Tea Party now officially hijacked by the GOP

Originally posted by Antiquated1

So according to you, the real TEA party is really claiming successes in the 2010 elections by electing the RINOs that the TEA Party Express, who you say is fake, pushed?

That is pretty much what I thought. Thank you.

No.

That's an awful lot to read into a single, short word.

An awful lot that isn't there.

Since you loathe explanations, none will be forthcoming.

The TEA Party is proud of the RINOS that TPE pushed on them. So how does this rectify with my original question?

No, and it doesn't. At all.

Originally posted by mishigas

Believe me, I totally understand your position. I feel the same pain at where we are headed. But I am really heartened by some of the current new crop of legislators that I believe will make a great positive impact over the next decade. I'm willing to give them 10 years. If I'm wrong then I'll help you load the gun.

I'm fairly old. I've already given them 15 or 20 years, and I see where that's gotten us. I'm willing to give them NO more until and unless I see tangible results first, but that's just me. Pretty promises aren't enough any more. I want to see results, or at the very least honest effort.

I'll reconsider if I see an honest effort, but until then I'll fling my votes - and my donation money - elsewhere. I actually tend to agree with most of what you have to say, I've just reached the frustration level where I' m flat out refusing to continue sending "good money" after bad service.

Originally posted by mishigas

They are a grassroots activist group united by common goals. They are practically brand new as far as politics go. Yet people compare them with the GOP and the Dems, and measure them accordingly.

Give them time, for chrissakes. They did have a major impact in 2010. And if they stay true to their principles they will help to bring this nation back around.

They instill fear into people, and I'm talking about you, Antiquated1. So naturally they mock them, pooh pooh them, and accuse them of wildly foolish things, like racism. I thought after reading some of your posts that you realized this, nenothtu.

I realize that they are not an organized party, and are more of a movement, and I think they had (or perhaps "have") the potential to organize into a party, and have just not made it that far yet. I can actually see a fear of them, or rather what they represent, on both sides of the current political landscape. The democrats tend to try to ridicule them, in an effort to marginalize them out of fear, and the republicans tend to try to co-opt them, herd them "into the fold", also out of fear. When the neocons took over the republican party, and left the rest of us out in the cold, I think they didn't bank on the level of displeasure that would create, nor the strength of that displeasure.

The reaction appears to have scared them. Now, they seem to be trying to bring us into this new and odd party they have created, using an old label, but to force us into it on their terms. Not gonna happen, no matter what both sides claim. Some of us still hold to the old principles of what the republicans used to be, and have completely severed our ties to the re-branding of an old name. I was a registered republican for 40 years. I'm not any more, nor shall I ever be again, unless they come to me, not the other way 'round. Now I'm registered as an "independent".

The "Tea Party Movement", as a movement, has, or perhaps still has, potential - provided that enough stand up to refuse incorporation into the new republican party, which in my opinion would be more properly called the "neocon party". The "Tea Party Express", on the other hand, appears to me to be something that was organized to create confusion and sew doubt as to what the Tea Party Movement stood (or stands) for, and it seems to have been organized by a segment of the new republican party in order to foster the impression that the Tea Party Movement somehow supports the nefarious schemes that the neocon party is up to. We don't. The mission statement you quoted sums that up very well, and I can't see any particular points where it applies to the actions of the republicans these past several years since the neocon takeover. In other words, I suspect the Tea Party Express as being a wholly different entity than the Tea Party Movement, created for the sole purpose of blurring the battle lines.

Give them time. Have they made mistakes? Bad choices in some cases? Of course. But these are lessons that need to be learned. So stop being so pessimistic, and give them a chance.

They have their time, right now. Let's see what they try to do with it. I'm still waiting, but sharpening the swords while I wait.

Originally posted by Section31

Second, if you vote for another party, the Republicans and Third Party will lose the next election.

Period.

You would be handing Obama an instant victory; therefore, everyone supporting a third party would be sealing our fates to mandates. You will be giving the proverbial Devil the win. Obama has a series of new mandates on the horizon.

Mitt Romney has the cash and support to beat Obama, and chances are he will chose Herman Cain as his running mate.

I would seriously, and without reservation, vote for Obama before I would vote for Romney, and that's coming from a man who was a staunch republican for most of his life. With Obama, at least we KNOW that something wicked this way comes. With Romney, it's the same agenda, but "hidden" in a thin disguise claimed to be republican.

It's much easier to deal with the monsters while boldy sally forth than the ones that lie in wait in ambush.

Go with the battles you can win.

A Romney victory is a LOSS for America, not any sort of "win".

Do not forget the goal: Beat Obama at all costs.

NO!

The goal is to get the country back. merely setting a defeat of anyone as the goal is excessively short sighted, and will NEVER accomplish the goal. Of what use is trading one master for another? How does that give you your country back?

Election 2012 is a serious voting war, which will determine the fate of this country. Even though I am not a Republican, I am using my vote to defeat Obama in 2012.

