Elenin Has Not Survived Perihelion...Or Has It?

reply to post by LightAssassin



I do, really wan't to believe the official media, but there's always a hope for some answers if there is anything out there. you know. so i keep telling myself that there is

But i agree with you!

In summary,

With all the discussions had, the conclusion that can be drawn from this is:

Comet Elenin, in all likelihood, is in the process or has disintegrated, but will still require SOHO and terrestrial observation to confirm.

DJW raises great points about the camera used by Francis Walsh, the fact it can bleed over into other pixels, and it does not have an Anti-blooming gate, while I countered with the fact Francis Walsh has access to a variety of 'filters' that Michael Mattiazzo has not used in any of his pics. What the filters 'actually' do is still to be determined but it 'appears' to enhance the photos and also enable viewing of the nucleus. The fact pixels can 'bleed' into one another does put doubt over what can actually be seen BUT no obvious 'elongation' can be seen from Francis' pics, and what 'appears' to be the nucleus 'seems' to be intact.

Xcalibur has also offered differing pics, supporting the 'break-up' theory with pictures taken mid-August that seem to also suggest 'break-up' has occured. We have no reason to disbelieve these pics without disbelieving both Michael Mattiazzo's and Francis Walsh therefore these add credible evidence to the break-up/disintegration theory.

Druid successfully points out ALL reports HAVE NOT confirmed disintegration but have pretty much stated 'All signs point to 'YES'. As mentioned, confirmation is still required.

Thankyou everyone for participating. It got off to a rocky start but we have come to a conclusion while successfully lifting the 'defining' judgement that it HAS disintegrated, even though in all likelihood it has.

There's no way with any telescope anyone can see the nucleus of a comet. You need a spacecraft for that.

A comet coma should grow brighter as it approaches perihelion, if it doesn't one of two things have occurred, it broke up or ran out of frozen volatiles to outgas which would be rare for a comet's first trip to the inner solar system.

Isn't it possible that this comet, that has been estimated to be fairly large, could have many surfaces perhaps the angle at which one of it's surfaces is facing isn't reflecting light towards us (earth.)

About 4 miles across is tiny for an astronomical body.

I've heard many people claim Elenin is an E-class object ( comet ? Asteroid ? ) Now, I don't know for sure on this one, but what I've read of E-class comets/asteroids aren't they kind of a polygon or diamondish shape ? Usually, metalic or crystalline ? I'm not a scientist or astronomer just regurgitating information. Correct me if I'm wrong,

I will. Please keep your reverse peristalsis to yourself.

Oxford Dictionary of Astronomy: E-Class Asteroid Top Home > Library > Miscellaneous > Oxford Articles A rare class of asteroid whose members have a featureless reflectance spectrum, flat to slightly reddish over the wavelength range 0.3–1.1 άm. E-class asteroids are distinguished from the spectrally identical classes M and P by their higher albedos (0.25–0.60). The E is for enstatite, since they are believed to have surfaces that are similar in composition to enstatite achondrite meteorites. Members of this class include (44) Nysa, diameter 68 km, and (214) Aschera, diameter 24 km. Read more: www.answers.com...

The link is listed. Elenin is a comet, not an asteroid. Elenin has none of the characteristics of an E-class asteroid.

it doesn't make sense an object that is supposed to be HUGE, and has been claimed to be Metallic/Stone/Minerals/crystalline a space ship even by some would suddenly disintegrate.

An approximate width of four miles is not huge in astronomical terms.

If I'm not mistaken it's supposed to pass close to the sun, but not so close it would be absorbed or completely destroyed. If it is Metallic/stone/mineral/crystalline I would imagine it could melt, or heat up to extreme temperatures, but it would simply harden back up before it passed Earth again. After all, it's not just going to disappear.

Harden back up? Passing Earth again? Yes, a comet can melt, and the smaller fragments melt, and become smaller fragments, etc. Solar radiation in the form of Gamma Rays are quite devastating to any planetary body without a magnetically produced biosphere. No protection from a magnetically induced field, and you are a toasty cheese sandwich. Such as a comet. Such as Elenin.

Matter is matter, even if it melts it's still a very large mass moving through space. Broken into pieces, a huge chunk what ever. Who's to say passing the sun won't heat up what ever the little pieces are, then as it whips around the sun, becomes compressed and as it moves away from the sun again, solidifies into a very large chunk once more.

The second law of thermodynamics states that all phases of matter tend toward equilibrium. Therefore, an object that has begun entropy, a state progressing towards equilibrium, cannot revert back to a previous state, and it will be absorbed by it's environment. In this case, a comet named c/2011 x1 will reduce itself by it's environment into simpler aspects of itself, namely, the hydrogen, oxygen, and other various elements it was composed of, basically, it will become a part of the open space it was born into, once again.

reply to post by Druid42


Very good answers, and as I said I was going simply on everything people keep saying about the body in question.

