No Authentic Jew Will Recognize the State of Israel

This reminds me somewhat of the story of Saul/Paul, and credibility. If Saul's original goal was truly to damage Christianity, then what better way to do so than to falsely claim he saw Jesus arise and tell him all of these things, that contradict things he spoke of when he was alive. What better way to damage Christianity than to forever distort it? Sorry if that seemed a bit off topic. Back to the matter at hand:

Let's assume the Protocols are not a work of fiction. Lets assume hypothetically that is all factual. What do you think the zionists would do about it? Would they not create propaganda to have the "Goyim" think that it is all false? Would they not WANT you to swiftly dismiss it all as a hoax? Food for thought.

It really seems that Israel has a genocidal plot against the arab world.

The way i see it ,these eeevil non-authentical Zionist are doing very very very poor job plotting their genocidal plots. Given how much and how fast Arab population grows worldwide, including Israel. Oh, by the way - how many Jews are there in Saudi Arabia,Syria, Egypt or in Gaza?

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


such a poor job that theres been war constantly for this reason or that, yea. nothing to see here move along.

Let's assume the Protocols are not a work of fiction. Lets assume hypothetically that is all factual. What do you think the zionists would do about it? Would they not create propaganda to have the "Goyim" think that it is all false? Would they not WANT you to swiftly dismiss it all as a hoax? Food for thought.

Assume - is a key word. Lets assume a bit more - assume those protocols are true. International Jewery (which is the opposite of Zionists if you would care to actually think about it and not fire on reflex) is as mighty as it is described and it can start wars and dethrone monarchs and plan centuries ahead but it cannot prevent release of single book?
Or maybe it is wiser to assume that people claim it a fraud because it really was one?

A good website written and maintained by orthodox (traditional) jews. True Torah Jews Against Zionism

reply to post by 8ugsy


Very good point. some people here are stuck in a perpetual state of denial. but hey if the world was perfect we wouldnt be having this conversation.

Im going to go watch Fox, screw you guys

Originally posted by ElliotNoir
This is not my field of expertise but i know wrong when i see it. Argue w me if u must. I dont know names off the top of my head but the guy in the video is definitely an asshole. for saying what he said about the arab ppl just coming down from the trees, how can they be civilized? and 2 legged animals yada yada

Am I to assume if one crazy fruitcake says such a thing, then all other members of his countries say so too? Of course not. You dont even know the guys name or position, let alone what or who he represents.

Zionists and Israeli politicians

So this list...these are the people you identify as the racist and oppressive scum? You do not think these are idealistic and hard working and educated people?

Lets take an example: Can you list some of Simon Wiesenthals racist crimes?

It really seems that Israel has a genocidal plot against the arab world. Why do they hate them so? esp when they took everything from them and drove them out of their land. They got what they wanted, what else is it?

Arabs and Jews live side by side in Israel. Israeli pro sports teams have arab and jewish players playing side by side. Arab musicians appear on Israeli TV. Israelis and Arabs have affairs and marriages. So why do you think that they have a genocidal plot against the people they peacefully live side by side with? Why does it seem like that to you? Have you been to Israel? Have you attended the meetings of their politicians?

reply to post by Klassified


Yeah, strange that.......many of their followers reside in Israel, whether by birth or immigration) and they deem themselves anti-Zionists???

Israel can not exist without Zionism and Zionism can not exist without Israel. It's as simple of that !!!

reply to post by Skyfloating


because my head is full of propaganda. If Obl was our reason to get involved y are we still there?

Oh yea resources and most likely strategic placement of soldiers.

You are putting words in my mouth and i am not hungry.

I am not blaming ALL of Israel or ALL zionist.

reply to post by ElliotNoir


I am sorry to tell this to you but there were wars in Middle East since eh... well, since recorded history actually. And unlike during genocidal eeeevil Zionists (or geeez in short) there were times when entire populations were massacred into oblivion. Not grew in numbers faster then any other ethnic group. Do you know that there are almost 10 millions of Palestinians now worldwide - more then half under genocidal eeeevil Zionists military control , as opposed to 1 million in 1948. Doubt that you do. What is this - Genocide of third kind?
Think about it.

Originally posted by ElliotNoir

I am not blaming ALL of Israel or ALL zionist.

You have yet to identify who exactly you are blaming. Here is an exercise: Check out all these posts agreeing with your point of view and see if anyone of them clearly states who exactly these zionists are, what their agenda is and why they are doing what they are doing. Beyond political slogans such as "those racist, globalist scum!" there must be some identifiable and factual information out there.

I will retreat from this thread because I dont wish to be a pain in the ass. I was just curious. See you around the boards.