THIS IS A STRATEGIC VOTING WAR!

edit on 6/6/2011 by Section31 because: (no reason given)

In a "war", you need a strategy. merely defeating one master in favor of another is NOT a strategy, it's an act of desperation that will have far reaching, and quite negative, consequences.

Originally posted by Section31
If the Tea Baggers mess this next election up, I will turn my anger onto the movement with a snap of a finger.

We cannot afford to allow Obama to win the next election.

Even though I am not a Republican loyalist, I'm voting for the GOP nominee to defeat Obama.

Period.

"Swear allegiance to the flag
whatever flag they offer.
Never hint at what you really feel.
Teach the children quietly
for some day sons and daughters.
Will rise up and fight
where we stood still."

- Mike and the Mechanics, "Silent Running"

I'm someone's son. I'm not willing to pass this battle on to my kids, just because I fear Obama. Sons and daughters are NOW. Passing it on to future generations out of fear is cowardice. I'm NOT willing to fall in line for whatever flag they offer, just to defeat Obama. I'd rather watch it all burn now, so that I can still show my sons and daughters how to re-construct one that works in the aftermath.

Originally posted by Section31

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
reply to post by Section31

 

OK, what are you going to GET if Republicans win?

Removal of Obamacare's mandate.
Reduced government presence within our lives.
Restoration of NASA's human space exploration.
A president that has pride in the United States, and he/she is not afraid to make our country number one.
Someone who wants to make the United States a leader again.
Someone who has experience in business, government, and military.
Someone who believes in a free market.
Someone who believes in the power of individuality.
Someone who listens to the people.
Someone who will be strong on foreign policy.
Someone who protects the freedom of speech.
Someone who want to protect our borders.
Someone who is tough on immigration.
Someone who cares about the constitution.
Someone who is humbled by faith.
Someone who is not afraid to tackle the deficit.
Someone who will cut down on spending.
Someone who is strong on national defense.
Someone who will not redistribute the wealth.
Someone who pushes for state sovereignty.
Someone who will audit the federal reserve.
Someone with a strong sense of morality.

Originally posted by Kitilani
reply to post by Section31

 

If you think voting GOP is winning the short battle in the long war to getting a third part candidate, then you sound like exactly the type of person the GOP is targeting.

Although I am an undeclared voter, I am going to vote Republican this time around.
Herman Caine & Mitt Romney 2012

edit on 6/6/2011 by Section31 because: (no reason given)

Wow! All That?
Boy, I sure wish we'd seen the Republicans in power able to do ANY of that in my lifetime!

But seriously, the ONLY time in the past 100 years the deficit has gone down is with Dems at the reigns.
Republicans have INCREASED the deficit every time they've been in power -- are you even paying attention? Bush put the war on the "emergency spending bill" but it wasn't free...

Not that I like the Dems. but they are BETTER by far on Defense. The entire Gulf War I was fought with the weapons Clinton commissioned -- not with much of anything from the Reagan/Bush eras.

Historically, even if you remove the Great Depression, the economy has grown at TWICE the rate under Democrats as Republicans. Not that I was a fan of Clinton signing NAFTA and getting rid of Glass Stegal -- but Republicans cheered him on with those fiascos -- so I don't think THEY are the source of reason or fiscal responsibility. Government allowing banks to bankrupt us during the S&L crisis and 2008 -- that costs a heck of a lot more than any kind of "government regulation" ever cost us.

Morals? George Bush NEVER went to church while in Washington -- but I suppose talking biblical nonsense makes some people feel good bout "morals" -- killing people in illegal wars -- real moral.

"immigration" are you kidding? Reagan and Bush opened the flood gates. Business in America loves cheap labor -- they talk a good game -- both sides. But if you don't want a Minimum wage -- or pushing for Tariffs on things made with slave wages or poor pollution standards that we import -- then it's just cheap talk. Besides, without some cost to import -- if you close the border, than the "illegals" will just be working in Sweat Shops in Mexico. You'd lose the jobs, AND the money the workers spend -- but I think it would be too much of a shock, and work against doctrine to try and convince you that "illegal aliens" benefit our economy FAR more than they cost it. Suffice to say -- I think it's morally wrong, mean and cruel to treat people this way, and if we actually STOOD UP for our principles, Mexicans would be happy to work in a Mexico not supported by our trade practices and drug use which allow for many benefits to crime.

>> And "Obamacare" was welcomed by the Republicans when Bob Dole presented it -- since then, Republicans have gone "full sellout" to corporate interests and profiteering. This would ONLY be a point of interest for policy wonks who pay attention -- those things you mention that Republicans "talk about" mean you don't bother to notice they never improve ANYTHING for working Americans.


>> The ONLY thing you would get with more Republicans is lower taxes for the wealthy and "belt tightening" for the rest of us. During Bush's tenure -- there was ZERO job growth, and the only thing that kept us even was half a million more people in "security theater" and the military. But most of the wealth is already now in the hands of the wealthy.

