A Photo Mystery

Originally posted by kacou
Maybe the simple explaination is that this photo is not the wedding in question but another wedding or event where your brother was....

This is what I'm thinking. Your brother was clearly there. I can not think of any explanation normal or para that would make any sense at all other than he was actually there. This means you 26 years later you've got the occasion mixed up or he's got the timeframe out of wack thought he couldn't have gone for the reasons stated, but he actually did and maybe it was another occasion he couldn't attend. Either way, if that's your brother, he was there.

Originally posted by kacou
Maybe the simple explaination is that this photo is not the wedding in question but another wedding or event where your brother was....if this is the case then great but if this is not the case then your brother may have astro-project himself without knowledge of it.

The last time Brion saw Cindy - before a birthday party in the summer of 2008 - was in 1977, when he left the area and moved with the woman he would eventually marry. This wedding was in 1985. That's just the truth of that situation. I can't make this photo make sense.

I am a Graphic Designer and have taken a closer look into the photograph. It has NOT been manipulated... The light projected on him from ceiling lights is correct and there is no "trace" around his actual figure. Not sure if he is far enough back to have the sunlight hitting him though?

reply to post by NorEaster


So how did you're other brother come to have this photo? Was he at the wedding? even with such serious problems? I'm really sorry, I just can not even come up with any way this exists unless he was actually there. Somebody's either made a mistake or not being totally honest. I'd be more inclind to believe if you were telling me your brother had died 5 years before, at least the suggestion that a ghost attended a wedding makes more sense that a living person showing up at a wedding he did not attend.

OK....taking my theory, I went a little farther. I ran the exif data and it came back to this:
Here's the full data:

JFIF
JFIF Version 1.01
Resolution 1 pixels/None

File — basic information derived from the file.
File Type JPEG
MIME Type image/jpeg
Comment CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 80
Encoding Process Baseline DCT, Huffman coding
Bits Per Sample 8
Color Components 3
File Size 54 kB
Image Size 720 × 503
Y Cb Cr Sub Sampling YCbCr4:2:0 (2 2)

The comment shows Creator was used. I did some research and Creator was an early 1990's image and text editing software. It is apparently now defunct although the rights were sold.

The program implemented the feature whereby each object on the page could be made to replicate itself in a defined grid formation. Additionally each object could contain a list of content references such as text strings, images or external file references which would then be automatically displayed inside the replicated objects within the grid. This feature provided the user with the ability to create interactive menus and scrollable data lists.

The application could run either unattended in "slide show" mode or be driven interactively via touch screen, mouse and/or keyboard. Creator included database searching techniques via SQL queries on the book data. The program also utilised numerous page transitions and hi-resolution, true colour graphics to attract its target audience. The Creator Server extension allowed for a system administrator to update book and page content on any client machine across a LAN or to remote machines via modem dial up.

Creator

Seems to me your brother Jeff might have possibly been trying to create a series of images with Brion and maybe even others in them when they originally weren't.

Originally posted by amaster
reply to post by KILL_DOGG

 

HAHAH!! He's not talking about the light. He's talking about the guy in the blue flanel shirt. (EDIT: Sorry, I see you already caught that.)

First of all, if you can, rather than scan in the photo, take a picture of it, and upload that so it can be shown to be a true photo.

I've seen the photo myself. That's what's in it. It's a cheap snapshot photo.

Second, I assume this is the only photo where he shows up, so perhaps the event is mistaken and this is not said ladies wedding. Try thinking of another event where these people would all be together at that time.

The other photos show Cindy and her sister in the same dresses, and her brother (John) as the bride groom (it was his wedding, not hers). It's all the same event.

It's also a possibility that this may just be a double exposure. I don't think there is anything "supernatural" about this.

edit on 7/11/2011 by amaster because: (no reason given)

That's some clear and crisp double-exposure, if that's what it is. I've seen double-exposures before, and they always have an obvious division of some sort between one exposure and the other.

Originally posted by webpirate
OK....taking my theory, I went a little farther. I ran the exif data and it came back to this:
Here's the full data:

JFIF
JFIF Version 1.01
Resolution 1 pixels/None

File — basic information derived from the file.
File Type JPEG
MIME Type image/jpeg
Comment CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 80
Encoding Process Baseline DCT, Huffman coding
Bits Per Sample 8
Color Components 3
File Size 54 kB
Image Size 720 × 503
Y Cb Cr Sub Sampling YCbCr4:2:0 (2 2)

The comment shows Creator was used. I did some research and Creator was an early 1990's image and text editing software. It is apparently now defunct although the rights were sold.

