EXPERT: This Is Beyond Their Ability To Contain

Originally posted by pellian
Has any body considered dropping borax on to the reactor? boron is an excellent neutron modulator and will drop the cross sectional area of the fuel rods. they will cool down in no time.

Borax is a form of sodium, I don't have the periodic table in front of me here but the reaction could work. Again, I am a bit tanked at the moment so my spelling may not be the best. The problem would be keeping it in a tight enough grouping and it would need to be chilled to keep the flash point stable. If the Borax were to be introduced and the heat in the core would cause it to "flash" that could create more problems, but if it were frozen with water, it would be much more stable and the introduction of the water as ice along with the Borax would keep the mix stable. It's unknown where the fuel pellets or "rods" are at now or how far along the breakdown is. But we will for sure know soon!!!

Originally posted by randomname
snip

then when something really big happens, you get no warning or a 5 sec piece, like they did about katrina.

there was no screaming 24/7 news telling people to get out of new orleans.

Um, yes there was.

reply to post by daddio


Are their any other wildcard solutions?
I don't want to get the feeling that nobody really knows what they are doing but that is the impression that I'm starting to get. It seems like the people in charge are dinking around instead of coming up with an end game solution.
Though I guess no one ever expects a meltdown so there is no game plan for a worst case scenario.
Humanity decided to gamble with nuclear power and it looks like they lost.

Originally posted by amongus

Originally posted by -W1LL
reply to post by amongus

 

its to HOT near the sites to start any kind of work.

radioactive = HOT

and temps that high will not let concrete cure correctly first thing that needs to happen is cooling and then containment.

concrete takes time aswell you must do it right. theres so much prep that goes into it re-bar forms. and who knows if there a working concrete plant in japan after the damage?

Or they can Fight fire with Fire..!!

Nuke the site. Vapourise the materials, melt and fuse the reactors and hard materials to seal the site..

edit on 3/28/2011 by Ironclad because: (no reason given)

reply to post by ELahrairah


Over on page 396 of the main Nuclear Crisis thread this post shows some good thinking:

Originally posted by BKGump
reply to post by TheRedneck

 

Hello Redneck,
Thanks for your response to my post. I have been thinking things through and I still think a boron (boric acid or?) and ceramic aggregate slurry or sand could be pumped to drop on top of the “partially” melting fuel rods now to help slow the decay rate and also create a boundary layer where it seems that seawater is in direct contact with the core.
The contact between the seawater (dumping into the Pacific Ocean) and core materials is no doubt producing a long list of “by products”.
However, Uranyl Chloride, which is created “when chlorine gas is passed over hot Uranium Dioxide (fuel rods) is UBER toxic and fully water soluble and “bio-absorbable”. This is most likely the cause of the “Tokyo yellow rain” and must also be falling down in smaller amounts in Western North America.
See: en.wikipedia.org...
I wonder if Plutonium can also for water soluble compounds under such conditions?

We need to isolate and “dilute” the corium or “partial corium” from the Pacific Ocean and a source of chlorine. Otherwise this will at the very least be pumping vast amounts of yellow death into the biosphere. Cover it with hot ceramic lava as the ceramic blends with the core.
It might also help to “seal” containment breaches in the core??? Imagine the core becoming a “cooler” magma than just corium alone. In a full meltdown we are going to lose the containment vessel at some point…..?
Thoughts?
Thanks again for all you contributions at ATS,
BKGump

Regarding Tepco and it's inability to devise a solution to this problem we have the following:

Shogo Fukuda, a TEPCO spokesman, said that 8.6 was the maximum magnitude entered into the TEPCO internal computer modeling for Fukushima Dai-ichi.

Another TEPCO spokesman, Motoyasu Tamaki, used a new buzzword, "sotegai," or "outside our imagination," to describe what actually occurred.

Source

So we need to have something happen that hasn't happened yet. Not sure what that is, but I did mention benign extraterrestrial assistance in that other thread .

I do not mind being thought of as crazy in this matter, but if anyone who reads this knows of their existence (I know they've been here for a LONG time, don't need physical proof, but have personal experiences to back up the knowledge) and feels compelled to ask for help (from the 'servants of the LIGHT), please do so. I have personally made a request and will continue to make more. Maybe if we get a "critical mass" of people all asking the same thing (ET, please help us) then something might happen.