There is over $40 Trillion in the hands of the wealthy in this country -- and STILL, people on the Right are worried about the pennies we throw at the poor with "entitlements" -- if they got all this "largess" for being lazy, they wouldn't be fricken' poor. Corporations have more cash than they know what to deal with, the rich are clamoring for SOME kind of market to get a return on investment -- but there isn't ANYTHING left to "profit from" except Medicare and Social Security. And what do the "Republicans" want to rescue? How about those miracle 401k plans that replaced pensions? -- no guarantees, and they've done nothing but shrink for 10 years.

So the 0% interest banks have, and the huge stockpiles of cash, and the LOW, LOW corporate taxes -- and where are the jobs? There is no growing Middle Class market and it will not magically appear without demand -- and demand occurs when people have paychecks -- this was a KNOWN economic reality from the time of the Pyramids until the Reagan Era.


The Conservatives have gotten EVERYTHING they say they wanted -- and it crashed the economy. And there is nothing left to grow it unless and until the Government forces higher taxes on all that wealth, and creates demand by rebuilding our infrastructure.

>> Haven't you ever played the game Monopoly? What happens when one person gets all the money and property? The game is over -- nobody else can play. If you have nothing and I have everything -- I don't need to do business with you. And THAT is why our economy is stagnant -- no more suckers with cash.

reply to post by nenothtu


Why the Heck would a Republican fear Obama? He's negotiated away ANYTHING remotely Liberal even before he proposes a bill. He's more Conservative than Nixon.

Other than "misremembering" his facts, and tripping over his tongue, and saying really, really dumb things like; "We need a Crusade in the Middle East" -- Obama might as well be Bush. He hasn't rolled back any of his nonsense and he DID NOT raise taxes -- or END the Bush Tax Cuts.

Without the $2.4 Trillion in War spending over the Bush term and WITHOUT the Bush tax Giveaway to the top 2% -- we would NOT be talking about a DEFICIT right now. How can you people be so ignorant? We should all be so luck as to make $1 Million in salary a year and pay 50% taxes. But we can all be proud to make $35,000 and pay 24% taxes? Seriously, stop thinking about how great it will be when you are a CEO like Donald Trump -- you are NOT going to be Donald Trump. He inherited $400 Million.

What passes for "Socialism" in this country, is merely 3% more on the top 2% -- returning to the Clinton era tax policies -- and all of a sudden; NO ECONOMIC EMERGENCY!

Amazing, how much rampant waste and spending it took for the Republicans to engineer an economic crisis -- I'm surprised they didn't just burn cities to the ground -- oh wait, in a few states, because of underfunding of emergency services,... that's EXACTLY what's happening. Maybe we can hold a charity function to help out a few states that are underwater as well -- wouldn't want to have to pay enough TAXES so that we could support disaster relief in the richest country on earth.

I think I'd feel safer in Chile than this "we can't solve anything" country.

Tell your sons and daughters to stand up for themselves -- but "Obama" is not your problem. Your problem is YOU WANT the same jerk-offs in power who sold you out and gave you "moralizing nonsense." The only reason you haven't found out that every Republican leader is a closet freak is because THEY AREN'T BEING INVESTIGATED. You guys talk of revolution, but you are the most likely people to shoot the wrong target.

I have to say, that after reading some of the posts defending the Tea Party,....

... and ESPECIALLY, worried that the Republicans are becoming Democratic Lite -- as if? Would they even know what Democratic principles ANY Republicans or even Democrats are in danger of following, would they?

The Tea Party is pretty much as clueless as I thought it was. There is no point in discussion or debate -- you folks are really, really the Mad Hatters Tea Party. Debate can only happen if people don't come up with fears and facts out of thin air. There has to be some point of reference.

Obama is so much more Conservative than Ronald Reagan -- that I think they'd be calling him a RINO, Nixon a RINO -- heck, everyone but George Bush Jr. a RINO. But other than swaggering, attacking the wrong countries, and spending LOT's on security so it could chase it's own tail -- I'm not sure WHAT that dude was up to -- and who is the "real deal?" People who cannot win on "Are You Smarter than a Fifth Grader." Anyone too smart, with nuanced ideas, appears to be suspect.

If you folks remember, Texas had a governor who wanted to Secede from the USA -- and NOW they don't have enough "self sufficiency" to put out their own fires. This is where we are going -- a lot of whiney people, who are afraid of "Big Government" that they hand every dollar to Big Business.

Why aren't all those Texas Oil companies putting together their own fire-fighting team with all the Billions they sit on? Because I suppose it isn't blowing into their mansions -- they don't need to worry about YOU.

>> THE FACT IS: Obama will win the next election. There isn't one person in the Republican Presidential pool right now who will look good after any real scrutiny. As bad as the economy STILL is -- there isn't one of them that wouldn't scare the VAST MAJORITY of the American public that they wouldn't make it worse.