The program implemented the feature whereby each object on the page could be made to replicate itself in a defined grid formation. Additionally each object could contain a list of content references such as text strings, images or external file references which would then be automatically displayed inside the replicated objects within the grid. This feature provided the user with the ability to create interactive menus and scrollable data lists.

The application could run either unattended in "slide show" mode or be driven interactively via touch screen, mouse and/or keyboard. Creator included database searching techniques via SQL queries on the book data. The program also utilised numerous page transitions and hi-resolution, true colour graphics to attract its target audience. The Creator Server extension allowed for a system administrator to update book and page content on any client machine across a LAN or to remote machines via modem dial up.

Creator

Seems to me your brother Jeff might have possibly been trying to create a series of images with Brion and maybe even others in them when they originally weren't.

My brother Jeff? Using photo editing software? And, I suppose he had it printed onto aged photo paper, and then he stashed the photo inside a box of old 1970-1980s photos so that someone would someday find them. I've underestimated the genius of my little brother. He wasn't as helpless on a computer as we always assumed. Holy cow!!!

Seriously. What the hell are you taking about? This isn't Obama birth certificate. This is a snapshot that was sitting for decades in a box that my brother had among his personal possessions when he died. This isn't a conspiracy to defraud anything. Brion scanned the original photo with whatever the hell he's got for a crappy scanner, and that's what you're "reading". Not the piece of sh*t Kodak snapshot photo itself.

reply to post by webpirate


I have used Creator and I am confident in my design experience that a manipulation to this magnitude would have left more visible traces of an altered area, basically the technology at that time was not capable of such alterations.

reply to post by kennedy13


There are no traces of it altered because the entire image was saved in final form. It is the image of the final image.
Here is the forensics of this image:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/cb1dac73e8d1.jpeg[/atsimg]

This photo we are looking at has NOT been altered. So either it is an image of an altered image or your brother WAS there. No other way around it.

reply to post by NorEaster


Is it possible that this is just some random person that looks alot like your brother??
It was a very common look back then. Where was the wedding held? (Just trying to figure if some random could actually access the function??) Was there a band at the wedding? (Band member maybe???)
He obviously isn't dressed as a guest......

Originally posted by DJKris
reply to post by NorEaster

 

So how did you're other brother come to have this photo? Was he at the wedding? even with such serious problems?

Jeff was the best man at the wedding. We come from a very small town, and while Brion and Frank were at war, it was and has remained their war. Trying to explain the way things were between people from my neighborhood is a struggle that I don't feel like dealing with right now. Someday, I may write a book, but until then, I'd rather not get buried inside that effort.

I'm really sorry, I just can not even come up with any way this exists unless he was actually there. Somebody's either made a mistake or not being totally honest. I'd be more inclind to believe if you were telling me your brother had died 5 years before, at least the suggestion that a ghost attended a wedding makes more sense that a living person showing up at a wedding he did not attend.

I agree with you. This is why I'm so stumped. I wouldn't have posted a photo of a deceased brother at the wedding. The answer wouldve been obvious. This anomaly isn't so easily explained.

Question:
Did Frank attend the wedding and are there pictures of him on that wedding?

Hi NorEaster,

Interesting thread.

I have some questions if you don't mind, to try to clear up things.

1- You said that there are other photographs of this event, do you see the whole set? And if so, is this one the only one where your brother appears?
2- Do you show this photo to the other people who were there? What do they think?
3- What your brother think himself?
4- The light, colours, etc are consistent with what we can see in the photo, the top of the hair of your brother is even lighted up by the five ceiling lamps above him, so it's really like if he was there. Are you sure that (26y after, it would be understandable!) you haven't mixed up events?

