Bible Answers to Member Questions

reply to post by Lazarus Short


Well I'll be, you know about fermenting and leaven being a type of sin, very good, most people would not have a clue what your a speaking of.

As for the last statement in verse 10 about "bring out the worse wine" after the new has been drunk, this is just a general statement made by someone. Not a definite fact of the sequence of events that took place before Jesus arrived at the wedding. Any such assumptions would be little more than wishful conjecture.

I'll stick with what verse 2 said about the people having no wine, without ever having any to begin with. Any more comments on either opinion would just be guess work.

I think these blame 10 verses in John has been commented on more than enough!

Originally posted by KJV1611
So you're saying you wash peoples feet?

Good answer here LS on the sabbath, and no, I do not wash feet either. Any such WORK has no bearing on ones salvation.

Thank you, KJV, for the kind words. However, why do you call foot washing a "WORK"? It is an ordinance, and has nothing to do with personal salvation, but is on the level of "I demonstrate that I can humble myself in your service." The first time I participated, I almost wept.

lol i am a trained pedicurist and manicurist.
many feet have i washed (and lotioned, and trimmed toe nails, and polished, and treated cuticles and corns, and pumiced callouses and massaged with oil, to boot!)

reply to post by Rustami


there's a chemical in red grapes in particular, that is an anti-coagulant. it thins blood. so in a concentrated form, like fresh juice or even red wine, a glass of red grape juice or red wine, a day, will solve several problems related to circulation and therefore blood pressure. similar to how an aspirin a day works.

reply to post by D377MC

till all be fulfilled

the debate on this is what fulfillment he was referring to. assuming he meant all prophecies regarding him, is one way of looking at it. assuming he was referring to his crucifixion and resurrection, is another way of looking at it.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by D377MC

 

till all be fulfilled

the debate on this is what fulfillment he was referring to. assuming he meant all prophecies regarding him, is one way of looking at it. assuming he was referring to his crucifixion and resurrection, is another way of looking at it.

I would assume it means just what it says, till ALL is fulfilled. Everything, like the Great White Throne Judgment, the descent of the New Jerusalem, the creation of the New Earth and the New Heavens, the advent of Eternity, he final salvation of mankind, the complete reconciliation of the creation with the Creator, the Restoration of All Things. Some of that would take some explanation...

Originally posted by Lazarus Short

Originally posted by Akragon

So you're saying you wash peoples feet?

And of course you keep the sabbath exactly how God wanted you to in the OT....right?

I have washed feet - some churches/denominations keep foot washing as an ordinance, some don't.

I don't keep the sabbath exactly, being free from the burden of the exacting Ordinances. As an ex-Seventh Day Adventist, I discovered that our modern calendar does not quite gibe with the ancient Hebrew calendar. On a Hight Sabbath, the week count started over, so that Sabbath/Saturday could fall on any day of the week of our modern calendar. The important thing, to me, is to take some time off, rest, and worship.

Good answer my friend...i was expecting to hear you talk of the sunday sabbath... this is usually where i can just tell people they have no idea what their talking about... Good for you.

On a side note... the sabbath is from friday at sundown....to saturday at sundown.... remember there was no clocks back then... their time was the rising and setting of the sun.

As for washing peoples feet....uhm.. ew!

Hahaha...just kidding

Jesus was mearly teaching people to be humble by washing peoples feet... the so called "king" or lord washed the feet of people whom others would consider to be disgusting or fowl... It doesn't mean you should wash others feet though it was only symbolic... showing people that even he is equal to everyone else.

reply to post by Lazarus Short


i'm not convinced of that, primarily because taking it that way, requires the gift of salvation to be constantly under threat due to sin. if it were that easy to lose it, we'd be back to old covenant standards and the point of having a messiah in the first place, would be lost.

reply to post by KJV1611

I think God picked them because they are the most stubbern, greedy, faithless people on the planet.

wow .....light bulb moment! thanks!!

reply to post by Lazarus Short


As for foot washing, I a sure it is a good thing and all, but I just don't participate in it. I only hold to two ordinances which are baptism AFTER personal salvation, and the Lord's supper or Communion.

Even these I consider both as WORKS but only after salvation. For as any Christian knows, WORKS always follow salvation and shows if your saved. "You shall know them by their fruits"

There of course is nothing wrong with feet washers and if you feel closer to God by doing this, by all means have at it.

HEBREWS 9:10
"Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ORDINANCES, imposed on them until the time of reformation."

But as ad cat pointed out, I think feet washing was symbolic as well. The Jews did this all the time, but I don't think it is commanded for Christians to keep.

As for the wine debate, do what God has SHOWN YOU to be correct. For me, I know I should, but others may have there own convictions.

1 CORINTHIANS 6:12
"ALL THINGS are lawful unto me, but ALL THINGS are not expedient: ALL THINGS are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any."

1 CORINTHIANS 10:23
"ALL THINGS are lawful for me, but ALL THINGS are not expedient: ALL THINGS are lawful for me, but ALL THINGS EDIFY not."

"till all be fulfilled" I think is Rev 21, and 22. Good of a guess as any!

reply to post by tony3174


What sort of enlightenment did you come across here? I'm just telling it as it is, right out of the Bible.

The Bible is a crazy book isn't it? It was written completely by Jews, and yet is the most anti-semitic book around. Which goes to show it wasn't just man made and hand picked.