Israel is very aggresive politcaly and you are getting way off topic sir. You are trying to make me seem foolish by asking me off topic questions that i said i am not knowledgeable on.

there is a definition and a criteria
anyone who fits it is who im talking about

there i answered your question.

and again ppl are irrelevant if the system is still in place

Who are the illuminati who are the freemasons?

if the people responsible were easily identifiable it would be less of a problem

There is no difference with anyone in any country other than some people hold on to resources and some are unable to. Nothing, nothing, nothing is fair. Not on this planet. Do you understand that? Some lose their resources in a physical fight and some lose their resources in court and some are duped/swindled out of it. Children suffer because of this. Some in the right win and some in the wrong win. Do you want to know why some in the right win and some in the wrong win? Because mankind has become their own judge and their judgement comes with errors.

Fighting and hoarding of resources is everywhere. There is no exception anywhere. The counties in your video are not exclusive.

In breaking down the fighting between two countries involving large groups of people, take for instance, events that lead to a divorce between two people who have property/assets/resources and children together. In most cases there is physical and verbal fighting and both parties get hurt. Stories are made up, or minor discrepancies are eggagerated, or hard truths revealed. Both parties act out and cannot get along. They are bitter and resentful of each other. The parents of those divorcing take sides, as do their friends. One party says, "yeah he did that, blah, blah, blah" and the other party says, "oh yeah, well, she did that," Then each party has at least one friend that says, "ohhhh, poor, oh poor you, how mean of them" The children are given custody to one parent, or joint custody of the children is given, but one party complains about the other, STILL, they want ALL of the child. The children scream and cry, withering on the floor sometimes in agony over the pain of divorcing parents. Fist fly, blood is shed. Dozens of dozens of news reports, take your pick, do a google search for domestic violence. Some parents, as noted in many news outlets, reveal parents even kill their very own children so the other parent won't get them, or some divorcing each other slice each others throats or hire people to kill the other party. Happens all the time, everwhere, not just in Palestine. If we had cameras in each individual household across every country it would put your video to shame.

We see this every day.

Let me repeat.

We see this every day.

Please tell me again, what makes the two countries above, so awesomely exclusive where we should even care so we don't take notice of what we are doing to and in our own families and tend our own backyards first?

How is what is stated in the OP any different from what I state in my above paragraph? The difference is one is a collection of people and the other is two individual parties. Families need to get along first. Starting with husband and wives or parties that have children together. "They" say to start small. So let's start small and then once we have a grasp on that, reach out further.

I have yet to see a fair divorce. I only hear bitterness and resentment from those I have met who have been divorced. Divorce can never be fair unless two parties agree and work together as a team to achieve fairness. If this can be done, then there is no real divorce, as unity has been achieved in their agreement and it was done with genuine good spirit, although, on paper it would obviously say divorce. Remember, unity lays within the hearts and minds of BOTH parties, it is never one sided. Unity is not achieved with one party backing down and the other bullying and oppressing them into doing so as continued oppression usually leads to retaliation given the right climate.

Furthermore, the territories shown in the video even if given back territories each claim as theirs, would continue to have problems on a personal level, with their divorce and family problems and fighting and turning on each other. Until ever family in a single country that has been extablished in the current time, gets their act together and stops degrading the members of their own family units, with incest, back stabbing, betrayals, gossiping and jealousy, maybe, just maybe...

So the divorce of Israel and Palestine standing as countries, standing as a mass, fight, kill, bicker, bully, complain, just as those who do so one on one with each other.

Here's my solution. The countries that are countries now need to stay and be who they are, with the territories given. The people who are within each country need to work on being happy and grateful for the country they are in. Work to make it better and pretty to see and be in. And each person in that country, which is already in place and made up, fought for, doesn't even matter how it was done so, need to ALL take responsibility with their own families first. The countries are made, maps are in place. Ok, now, so work on your own personal families and your own hearts. Unity through hearts and minds is all it will take.

So don't feed me your propaganda garbage as if these two counties are excusive and victimized. We're all victims if we have no control over resources, no property paid in full, no assets, and our children are taken away from us via court order or some other way via family strife. We've been through the blood, the bruises, the pain, the screams, the threats, the degradation, the ridicule, nightmares and being exiled within our own communities because of slander and line drawing, real, eggagerated, or made up.

I care about my country, the U.S.A and the legal citizens and their famlies there in it FIRST. I care about them being safe and being with their famlies and feeling loved, experiencing wholesome delight/joy and feeling secure about their country that nothing bad will happen to it. It was made already, it stands, it is a territory, it's on a map, it is what it is and I love it and want to keep it.

Peace

Ive never read the protocols and to be honest I dont think I will, true or not I know enough depressing sh!t about the world already.

But here are some things I do know, Most of the western worlds media is owned by jewish people.
Most of the big money guys in the world are jewish people, I dont mean rich I mean people who control the money.

Now when you combine these 2 factors is does make you stop and think maybe something could be going on.

I think its only natural for people who are at the top to conspire with each other to stay there, that sort of thing happens even in most companies so to look at the history of western finance and media over the past few hundred years........ Tell me its not even a wildcard possibility that somethings not going on????

reply to post by TheUniverse

Clearly freedom should be allowed people can read the book and come to their own discernment of how to take it into their own Context.