So things are going to continue to suck, and suck worse -- all because Republicans, Independents, and Tea Party leaders -- who all flavors of "just another Corporate Lacky" and they suck harder. There is no Third Party ticket -- nor is there really a Second Party ticket. There is only the CORPORATE ticket, and it goes from Fascist Light with Obama, to Fascist Expresso with Rand Paul. We are so, so very up the creek without a paddle and we've got people drilling holes in the bottom of the canoe.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
To the op,

Don't you mean The GOP has been hijacked by the TP? Eveidently they are bowing to the will of this racist group and whoever don't like what they say is instantly railroaded by them?

To the GOP people here,

Get your party back or else this will be the new mantra from here on out.

How DARE you call me a racist? Who in the hell are YOU to make such an assessment?

Tell me, oh wise one, what race am I "racist" for? What race am I?

I can guaran-damn-tee you wouldn't say such a thing to my face.

The GOP is most certainly NOT "bending to my will". I left the GOP several years ago specifically because they did NOT respond to the wills of their voters. THEY abandoned US, not the other way 'round. They've never looked back, and are STILL unresponsive to the will of their voters. They are nothing more than "Democrat Lite", and could give a damn about their base. They ONLY way they have to garner votes at this point is to play on people's fear of Obama, as if they themselves are ANY different.

Get the GOP back? Not a chance. As I said, THEY left US, not the other way 'round, and I'll be damned if I'll chase after them, wringing my hands and begging them to come back. Never did it with a woman, won't do it with a politician. As a matter of fact, they need US more than we need THEM, so all that begging crap will have to flow in the opposite direction.

I can live without 'em just fine, if that's the way they want to play it, and it appears it is.

Good riddance.

If you had an independant thought you'd speak out against your own party but since none of you have means 100% and unequivocally that you back each and every action or inaction of the group as a whole. There is an intense hatered for Obama to the point where no one in the GOP or the Bagger will dare speak out against the radicalia elements who now own you and know that they can get you to do whatever they want.

Until I see GOP people slamming and condemning these radicalia elements this will be the way forwar, no exceptions. Y'all allowed the radicalia elements to take over and now must suffer with the consequences.

The truth hurts don't it and if you try to slam or attack me it will just further prove my point!

reply to post by nenothtu


How about Sarah financing her vacation using campaign dollars, no one is dares to call her out from the right but are quick to call for Weiner's ouster. This is the hypocrisy of it. The Bagger and Nazi's can do whatever that they want and yet it's ok or acceptable, this is sickening.

Are you an American and if you answered yes remember one fact and make it quite clear, the only party you are to back is The American party, to continually play into politcos means y'all have no thinking brain and yet again have yet to produced an original thought and until you do none of y'all will be taken seriously.

Remember a bit of history, the Civil War was fought on The Confederate side by a bunch of middle and poverty class Americans all while protecting rich, affulent, white land baron's right to own slaves. They got the disinfranchised and poor to fight their war and by all accounts it's seeming to repeat itself all over again.

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst

Not that I like the Dems. but they are BETTER by far on Defense. The entire Gulf War I was fought with the weapons Clinton commissioned -- not with much of anything from the Reagan/Bush eras.

Say what? Gulf War I was "fought" under King George I of the Bush Dynasty. It was "Pre-Clinton".

Morals? George Bush NEVER went to church while in Washington -- but I suppose talking biblical nonsense makes some people feel good bout "morals" -- killing people in illegal wars -- real moral.

What "illegal" wars? Please cite the law that makes them "illegal".

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
reply to post by nenothtu

 

Why the Heck would a Republican fear Obama? He's negotiated away ANYTHING remotely Liberal even before he proposes a bill. He's more Conservative than Nixon.

Not being a Republican any more, I can't really be positive why they fear him, but I'd imagine what you say here is your first clue - since the Neocon takeover of the Republicans, they tend to fear conservative things, and so his slide to the right side of left probably had a lot to do with their angst. As far as liberal/conservative goes, Republicans aren't much less liberal than Democrats any more. It's just labels now, with no meaning at all behind them.

Other than "misremembering" his facts, and tripping over his tongue, and saying really, really dumb things like; "We need a Crusade in the Middle East" -- Obama might as well be Bush. He hasn't rolled back any of his nonsense and he DID NOT raise taxes -- or END the Bush Tax Cuts.

Exactly. See how easy that was to figure out?

Without the $2.4 Trillion in War spending over the Bush term and WITHOUT the Bush tax Giveaway to the top 2% -- we would NOT be talking about a DEFICIT right now. How can you people be so ignorant? We should all be so luck as to make $1 Million in salary a year and pay 50% taxes. But we can all be proud to make $35,000 and pay 24% taxes? Seriously, stop thinking about how great it will be when you are a CEO like Donald Trump -- you are NOT going to be Donald Trump. He inherited $400 Million.