As far as your equilibrium explanation, comets are formed in the same gas/dust clouds the birth stars and planets correct ? A comet is just a collection of gas that didn't have the mass or correct composition to burn, or form a large star or planet right ? Similar process different product ? Now, as these comets are ejected from a warm or even hot gas/dust cloud they freeze due to the lack of heat in space (as long as they are not near a star or part of the Gas/Dust cloud that birthed them.) Or would the comets be formed from the destruction of other gaseous bodies like stars or gas giants? If they are frozen gasses, if they approached a star where they would be bombarded with radiation and or heat( I guess heat is radiation, but I'm assuming heat vs Gamma radiation produce obviously different results by your explanation as a comet killer ) Now, if the Sun say evaporates the frozen gas, back to gas or even a plasma state in an extreme possibility, wouldn't that gas cloud then carry on into space away from the sun and essentially condense again in the cold of space ? Clumping together just as it had when it was formed ? Explain please ? I wasn't being arrogant, ignorant or trying to mislead anyone. I was asking questions to any that could answer, and simply stating what has been said in oh so many threads, and trying to ponder as to why so many others just say, " Yup, that there Elenin isn't so bright no more. Must be gone. " Isn't Elenin considered a young comet ? I've heard both, that it's ancient, with a 3600 year orbit which is where so many others claim it's this fugly nibiru bull crap. Or is that 3600 elliptic voyage based on Nibiru contamination? If not, and it came from the Kuiper belt, Oort cloud or beyond as a new comet why did it break up so soon, when other comets have made the trip to the sun, for hundreds, some even thousands of years ? You seem to be knowledgeable in the science of comets, please educate me.

reply to post by Ilyich


"comets are formed in the same gas/dust clouds the birth stars and planets correct" Yes, probably, but remember, on stellar scales dust = rocks and mountains too.

"A comet is just a collection of gas"
and water ice and metals and most everything else all in different ratios: tho most comets we seen are "dirty ice balls". To assume that they are all like that is unwise.

"Or would the comets be formed from the destruction of other gaseous bodies like stars or gas giants?"
that too. Sol is a second generation star, which means that it and the earth are the products of exploded first generation stars and other collected masses..like iron. Iron can only be formed in the heart of a star. It has often been said that all matter tends towards iron. Atoms lighter fuse up to iron and atoms heaver decay down to iron.

Comets are formed in many ways: only some of which we may have an idea on. Remember guyz, comets are mostly mysteries to us still.

"wouldn't that gas cloud then carry on into space away from the sun and essentially condense again in the cold of space"
No unfortunately. The solar wind is very strong compared to slow velocity gases. It is strong enough in fact, that we and the Japanese are building solar wind sails designed to pull payloads (heavy masses) across our stellar system. Most gases that are evaporated by the sun's heat are pushed away by the solar wind, hence, cometary tails....notice how they always point AWAY from Sol?

Elenin has a 12,000 year orbit, so by human standards, it's a new comet, but by solar system standards, if it's orbit has remained unchanged, Elenin has made this trip into the inner system many many times before. But we cannot know this. We can only know what we measure today and today it seems that Elenin hasn't been to our part of the system in 12k years.

We think comets are dirty ice balls. Most of our observations of past comets reflect this idea, but we have never seen a long duration comet traveling in the plane of the ecliptic before and to assume that all comets are alike is ridiculous.

I personally think its a dense ball of electrically and magnetically active metal surrounded by and/or infused with frozen volatiles.

We'll find out soon enuf.

patience

reply to post by galactix


OK, the thread is about whether it has disintegrated or not.

A couple more days and SOHO Lasco 3 will show hopefully something, or nothing, to give us some visible proof.

Once this time arrives I will post up a vid of anything that can be seen, that isn't one of the regular objects appearing on Lasco i.e our other planets.

Was this already posted? I'm sorry if it gets doubled up. I tried to search the thread and didn't notice, so here we go...

Of Southern Comets Homepage:

"C/2010 X1 Elenin

10th magnitude and fading- in process of disintegrating. In solar conjunction.
May be visible in SOHO LASCO C3 images between September 23 - 29"

The assumption seems to have changed again.

huh. is this possible?

reply to post by Corruption Exposed

Oh, I see. Sorry I did not know about the media issue.

Here you go:

reply to post by galactix


I don't know what Stereo camera that is on.

It's not Behind....It doesn't seem to be Ahead either.....?!?

The Big dipper is there...clearly.

Some new movement... On which side of the sun should Elenin be seen in LASCO C3 when/if it appears?

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by OnWhiteMars


Nope, that dots moving relative to all the other background stars. A day or two and we should hopefully see something.

Can someone tell me if what is shown at 10:25 in this vid is legit or not? Total b.s.?

reply to post by nitro67

Can someone tell me if what is shown at 10:25 in this vid is legit or not? Total b.s.?

The entire video is the usual "New Age" fear mongering. The STEREO sequence is discussed on this thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Well, Elenin should start appearing on Lasco C3 soon.

That is if it hasn't broken up of course, which I'm fairly certain it has.

sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov...

LASCO C3 1024x1024 resolution.

Will come in from left of screen.

reply to post by Chadwickus


Yeh, I've been checking every morning and afternoon.

There's some footage missing now from Lasco C3.

reply to post by LightAssassin


According to Celestia, we should be able to see the comet during the day about Sept 25th-27th. That is if the brighness of the Sun does not obscure it. I hope we get to see a nice show!

NASA is claiming this comet is insignificant. I digress. Show me another comet that orbits the ecliptic plane and has a 3600 year or so orbit. Show me one.

People also do not realize that even though the nucleus may only be 4km, the coma was about the size of Jupiter before that CME blew it out. If this thing passes between the Sun and Earth with a full sized coma, we will get one hell of a show. Just imagine what a Jupiter sized object would look like with this same orbit.

reply to post by BIGPoJo

Show me evidence that Elenin has a 3,600 year orbit.

Elenin (or what's left of it) will not pass between the Sun and the Earth.