Beyond that, I do not know if any current human technology has the capacity to stop this.

reply to post by v1rtu0s0


Joseph Cirincione is not an expert on Nuclear power plants. As a matter of fact he is not an expert on any engineering aspect of nuclear energy. He is an Activist (President and CEO of the Ploughshares Fund,) just like the rest of so called experts on the MSM. He writes books, More like scare books about nuclear weapons and all that dooms day stuff. He is not even remotely qualified to answer any question about Nuclear anything.

Ploughshares is a grant making foundation, otherwise as a Nuclear Activist group. I noticed he also updated his web page to expert after the CNN boradcast. _javascript:icon('')

ploughshares



WIKI

Don’t even listen to this guy on CNN.

.
Do you really think the U.S. MSM is ever going to put on a real expert on nuclear power plants? ( not a chance) I only saw one network do this. I don’t recall the name of the network but saw it with my neighbor, it a was live stream in from a university in Johannesburg South Africa. The person they put on was an applied research professor in nuclear psychics. (Not theoretical or an activist) That professor knows nuclear power plants inside-out., He was one of the designers for the Fukushima plant. To sum it up the professor from Johannesburg stated. “They will have to use concrete, but the reactors must cool first, The power company has to give up trying to save the plant because it’s gone. He also said there was a partial meltdown in reactor 2 and maybe in 3 also.” This was last week folks ! My neighbor down the street is also a nuclear physicists in applied research at LANL. He is the guy I was watching this with at his house. my neighbor said the same as the professor in Johannesburg whom he knows personalty, not to mention he said What the F**** are all those rods so close to plant for " My neighbor and his colleague from Johannesburg are worried about the spent rods more than anything else going on with the Fukushima plant. The worry is contamination levels from the spent rods and the cooling of the spent rods, otherwise one problem will contribute to the next.



CNN has been doing nothing,but fear mongering.

Even if some form of entombment is used that might stop a meltdown it is still a big problem these reactors have been leaking a good amount of radiation in to the environment doing untold damage.
I would hate to see some type situation like BP giving themselves a pat on the back when they capped the oil well
and acting like the problem was solved and that it should not concern anybody anymore.

I have considered the idea of ET intervention they would have to be some real jerks to have advance technology that could help the situation and not intervene screw some prime directive.
Maybe they are just jerks or maybe humanity is in this on it's own..............shuder

reply to post by v1rtu0s0


man. poor japan. they are f**ked!!. if only they weren't going to pull out of the dollar....

Wasn't the 10 million times estimate proven to be false?

TEPCO Apologises for radiation spike false alarm

Japan nuclear crisis: Radiation spike report 'mistaken'

I think the radiation spike was still high, but nowhere near as high as 10 million

I'm so frustrated because I think we're such friggin' idiots. Japan is in a Catch 22 situation, and this thing WILL end badly. Choices: let 'em melt or water down. The later only buys time. Is it being used to evacuate people? Probably not to the extent that it should be. A better difference could be made there. And I hope there are no explosions.

Catch 22

Next, it looks like there will be Energy Committee Hearings on Nuclear Safety in DC this week. But really, the beat goes on. That's the History. We never learn. It's all for show. After all, it's the People vs Corpocracy. Have the few percent parked on Boardwalk ever cared about safety or suffering? In Japan, or anywhere?

Energy Committee Hearings on Nuclear Safety in US

Originally posted by iamric
reply to post by Sanjur0

 

Why not nuke it? It could destroy the rods and contain the length of the damages.. Their is going to be fallout anyway sort of like Red Adair bombing the oil blowouts.

rc

possibly the worst idea in history of mankind.....that would spew the radiation into the upper-atmosphere....An idea like that could literally kill all of mankind

They keep lying to prevent panic and to give the ultra-rich an opportunity to position themselves for the inevitable stock market collapse.

reply to post by jadedANDcynical


I am not trying to be a jerk here, but um, how do you suggest the rest of us contact "ET" ? Seriously, I want to know.

Originally posted by amongus
What I don't understand is why the HELL they aren't starting to dump cocncrete on these reactors NOW! They have to know that their efforts are only futile at this point, right? NOW people!

Pure guess here - but it's too hot. They can't get near this thing.

Why hasn't the possibility of encasing the plant like Chernobyl or burying it in sand come up?

Originally posted by pirhanna
A guy on CNN just claimed "The radioactivity of plutonium found in the soil at the site could be from past bombs"
Then when asked if he was serious, he repeated it and said that it could very well be the case that the radiation detected at the site isn't from the reactors but quite likely from old bombs.

Who the **** could really believe something so blatantly false?