I pay slightly over 26% in taxes, and make far less than 35k per year.

What passes for "Socialism" in this country, is merely 3% more on the top 2% -- returning to the Clinton era tax policies -- and all of a sudden; NO ECONOMIC EMERGENCY!

Gee, and here I was, thinking that by "socialism" they were referring to a nanny state that gives handouts to ne'er do wells and corporations (pretty much the same thing, eh?). Maybe they could consider living within a budget, like some of the rest of us have to do? Their idea of a "budget" falls in line with my second wife's odd notion of "budget". She always thought a budget was where you figured out first how much you wanted to spend, and then figured out where you were going to scrape all that money up from. Most of the rest of us consider a "budget" to be figuring out how to best apply what you have, and stop making bills in excess of that, rather than figuring out who to fleece to make up the money you'd like to spend!

Amazing, how much rampant waste and spending it took for the Republicans to engineer an economic crisis -- I'm surprised they didn't just burn cities to the ground -- oh wait, in a few states, because of underfunding of emergency services,... that's EXACTLY what's happening. Maybe we can hold a charity function to help out a few states that are underwater as well -- wouldn't want to have to pay enough TAXES so that we could support disaster relief in the richest country on earth.

I'd rather cut out the middle man, cut the Federal purse strings (and coercive power) by giving State money directly to the State to begin with, rather than throwing it to the Feds and letting them disburse it as they see fit, with all those strings attached.

I think I'd feel safer in Chile than this "we can't solve anything" country.

The door is over there, on your left....

Tell your sons and daughters to stand up for themselves --

You'll just have to trust me when I say that I do, and they are very, very good at it now.

but "Obama" is not your problem.

Not all of it, but a larger pivotal part of it. If he'll just stay the hell out of my pockets, and stop telling me what products and services I HAVE to buy, I'll be fine, thanks.

Your problem is YOU WANT the same jerk-offs in power who sold you out and gave you "moralizing nonsense." The only reason you haven't found out that every Republican leader is a closet freak is because THEY AREN'T BEING INVESTIGATED.

Maybe you can tell me just WHO I want in power, then? I'd rather decide that for myself,but if you feel a real need to decide FOR me, I'll consider your input in the matter. May not fall for it, but I'll consider it. You seem oddly to think that I have something for what currently passes as "Republican". I don't. They're just Democrats who are afraid to declare that major.

You guys talk of revolution, but you are the most likely people to shoot the wrong target.

Nossir. I've already been passed thru the fire, and I chose my targets very well.

Might be the "wrong" target from a leftist viewpoint, but that just means they need to learn to duck faster. Doesn't mean it's the wrong target empirically.

Originally posted by VitriolAndAngst
I have to say, that after reading some of the posts defending the Tea Party,....

... and ESPECIALLY, worried that the Republicans are becoming Democratic Lite -- as if? Would they even know what Democratic principles ANY Republicans or even Democrats are in danger of following, would they?

Not "becoming" - they ARE Democrats Lite. Just one example - before the Bush Neocon Dynasty, EVERY war the US engaged in was started by Democrats. Neocons mucked up that track record, didn't they? Or DID they?

Obama is so much more Conservative than Ronald Reagan -- that I think they'd be calling him a RINO, Nixon a RINO -- heck, everyone but George Bush Jr. a RINO.

Not got a very firm grasp on "conservative", have you? maybe you're just trying to play off the new definitions, and aren't old enough to remember what they WERE, back when there was some sort of difference? The Bush Dynasty are the ORIGINAL RINOs. That's what a "Neocon" IS. Neocons are neither new nor conservative - they're the same old democrats, afraid to declare that major.

>> THE FACT IS: Obama will win the next election.

I hope so, I really do. I'm anxious to watch it burn, to see if a Phoenix really CAN rise from the ashes. I believe it's too far gone now to fix without hitting the reset button, so let it roll.

There isn't one person in the Republican Presidential pool right now who will look good after any real scrutiny.

You've got that right! matter of fact, I haven't seen a single one yet that looks good even BEFORE a cursory examination, much less any real scrutiny. Gotta wonder what's up with that, and why they're trying to throw it - AGAIN! Like I said, Democrats Lite - and they appear intent on throwing it to their buddies - AGAIN.

So things are going to continue to suck, and suck worse -- all because Republicans, Independents, and Tea Party leaders -- who all flavors of "just another Corporate Lacky" and they suck harder.

Yup. Can't have any blame splattering on the Democrats who've BEEN holding the reins, can we? It's GOTTA be all those evil right wingers, eh?

There is no Third Party ticket -- nor is there really a Second Party ticket. There is only the CORPORATE ticket, and it goes from Fascist Light with Obama, to Fascist Expresso with Rand Paul. We are so, so very up the creek without a paddle and we've got people drilling holes in the bottom of the canoe.

