palestinian land, the list goes on and on.

I have no doubt about Israels endless list of violations of international law, human rights and numerous other discresions. However I live in a world of realism, one that dictates that it is impossible to relocate the Palestinians or the Israeli's, but that a peace is possible given that is based on UNSR 242, the concept of land for peace and Israels withdrawal to the pre-June 1967 borders as well as a negotiated settlements on other contentious issues such as the refugee problem. But possibly the most important step to peace is mutual respect and aknowlegement of both sides of the coin (I say coin, because both Israeli's and Palestinains are people).

reply to post by bluemirage5

but none took to wearing bomb belts in to pizza parlours, cafes, night clubs or on buses and blew themselves up. No Israeli Jew ever wandered in to the dead of night (or day time) slicing the throats of Arabs or dismembering them or their children dumping their remains in garbage bins.

If you are seriously concerned with curbing terrorism you need to realise that many Palestinians are pushed towards such tactics as many see it as the only logical response to a Western back, superior military. Israels stanglehold on Palestinian economy ensures low growth levels, extreme poverty (70% of Gazans live below the poverty line and 40% of West Bank citizens live below the poverty line) and high unemployment (40%). You can deny that Israel is to blame, but it is clear Israeli policies have seriously adverse affects on Palestinian economy, given that even the rest of the Arab world is doing better than Palestine. Israels continuation of settlement expansion only promotes radicalism. On the ground, the Palestinians see there land taken, they see that they have no sovereignty and few rights. These conditions all breed terrorism. Add to this the fact that Israel only sees force as a solution to most its problems. It has been proven time and time again that the use of military force is extremely limited and cannot solve the underlying origin of stability. It has been proven in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine and in many other countries. You can avoid realilty and continue to blame everything on the Palestinians (who are also responsible for many discresions and have blame to answer to). But doing that will not get Israel any further. In fact it will endanger the Jewish state even more.

reply to post by SpeachM1litant


Fantastic post I must say. At least someone is thinking realistically.
Palestinians have their rights as well, and a return to pre-1967 borders would be the best and only solution.
Relocating all Palestinians to Jordan means kicking them out, no one across the world would leave their home to satisfy anyone, especially if they are occupied.

Pre-1967 borders, and everyone would be happy. Palestine has it's state, and Israel keep theirs.
And as the late King Hussein has sought an end to this madness, so is King Abdullah. And he has warned that nothing can be fixed in the Middle East, until the Palestinian issue has been resolved.

reply to post by CountDrac


The US repeatedly tried to invade Canada (War of 1812). Germany tried to take over the world, and erase the Jewish people from history. And according to your logic, why not relocate all the Canadians?
The US will take over Canada. The Germans will take over the world again.

You keep parroting the same lies over and over, at best it's speculation without any kind of basis.
Just because it happened once, doesn't mean it's going to happen again. Most other posters on this thread talked absolute facts, things that are happening, the way the situation is and how it is developing in Jordan.
The Jordanians once demanded the Hashemite rule, and still do.

If you did any proper research, and actually watch and listen to what King Abdullah has to say, you'd know he's the person to listen to when it comes to achieving peace in the Middle East.

This is a great article written by a former Knesset member explaining where the idea "Jordan is Palestine"came from. MediaMonitors

This plan is not only wrong but is so unrealistic as long as Hassan is still living !(only some will get this....)

reply to post by BurningSpearess
I hear you but don't forget about the Jordanians and the Palestinians in Israel, they won't go for it without a fight which would trigger something bigger internationally.

reply to post by ghash


Jordan is a small country with half of the population palestinian already. Who cares let them have it...
It will happen anyway so lets stop being political and be realistic.

Jordan will not exist soon as a jordanian state or a monarchy...

Enough said...

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed
reply to post by CountDrac

 

That is simply incorrect. You should stop spreading disinformation.

If they're born in Jordan, they're Jordanian.

I was born in Canada with European ancestry, does that make me European?

Let's kick Europeans out of Europe and give it to Canadians!

By that logic, most of the Palestinians alive in Israel are Israelis. Right?

reply to post by nightbringr


No, they were born in Palestine, their land.

reply to post by nightbringr


unlike jordan israel does not consider them israeli nor do the palestinians want to be. In jordan they get citizenship and it seems to work fine. so when the monarchy is gone and when jordan has free elections. do you think they the palestinians there wont choose a palestinian leader?

its going to happen either with force or in peaceful means but that does not change the fact that either way palestinians will be the majority in jordan and eventually have political control.

dracula out

reply to post by CountDrac


When the monarchy is gone?
How is that even possible? Why would the Jordanians (and the ones with Palestinian descent) overthrow the government? We don't want to leave in peace any more, we don't want to feel safe and secure any more? We don't want to live a proper life? Yes, that's definitely going to happen.