Originally posted by webpirate
OK....taking my theory, I went a little farther. I ran the exif data and it came back to this:
Here's the full data:

JFIF
JFIF Version 1.01
Resolution 1 pixels/None

File — basic information derived from the file.
File Type JPEG
MIME Type image/jpeg
Comment CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 80
Encoding Process Baseline DCT, Huffman coding
Bits Per Sample 8
Color Components 3
File Size 54 kB
Image Size 720 × 503
Y Cb Cr Sub Sampling YCbCr4:2:0 (2 2)

The comment shows Creator was used. I did some research and Creator was an early 1990's image and text editing software. It is apparently now defunct although the rights were sold.

Seems to me your brother Jeff might have possibly been trying to create a series of images with Brion and maybe even others in them when they originally weren't.

That's not quite correct. That file is uploaded to abovetopsecret and that is where that exif comes from. You can try it yourself. That's a huge problem in my opinion since we very often need to see the original exif on many photos here. I've asked the owners to do something but gotten no reply.
Also when it comes to altering photos checking compression artifacts, checking lighting and traces around the suspect part are not the only indicators that should be checked. Those reveal 99% of fakes but I'd go even deeper and do an noise analysis etc. and even then I wouldn't be 100% sure

Originally posted by jewells
reply to post by NorEaster

 

Is it possible that this is just some random person that looks alot like your brother??
It was a very common look back then.

This is what I expected to see when I was first alerted to the existence of this photo. I actually expected the flannel/beard guy to be somewhere way in the background, thereby making it possible to mistake him for my brother. But this photo is much too clear for this person to be anyone but Brion. I was pretty startled when i saw it. Yes, that was a pretty standard look at the time - and still is in some places - but that's no one but Brion. Oddly enough, Cindy never saw Brion when he looked like that. It was during tha period of time when he was living in Lowell and hadn't been "home" for many years. His look changed again before he saw her again a few years ago.

Where was the wedding held? (Just trying to figure if some random could actually access the function??) Was there a band at the wedding? (Band member maybe???)
He obviously isn't dressed as a guest......

This was at the reception hall. I don't know the place, myself. I was in Boston at the time, and had a band that Brion was actually booking showcase gigs for around the city during this period. That's why know that he never went to this wedding. We were working together for those years as I was building my music career toward getting signed eventually. If he'd been there, I would've had to have been there too. No way that he would've gone without my knowing - and being there to prevent a tragedy.

No, I know my brother when I see him. That's Brion.

Originally posted by elevenaugust
Hi NorEaster,

Interesting thread.

I have some questions if you don't mind, to try to clear up things.

1- You said that there are other photographs of this event, do you see the whole set? And if so, is this one the only one where your brother appears?

Yes. This is the only one where he appears. The rest of the photos that Jeff had in his box were of the wedding party (he was best man), and of a few guests. He didn't have the professional shots. Just a few snapshots.

2- Do you show this photo to the other people who were there? What do they think?

Brion showed it to Cindy, to John (the bride groom, and Cindy's older brother), and to Cindy's sister (also in the photo), and eveyone's stumped as to how this happened.

3- What your brother think himself?

He's a magical thinker, so he imagines that he projected his image somehow. I have a serious problem with that sort of thinking, but I don't ave a good answer for how it happened that this photo was taken with him in the background.

4- The light, colours, etc are consistent with what we can see in the photo, the top of the hair of your brother is even lighted up by the five ceiling lamps above him, so it's really like if he was there. Are you sure that (26y after, it would be understandable!) you haven't mixed up events?

It was John's wedding, and considering the treacherous potential if Brion had actually been there, everyone that has been shown the photo (that was there) is very sure that Brion wasn't there. I wasn't there, so I have to go with what they say about who was and wasn't there. I do know that I never had to go out (over 300 miles away) and shut down any ugliness at John's wedding reception involving Brion and Frank. That much I do know. Beyond that, I'm at a loss.

Originally posted by Regenstorm
Question:
Did Frank attend the wedding and are there pictures of him on that wedding?

Frank was John's (the groom) brother-in-law. Cindy was there, and she says Frank was also there. John says Frank was there. That's all I know about that.

reply to post by webpirate




I guess that's definitive. Whatever that is.

So, no one's ever heard of this sort of thing happening then?

reply to post by NorEaster


Thanks for posting the pic & story NorEaster, I love a good mystery! I have some questions, if you can answer them.

Do you know if anything odd/unusual happened to Cindy in the days after this wedding?
Do you know the location the photo was taken (church, community center...)?
Would that have been normal dress for your brother at the time?

Thanks!
OiO