"Fascist".... "socialist"... those terms hold no real meaning any more. Call it what it is - a march towards totalitarianism. Doesn't matter if a totalitarian comes from the left, the right, or hand-offs between the two. The end result is always the same, and it matters nary a whit what "ism" folks are bickering over while it's eating them.

Those folks drilling the holes in the canoe? Those are the ones bickering over the left/right "isms", and not minding the shop and watching for the real danger.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

If you had an independant thought you'd speak out against your own party but since none of you have means 100% and unequivocally that you back each and every action or inaction of the group as a whole. There is an intense hatered for Obama to the point where no one in the GOP or the Bagger will dare speak out against the radicalia elements who now own you and know that they can get you to do whatever they want.

Until I see GOP people slamming and condemning these radicalia elements this will be the way forwar, no exceptions. Y'all allowed the radicalia elements to take over and now must suffer with the consequences.

The truth hurts don't it and if you try to slam or attack me it will just further prove my point!

Say what? Can you boil that down into English, and leave out the perjoratives like "Baggers"? I thought I'd already assessed that in this thread as to it's propagandistic nature borne of fear.

Sounds a lot like you just want me to come over to the Dark Side and declare myself a Democrat, but that ain't gonna happen. That's why I renounced the Republicans to begin with!

Can't really say that I "hate" Obama - he'd probably be a hell of a lot of fun to hang out with at the bar - but he sure as hell drove the last nail in the coffin with his actions of late. I'm just waiting on the 21 gun salute in his second term to see if there's anything we can salvage of what once was the US when the smoke clears.

"Hate" is as useless and dangerous an emotion as "love" when your ass is in the tall grass.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1

How about Sarah financing her vacation using campaign dollars, no one is dares to call her out from the right but are quick to call for Weiner's ouster. This is the hypocrisy of it. The Bagger and Nazi's can do whatever that they want and yet it's ok or acceptable, this is sickening.

I can't honestly say that I give a rat's ass HOW Ms. Palin finances her vacations (what's up with that? Are you saying you'd rather she spend it CAMPAIGNING? You WANT her to run?) or who Weiner flashes his bits at across the aether. Now, if Sarah has any bits she'd like to flash, I might be game to take a peek... other than that, those are non-issues intended solely to distract.

Furthermore, if you can't hold a civil conversation without injecting perjoratives like "bagger" and "nazi" every other word, there really isn't any point in trying to hold a rational discussion with you, is there?

Are you an American

All the way to the marrow.

and if you answered yes remember one fact and make it quite clear, the only party you are to back is The American party,

Sure. Where do I sign up? Never heard of it before - maybe that's the third party I've been looking for! Reckon they stand a chance of getting on the ticket next year?

to continually play into politcos means y'all have no thinking brain and yet again have yet to produced an original thought and until you do none of y'all will be taken seriously.

This coming from a guy who labels everything to the right of Karl Marx as either a "bagger" or a "nazi".

Remember a bit of history, the Civil War was fought on The Confederate side by a bunch of middle and poverty class Americans all while protecting rich, affulent, white land baron's right to own slaves. They got the disinfranchised and poor to fight their war and by all accounts it's seeming to repeat itself all over again.

Probably not much you can teach me about the Civil War, but it's good to see that your indoctrination has taken so well. They'll be mighty proud of you and your revisionist history at the re-education camps!

BY the same token as what you say above, the Union side got the disenfranchised and poor to fight on behalf of the rich white bankers, merchants, and industrialists of the north, to protect their right to control ports and trade on foreign southern soil!

How were they "better"?

Yup, you're right about one thing - it seems set to repeat itself all over again!

reply to post by nenothtu


See, more proof that they own you, I am citing how Queen Sarah is misusing political donations to finance her "vacation" and everyone of y'all are for it, but God forbid a Democrat did the same. We'd never hear the end of it as well as demanding that the politician is investigated and sinc eit is Queen Sarah none of it matters right? Can you say double standard?

You are not worthy of The American Party as you still put party above nation whereas the stance of The American party is to forever and always put nation above political party, affiliation or allegiance.

I call them Baggers because they wear tea bags like females do fashion assecories and jewelery and the term Nazi comes from how they are utilizing and playing off of the Nazi SS playbook right now and how no one in the group is allowed to speak out against the actions or inactions of the group and the clear and obvious fact that not one person in the group is willing to stop being in lock step with the party that is not allowing the nation to advance on yap and is hijacking this nations progress all to deny a black man or the nation a sucess hence the racsim conductation.

If you don't like your group being cracked on do something to fix or change it and until then stay silent and remain silent.

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by nenothtu

 

See, more proof that they own you,

Could you be more specific as to what you believe to be "proof" that someone owns me? I've never seen PROOF of anything, anywhere, ever. In this case I don't even see evidence of what you claim.