And Sir, discussing this with you isn't going to work. Because over the last 5 pages of this thread, more than one person has presented facts and well informed opinions about the "issues" (that don't actually exist) in Jordan, and all you've done is ignored them and parroted that "Jordan will be Palestine whether I like it or not".
What you don't actually know that, if Palestine is ever fully restored (and by that I mean the complete elimination of Israel), Palestine and Jordan won't exist separately.

The Palestinians and us Jordanians do not separate ourselves, it's not us and them, even the ones that were born and raised in Palestine. The very same Palestinians that you're talking about hold important military, governmental and economical positions in Jordan.

Do you even know why the Palestinian-Israeli issue is such an important one in this world?
Jews, Muslims and Christians consider Jerusalem as the Holy Land. Israel wants to dig underneath the Al-Aqsa Mosque to look for Solomon's Temple.

So pretty much put all that together, with the fact that Israel has fought wars with it's neighbours at least twice, it has politically strained the Middle East, receives billions of foreign aid from the US (the largest recipient of foreign aid - according to Wikipedia), spies on it's neighbours, prolongs and delays peace talks, says the Palestinians are the ones that don't want peace, all they want is to wipe us off, during which of course the bombs and daily murder and illegal occupation continues; if the Palestinians retaliate, they're terrorists of course, who are they to defend their land from the "Chosen People".

And no, it doesn't just stop there, Israel also did not sign the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, and has been threatening, and begging the international community to act against Iran (not that I'm defending them, just pointing out Israel's hypocrisy) , and if Iran ever says anything back, they're terrorists and have no right to defend themselves. While they're waiting for new peace talks, the Palestinians decide to apply to the UN (the same system that has called for Israel to stop it's war crimes and illegal occupation, and seems like has no power over the Zionists) for membership, NOT statehood. Because you cannot apply for membership if you're not a state. Who recognizes states? States recognize each other, not the UN. And 173 countries in the world recognized and calls for the State of Palestine, and the return to the pre-1967 borders. Israel calls for the US to veto the decision at the UN, but it cannot do that at UNESCO. Palestine gains membership at UNESCO, US cuts aid to UNESCO, and says (along with Israel) that this is detrimental to the peace process (which Israel is ignoring, and Palestinians have taken into their own hands). And Israel retaliates and teaches the Palestinians a lesson for ever applying for membership, what fools you are to stand up to Israel, and extends their illegal settlements under international law.

Almost a century of illegal occupation, massacres, kicking the Palestinians out of their own land, taking over land, dropping bombs, waging wars, war crimes, stolen lands from neighbouring countries (i.e Golan Heights, Gaza, etc). The list goes on and on and on and on..
But of course, the Palestinians will forget ALL about that, stop being so thankful all of a sudden to Jordan, overthrow the Hashemite rule, which they also demanded to rule in the region as well, appoint a Palestinian leader, and live happily ever after.

I'm gonna play along my friend, and that's it? You think the rest of the Middle East will calm down?
Do you think the Muslim world would ever be okay with a regime such as Israel in the region, fully established, expanding to the extremities of the Palestinian land, and dominating the Holy Land as well?

I hope I don't insult you my friend, but you haven't even been properly introduced to the issue. It's not just a issue of race, it's not just the hate of the Zionists, it's not just that Palestinians were kicked out; it's also the fact that a country like Israel exists, the way it controls US media.
It's also a fact of that Islam has a claim to that land as a Holy Land.

I'm eagerly anticipating your next post, emphasizing this time on how Palestinians are going to take over Jordan, AGAIN. I don't know if I should copy and paste my posts over and over, because I might run out of history to write about.

Originally posted by ghash
reply to post by nightbringr

 

No, they were born in Palestine, their land.

Really?

When I look at that little piece of land on a map, it's says "Israel". So, unless the Palestinian in question is younger than 63, by his logic they are not Palestinians, but in fact Jews.

Originally posted by nightbringr

Originally posted by ghash
reply to post by nightbringr

 

No, they were born in Palestine, their land.

Really?

When I look at that little piece of land on a map, it's says "Israel". So, unless the Palestinian in question is younger than 63, by his logic they are not Palestinians, but in fact Jews.

Really?

whatreallyhappened.com...

What are we kindergarten children?
One guy tells me what he sees on a map, and the other is going to parrot that Jordan will be Palestine over and over with nothing but a conflict half a century ago?