People absolutely have a right to read the book and come to their own conclusions. However, it would be awfully ignorant of someone to not review the overwhelming evidence that proves that this particular text is a fear-mongering, state produced, downright forged fraud.

And what exactly do you mean "take it into their own Context"? Surely you don't read books like The Da Vinci Code and take it into a factual context? It is a work of fiction, just like The Protocols.

Why Vehemently attack the OP

I did not vehemently attack the OP for I do not personally know him. I did, however, attack ignorance, and that is something I pride myself in doing: combating ignorance.

Are you a paid Zionists Dis-info Agent. Surprised you got so many stars for such a contrived posts Denouncing something you seem to have so much angst for!

I am not a paid dis-info agent. Is this a normal question you ask of someone who disagrees with your position? How immature. I would be embarrassed if I were you.

Originally posted by ElliotNoir
reply to post by UcDat

 

it works for me

its working for me now too was giving me a video not redy or somesuch on the google vid page...

reply to post by ZeroKnowledge


Most of the "Palestinians" you speak of outside of this "Palestine" you speak of are NOT genuine "Palestinians" at all. That's like deeming all Jews, Israelis, when a majority of Jews are in fact not Israeli at all.

Keep in mind there are also Israeli Arabs......go ask them if they prefer to live under Israeli or "Palestinian" rule.....get back to me when you've got the answer!

reply to post by Skyfloating

Ive watched many dozens of videos like this on ATS. Ive seen hundreds of threads starting with "I am not against Jews, just against Zionists". They all follow the same pattern of repackaging old anti-semitic theories as "new" anti-zionist theories. But it remains vague who these "Zionists" actually are.

I believe a good place to start is the World Zionist Organization. That should give you a grasp of the definition of a Zionist I believe.

The World Zionist Organization (Hebrew: ההסתדרות הציונית העולמית‎), or WZO, was founded as the Zionist Organization (Hebrew: ההסתדרות הציונית‎), or ZO, in 1897 at the First Zionist Congress, held from August 29 to August 31 in Basel, Switzerland.[1] It changed its name to World Zionist Organization in January 1960. The ZO served as an umbrella organization for the Zionist movement, whose objective was the creation of a Jewish homeland in Palestine - at that time under the Ottoman Empire and following the First World War The British Mandate of Palestine. Theodor Herzl, who with Max Nordau and Zvi Shimshi, organized the first Congress, later wrote in his diary: "If I were to sum up the Congress in a word – which I shall take care not to publish – it would be this: At Basle I founded the Jewish State. If I said this out loud today I would be greeted by universal laughter. In five years perhaps, and certainly in fifty years, everyone will perceive it."

en.wikipedia.org...

There is a WZO website as well and it's currently under construction. There are Jewish people opposed to Zionism and they attempt to define it as well. They believe that the creation of Israel in 1948 was not in line with what God wrote and was forced. I always wondered why it was such a violent process myself seeing as how the Western Christians believe it was a prophecy being fulfilled.

Jews who criticize or oppose Zionism are usually Orthodox and maintain that Israel can only be regained miraculously. They view the present state as a blasphemous human attempt to usurp G­d's role, and they work to dismantle Israel. However, unlike many gentile anti­Zionists, they firmly believe in the Jewish right to Israel, but only at that future time of redemption. The best­known of the religious anti­Zionists are the Neturei Karta. Two common religious grounds are typically given for anti­Zionism. One is that today's Zionism is a secular Zionism, packed with non­Jewish influences, and lacking key features like Moshiach and the rebuilt Temple. Adherents to this position are more on the non­Zionist rather than anti­Zionist side.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...

There is a fine line between anti Zionism and Antisemitism.

There is a dangerous confluence between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism, though the two concepts are not always identical. Anti-Zionism is often used to conceal hatred of Jews. Anti-Semitic views can be easily distinguished from legitimate criticism of Israel.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...&_Anti-Zionism.html

Consider the source. Is the speaker someone with a history of anti-Jewish attitudes? Critics who habitually single out Israel for condemnation while ignoring far worse actions by other countries (especially other Middle Eastern countries) are anti-Semitic. Likening Israel to Nazi Germany, or to traditional anti-Jewish stereotypical behavior is another sure sign of Jew-baiting. Attacks on the merits of Israel's existence rather than individual government policies are anti-Semitic.

www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org...&_Anti-Zionism.html

So according to the above definition by the Jewish Virtual Library, there are Jewish people who are Anti-Semitic. I don't agree with all of the definitions here because I believe you can question Israel's existence and still have no hatred or dislike of the population. That's my opinion though,.

reply to post by jackflap


The WZO is not a true definition of Zionism.

To fully understand what REAL Zionism is can only be fully understood if you are an Israeli or you plan on immigrating to Israel.

The TRUE spirit of Zionism can not be fully understood until you become part of the Israeli people and it's nation -physically, mentally, and most of all, spiritually. It's hard to describe in English words, but I think you get my drift.