This is BP part II. It will drag on for months and destroy entire ecosystems and kill many people.
Very sad.

it might not be that far fetched.
Ben Fulford has claimed from the beginning that plutonium was added to reactor 3 a few months back against the japanese administrators edicts.
He claims this was to hide what was to come, which was 2 underwater nukes that were planted and detonated to cause the earthquake and tsunami.
If there are 3 plutonium signatures found in Japan soil, and only one of them came from the reactors, then the cover might be blown allready.

This is possibly VERY significant and not some japanese blame game.

reply to post by manna2

He claims this was to hide what was to come, which was 2 underwater nukes that were planted and detonated to cause the earthquake and tsunami.

What purpose would this serve - I doubt a country would do this to their own population. What would the gain be - they've lost everything.

Don't look for ETs to save us this time around. They have intervened before and there were consequences - unintended consequences. For quite some time Earth and its inhabitants have been quarantined - so that we don't spread our madness to the rest of the galaxy. This 2011-2012 time frame is very important for all humanity - a graduation of sorts. The SHTF during 2011 and sorts itself out during 2012. Have we humans evolved enough be allowed out of the quarantine to join the galactic community at large?
Prerequisites for our entre into the galactic community include humans figuring out that violence and killing each other is unacceptable. All wars would have ceased and we would have found alternative means to solve our disputes that would not include violence. How are we doing on that one?
We would have had to develop a deep love, understanding, compassion and connection to our beautiful planet Earth - the garden we live in. How are we doing on that one?
We would have had to learn not to hate each other for our differences so that we could accept beings who are very different from our own human bilology - they are silica based. How are we doing on that one?
We are on our own with this mess. It's up to us to figure this one out. How stupid were humans to come up with a power source that created waste that would destroy us - even if it was a good day - one without earthquakes, tsunamis?
Should we even be allowed to graduate??

Originally posted by randomname
that doesn't even make sense what she said, of course the water has a million x more radiation than normal water, it's been dumped into an open reactor.

this fearmongering is why people end up dying. they sensationalize every stupid thing, mix words around and get "experts" to blab on for minutes making no sense.

then when something really big happens, you get no warning or a 5 sec piece, like they did about katrina.

there was no screaming 24/7 news telling people to get out of new orleans.

I just wanna clear up your New Orleans comment. A recommended voluntary evacuation was in progress days before the storm hit. This was all over the news. This storm grew very fast and once it was determined N.O. was gonna be slammed with the big one the mayor took action to evacuate the city.

~~~~~~~~~~~~QUOTE~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sunday, August 28, 2005

Just after midnight, at 12:40 AM CDT (0540 UTC), Hurricane Katrina reached Category 4 intensity with 145 mph (233 km/h) winds. By 7:00 AM CDT (1200 UTC), it was a Category 5 storm, with maximum sustained winds of 175 mph (280 km/h), gusts up to 215 mph (344 km/h) and a central pressure of 902 mbar.

In a press conference at roughly 10:00 AM CDT (1500 UTC), Nagin declared that "a mandatory evacuation order is hereby called for all of the parish of Orleans." "We're facing the storm most of us have feared," he told the early-morning news conference, with the governor at his side. Following Nagin's speech, Governor Blanco stated that President Bush called her "just before" the press conference and said that he was "concerned about the [storm’s] impact" and asked her "to please ensure that there would be a mandatory evacuation of New Orleans."[9] Katrina was expected to make landfall overnight.
Monday, August 29, 2005

At 5:10 AM CDT (1010 UTC), Hurricane Katrina made its second landfall as a strong Category 3 hurricane near Buras-Triumph, Louisiana, with sustained winds of more than 125 mph (205 km/h), although Category 4 winds may have briefly affected the area
~~~~~~~~~~~~~END QUOTE~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From en.wikipedia.org...

It grew from a 4 to a 5 in a few hours. With a Hurricane you cannot just evac everyone along the whole coast.. no on would have anywhere to go.They change their path quickly. You have to determine where it will hit then evac those people.

I stayed for the Hurricane. The Hurricane did not kill tons of people as it come over New Orleans - everyone who left, got out safely. It was the flood waters and other aftermath of the hurricane that killed people. By that time most people were safely out of the city or were getting out.

I left after a couple of days after Katrina hit. Water was still rising flooding the city. The city is bowl shaped and sits 18 feel under sea level. The flood did most of the damage that ruined New Orleans. The evacuation was a great success and people did have ample time to leave.

reply to post by galacticgirl


Are we ready? It's like asking a monkey to drive a spaceship.