I am citing how Queen Sarah is misusing political donations to finance her "vacation" and everyone of y'all are for it,

Again with "Queen" Sarah - and all this time I was thinking she was an American! You got the memo about how we don't have royalty on this side of the pond, right? Some folks never learn, and I reckon will always go over the top in order to put evidence of their fear on display to the world. Fine. Worship your "Queen". I'm not having any of it.

It's not so much as I'm "for" it, it's more a matter of me not caring in the least how she deals with her finances. After all, they're not MY finances, so why should I care?

but God forbid a Democrat did the same.

Why? Is there some particular reason I should get up in their financial business too? What part of "I don't care what they do with their money" is just not sinking in for you?

We'd never hear the end of it as well as demanding that the politician is investigated and sinc eit is Queen Sarah none of it matters right? Can you say double standard?

Sure, I can say "double standard". I can also say that it doesn't apply in the least here...

You are not worthy of The American Party as you still put party above nation whereas the stance of The American party is to forever and always put nation above political party, affiliation or allegiance.

I want no part of any party that I have to meet a test of "worthiness" for, so I'll leave the American Party to you. Good luck with getting it on any ballots this year, and I wish you all the best in that endeavor. Hint: you might want to promote your party a bit more, so that someone, somewhere, recognizes that name of it at least. That would be a good first step in getting your candidate on a ballot. Start out small - local Dog Catcher might be a good jump point.

Precisely WHICH party am I putting above Nation? I'm registered as an "Independent", but wasn't aware that was any sort of a real party. I thought it meant "unaffiliated with any party". I dare say you'd be hard pressed to find any one, any where, who is any more nationalistic than I am.

Now, if I were to find a party who actually acted in the best interests of the nation, I'd probably join up in a heartbeat. So far, most all of them fail, and fail miserably - both Republicrats AND Demicans. Not a nickel's worth of difference in the whole damned bunch, and NONE of them have the nation's interests in mind.

I call them Baggers because they wear tea bags like females do fashion assecories and jewelery and the term Nazi comes from how they are utilizing and playing off of the Nazi SS playbook right now and how no one in the group is allowed to speak out against the actions or inactions of the group and the clear and obvious fact that not one person in the group is willing to stop being in lock step with the party that is not allowing the nation to advance on yap and is hijacking this nations progress all to deny a black man or the nation a sucess hence the racsim conductation.

Poor baby. Stay fearful - we like it when folks are as scared as you, and publicly display that fear in such vociferous terms. It keeps you lot honest. I've not seen anyone getting beat down for voicing dissenting opinions, so I'm not sure where you're getting that fantasy from, unless it just springs from a fearful and diseased mind, which seem highly likely.

Could you clarify what you mean by "advance", "progress" and "success"? I might be able to better decipher whatever it is you're trying to say here if I have some idea of what you're talking about, in other than vague and nebulous terms. Thanks.

I's also like to know which black man you think is being "kept down".

If you don't like your group being cracked on do something to fix or change it and until then stay silent and remain silent.

"My group"? To be honest, I can't really say that I lose any sleep over WHO gets "cracked on", but it is pretty amusing to see the terms that must be employed in such "cracks" to convey the levels of abject fear in the "crack-ees". BY all means, continue with your fear-driven rants. I know thereby that there is no possibility of any sort of discourse on an intellectual level, but it amuses me to no end how some are willing to let the whites of their eyes show in a public forum.

reply to post by nenothtu


Yet again you are slamming people like me because the Conservative Dictatorship has ordered you to do so because if you didn't you'd be declared as Anti American and Anti Freedom when in reality all your GOP, Bagger overlords want is your total, blind allegiance all while they strip each and everyone of us of each of our rights and freedoms and since they failed on the Federal level they are doing it on the State level and yet again everyone of y'all remain dead silent.

Taking away collective barganing rights, taking away elected offices in Michigan on a whim if the Governor don't like the person, denying minorities the right to vote in Florida. Each and everyone of y'all are for this 1000% and by continually attacking me on this just further proves my point.

Remember whatyour Fuerer said in 04 "You are either with us or you are with the Terrorists!", this thinking applies moreso nowadays then it ever did back then.

Yet no original thought. Don't bother posting here until you stand up against the NeoConserivBaggerNazi movement that has hijacked your party and our nation!

Originally posted by TheImmaculateD1
reply to post by nenothtu

 

Yet again you are slamming people like me because the Conservative Dictatorship has ordered you to do so because if you didn't you'd be declared as Anti American and Anti Freedom when in reality all your GOP, Bagger overlords want is your total, blind allegiance all while they strip each and everyone of us of each of our rights and freedoms and since they failed on the Federal level they are doing it on the State level and yet again everyone of y'all remain dead silent.

