CERN claims faster-than-light particle measured

Not the first time this has been claimed...but:

GENEVA (AP) -- Scientists at the world's largest physics lab say they have clocked subatomic particles traveling faster than light. If that's true, it would break - if not severely twist - a fundamental pillar of physics.

Nothing is supposed to go faster than light. But scientists say that neutrinos - one of the strangest well-known particles in physics - smashed past the cosmic speed barrier of 186,282 miles per second (299,792 kilometers).

The European Organization for Nuclear Research, CERN, says the speeds were detected in a neutrino beam fired from Geneva to a lab 454 miles (730 kilometers) away in Italy.

Baffled scientists are asking others to independently verify the measurements or find other more mundane explanations for the measured speed.

AP Article

Is this the beginning of a new chapter (figurative)?

reply to post by UberL33t


Once confirmed, maybe we can finally get rid of the Einsteinian model and start working on developing a theory based on tangible observations instead of mathematical theory.

This is from the link. It's the last thing the article says: "He cautioned that the neutrino researchers would also have to explain why similar results weren't detected before, such as when an exploding star - or supernova - was observed in 1987."

I actually have a theory for this. I've heard it said that in general objects in space don't really decelerate because there isn't friction or something to that effect. However, the universe is expanding probably because of dark matter and such. Who is to say how much dark matter effects mass? Who is to say that even light from a star or specifically neutrino's couldn't be slowed down over time by travelling over massive distances through varying gravitational fields caused by numerous things from planets and stars to perhaps dark matter itself. All I'm saying is if a black hole can suck up light because it has such strong gravitational pull. Who is to say that a slightly weaker gravitational pull couldn't effect the speed of neutrino's in space.

So if this is correct then.. time travel is plausible?
I'm a noob when it comes to physics.. my apologies.

so cool.

we can mover faster than light.

i could probably be in two places at once now. as soon as I master this.

Originally posted by JohnySeagull
so cool.

we can mover faster than light.

If you're a neutrino, yeah, maybe.

I haven't read the paper, but the AP article says the neutrinos arrived 60+/-10 ns faster than they should have. In 60 ns, light will travel 18 meters. Is there something that could have decreased the distance between the experimental stations by ~18 meters? It seems like a lot, too much for natural geological changes. It would have to be human error, like installing one of the sites in the wrong room or using a different datum for each site.

Here is a ten year old CERN Bulletin about neutrinos exceeding the speed of light, so the idea isn't that new.

reply to post by FurvusRexCaeli


i am everything . everything is me.

its easy when you know how.

reply to post by GrimReaper86


so if neutrinos travel faster than light, wouldnt you have to detect them before the light from an exploding star reached you? If you watched the big bang, the neutrinos would hit you before the flash would. Is this why the are trying to recreate a mini big bang? Sorry i quit following cern when the black hole doomsday stuff hit.

reply to post by UberL33t


Not a very good AP article, no offense to the OP, good find just the same. They don't specify the type of neutrino (electron, muon or tau) and all three have different masses as proven in the Fermilab experiments such as MiniBooNE.

Cheers - Dave

Well, there's the answer to the problematic aspect of the alien invasion scenario....
I suppose there was a toss up between that and the interdimensional membrane one ("we have discovered a schodinger'scat-uark"), plus frequency modulation would be too easy for the layman to replicate - not many people have a CERN in their back yards.
On an irrelevant note, a friend of mine had a guided tour of the place a couple of months ago. He seemed pleased. I guess it must be a physics thing.

Sure thats cool but what if time does not even exist...

uuuh baby!

if neutrinos can do it, why shouldn't we as well?
yes we can

"It's a shock," said Fermilab head theoretician Stephen Parke, who was not part of the research in Geneva. "It's going to cause us problems, no doubt about that — if it's true."

yeah you be better prepared heheh ;D

linky

>>--->

Originally posted by OwenGP185
Sure thats cool but what if time does not even exist...

well, but space does. and the past, future and present coexist on the same plane, that makes the whole theory even more tricky.

Originally posted by TechUnique
So if this is correct then.. time travel is plausible?
I'm a noob when it comes to physics.. my apologies.

No, they're traveling faster than they should be able to under Einsteinian physics, which means we may need to rethink quite a bit of what we think we know to be true. That's the problem when you develop a mathematical model of how you wish the universe to behave rather than tweaking what you know to be true based on observational evidence. If this is confirmed, we can finally do away with this defunct archaic theory and start making some real advances in science.

Parallel thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

It's a very interesting result, if it is correct. I'm not surprised that this should have happened. There are a lot of theoretical physicists who have been looking hard at the "theory of relativity" for some time now. Taking the long view, there is no reason why this theory should not have been found to be a useful but ultimately inadequate model. That has been the fate of all the other theories.

Undoubtedly Einstein would be stimulated by this news.

Stupid scientists.
Have they forgotten about the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principal?
That right there, that's gonna be the turd in the punchbowl.

Originally posted by GrimReaper86
All I'm saying is if a black hole can suck up light because it has such strong gravitational pull. Who is to say that a slightly weaker gravitational pull couldn't effect the speed of neutrino's in space.

edit on 22-9-2011 by GrimReaper86 because: (no reason given)

Anyone ever tell you you're smart? You are.

So correct me if i'm wrong..
If this is possible than if you observe some matter that moves faster than light ( for instance from one side of the box to another ) , wouldn't you see it on the other side before it started to move at all?

reply to post by borutp


Now that you say that... Noi aaargh, my brains can't compute this....... TTTTZZZZz

reply to post by borutp


No, light still travels at the speed of light...that's why they call it that. If the object emitted neutrinos you could possibly detect them before you saw the object move, but that would still happen after the object moved.