Actually, I'm "slamming" people like you (if that's what it is I'm doing) because you are failing to make sense with your over the top extremist rants. Which "Conservative Dictatorship" has given me orders? Obama's? He seems to be at the top of the heap at the moment, so I can only assume that's whom you are referring to. I can assure you that I'm not currently marching to any "orders", from Obama or anyone else. Also, I have no overlords, nor do I have any underlings. I don't view life in that way, and acknowledge no superiors nor inferiors. We all are what we are, and not ranked into some fictitious hierarchy.

Speaking of stripped rights, where were your darlings when the Patriot Act was being voted back into commission by way of extension? Where were they when the government decided in it's own inimitable and draconian way that it could somehow ORDER me to purchase a product that I neither want nor need? Where were they when the TSA started cracking down on humanity and feeling up little old ladies and kids? All these things have occurred on their watch, you support them, yet you have the temerity to label ME a "nazi"? That truly sickens me - that you can't seem to fathom that you ARE what you decry.

Taking away collective barganing rights, taking away elected offices in Michigan on a whim if the Governor don't like the person, denying minorities the right to vote in Florida. Each and everyone of y'all are for this 1000% and by continually attacking me on this just further proves my point.

There ARE no collective bargaining "rights". That is is privilege granted by the government, and so can be taken away by same. "Rights" brook no dissent from man nor beast, do not need government permission, and just "are". They are only effective for as long as one cares to enforce them, one's self. All the "collective bargaining" that I've been witness to involved death and destruction by what amounted to pissed off mobs. Damn right I'm against it - and no one had to order me to be. I've seen what I've seen at the hands of the UMWA, the Teamsters, and the SEIU (which I was a member of prior to that eye-opener). Wanton violence against innocent people serves no purpose other than it's own, not any sort of greater good, and I don't care if it comes from an individual or an organized mob - I know wrong when I see it, and don't particularly need any one to tell me it's wrong. Try having to run a Union gauntlet of pissed off mobs and overturned burning cars just to get home from school. I have, and it's not a pleasant experience that I'd care to support.

I can't say what goes on in Michigan - I don't live there, and am content to let them run their own state as they see fit. Not my business. In like manner, I'm not aware of any minority in Florida who has been denied the right to vote. Enlighten me. Seems they may have a Federal case there.

Remember whatyour Fuerer said in 04 "You are either with us or you are with the Terrorists!", this thinking applies moreso nowadays then it ever did back then.

I don't have a "fuerehr". I recall Bush Jr. saying something to that effect, but I challenge you to point out even a single post I've ever made in support of that loon. Go ahead, try to find one before you start unthinkingly trying to sling mud.

Yet no original thought. Don't bother posting here until you stand up against the NeoConserivBaggerNazi movement that has hijacked your party and our nation!

Again, "MY" party? Which one is that? Furthermore, you seem to have lumped several entirely different and opposed entities together in that term. Either you can't tell the difference between them, or you are purposely trying to conflate them for propagandistic purposes. Which is it? I would have to guess the latter, as it leaves no doubt who you fear the most, or which side of the parapets on which you stand. Rational people who are trying to get across rational points don't talk like that - they tend to talk rationally, not bombastically.

It has been said that it's useless trying to hold a rational conversation with irrational people, and every word you utter solidifies that conviction.

Just so you'll know, I HAVE stood against Neocons, Nazis, and even some folks who claimed affiliation with the Tea Party, and yet did not espouse the same views. I have done so vociferously, and I have even done so at ATS. You evidently aren't aware of whom you're speaking to. Perhaps you've never read ANY of my posts?

reply to post by nenothtu



Ask 43 why only 1 Senator was allowed to read it and why the 99 others weren't allowed to? I stood against him and his entire cabal from Day 1 and using my backchannel work fought them every step of the way, even before Patriot was even on our collective radar. I fought TPTB on their own level right before Iraq, during the disaster that became Katrina, during the Military Commissions diatribe of 06. I am still challenging them as we speak and am so far suceeding for us all.

As to barganing rights it is a right because it allows a small group to be able to collectively bargain for better pay, better work conditions, heathcare.

What is occuring in Michigan will make it's way stateside and is vital to watch like a hawk to prevent it from taking hold in that state and in others. Your party is the GOP or whoever they are calling themselves today.

I do however thank you for standing up to these douchewads and go to one of their protests with a sign that reads "Republicans Against The Tea Party". This is no longer about the "Left-v-Right" paradigm but the "Us(meaning the American people and the people of the world)-v-Them (those douchewads trying to divide us all into a land of chaos)" paradigm.

I am not trying to sling mud at you as that is a very low and underhanded move which is not needed nor wanted and am just trying to id what the doucheheads at the Baggers are really backing and trying to get them to reshift their focus against the groups that they set out to hit on. Prevent this draconian group from taking hold here as ATS seems to be one of the very few avenues left that they cannot control as evidenced by the already debunked and disproven birth certificate nonsense that they seem to post a new thread about it about every other day. For the most part the threads seem to have subsided (Thank God) but it is only a matter of time before they return in droves after the summer winds down.