Unless of course you have a new perversion of the Bible, then almost every verse has been hand picked, trimmed, transliterated (hell=sheol... ), revised, edited, cut, copied, subtracted from, added to, and just plain ole lied about.

We can thank England for the greek text used to make over 234 new perversions here in America. God help us.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Lazarus Short

 

i'm not convinced of that, primarily because taking it that way, requires the gift of salvation to be constantly under threat due to sin. if it were that easy to lose it, we'd be back to old covenant standards and the point of having a messiah in the first place, would be lost.

Undo, I don't know to what exactly you are referring - the "Quote" function is very handy, especially in looooong threads like this one. I subscribe to the doctrine of Universal Reconciliation, so "threat due to sin" is not a major problem for me.

Originally posted by KJV1611
We can thank England for the greek text used to make over 234 new perversions here in America. God help us.

You must be referring to Westcott and Hort. I have a Ferrar Fenton bible, and was saddened to find that he used the Westcott & Hort Greek text. I like his Old Testament, however. He wrote, in his intro to his NT, that "...he became convinced, after a study of the then called German School of Biblical Criticism, but now the Higher Criticism, that unless the Sacred Scriptures were translated afresh into current spoken English, a belief in the Christian Religion as a faith would perish, for that by the unavoidable ignorance of the Old Translators, and the obsolete dialect of the A. V. and subsequently of the Revised Version, its documentary basis had become unintelligible to us." I don't think his conviction panned out. Even today, I don't think it is too difficult to master the 1611 language, and a person should, if for no other reason but to enjoy Shakespeare better, for his works are one of the three pillars of English literature:

the King James Bible

Shakespeare

Tolkien

reply to post by Lazarus Short


well if he's referring to the law being fulfiiled as a result of his crucifixion and resurrection, then
apparently the way we look at the law has changed or should change. paul seems to suggest the same when he
says, all things are permitted as a result of grace and the new covenant, but not all things are recommended or encouraged (paraphrasing). permissive will vs. perfect will. you can be in the permissive will of god as a result of grace, which means that the law is not void (because it still exists), but it no longer exists as a
standard over our lives in the way it once did. what we strive for, is to be in the perfect, rather than permissive will of god, but he's not sitting on top of our house waiting for us to make mistakes either, even if we may tend to do that to each other

Originally posted by undo


well if he's referring to the law being fulfiiled as a result of his crucifixion and resurrection, then
apparently the way we look at the law has changed or should change. paul seems to suggest the same when he
says, all things are permitted as a result of grace and the new covenant, but not all things are recommended or encouraged (paraphrasing). permissive will vs. perfect will. you can be in the permissive will of god as a result of grace, which means that the law is not void (because it still exists), but it no longer exists as a
standard over our lives in the way it once did. what we strive for, is to be in the perfect, rather than permissive will of god, but he's not sitting on top of our house waiting for us to make mistakes either, even if we may tend to do that to each other

edit on 3-4-2011 by undo because: (no reason given)

I see it this way: Among the children of Israel, God laid down a rather narrow moral landscape for His people to operate in. It was restrictive, burdensome, impossible to do perfectly. After Jesus did do it correctly, and in fact, the Law makes provision for just such a person, the Good News went forth to the world. God, knowing of the very different cultures the Good News would go out to, made our moral landscape quite a bit wider, in order to accommodate as many different cultures and groups as possible. Look at the result in the early Greek Christians and Jewish Christians, who had been enemies before!

Now, I have a serious question for our host, KJV1611, as follows:

I was doing some more work this afternoon on my book. It's theme is that God's relationship to Israel was like (and I say again, LIKE) a marriage. I was listing all the passages in the books of Moses having to do with marriage, and got to Leviticus 26, where the blessings for obedience and the cursings for disobedience are listed (note that the cursings section is far longer). In the cursings section, I noted that God said over and over that He would punish the people "seven times more" for their sins. I underlined,and found He had said it four times, each time in a different way. Mmmmmm...what could it mean? Knowing that many things in the OT are prophetic, I calculated 4 X 7 = 28. Twenty-eight periods of time? What kinds of periods? The same section mentions the land "enjoying her sabbaths" while the people are in exile in the land of their enemies.

So my question is this - are we talking about the seven-year sabbath year cycle, or the fifty-one-year Jubilee cycle???

Now, I know that the Jubilee is not mentioned in this passage, but if it is that, then 4 X 7 X 51 = 1428 years. Further, we know that Israel began to be punished by God shortly after the "wedding" at Sinai, that is, after the whole golden calf episode. Now if we look to the crossing of the Jordan River forty years later as a sort of reset, then that year 2488 + 1428 = 3916 - within the lifetime of Jesus! If the chronology I have before me is correct, that would be eleven years before the Crucifixion. What are your thoughts?

I am not a believer, but I'm just going to bypass all the assumptions I have to make in order to even ask a few questions. In any case its about time for a good old god discussion, so I'll play.

Can the bible tell me why god was so obsessed with the lives and actions of primitive men, specifically a few individuals, and appears to show a total lack of interest with the now more technically developed and impressive humankind? I would assume that when one of his creatures gains the ability to destroy the Earth, would god not do more than he did when we were still chucking spears for the most part.

An omnipotent god would have already known what was going to happen. The only way for this to occur is if he controls what happens and we have no free will, not only that, he is the cause for all the suffering in world. Is god not completely omnipotent, but just enough so that he is not responsible for what his creations do?

How can god, in his omnipotence, show negative human emotions like anger and wrath? A perfect being would not display imperfect qualities.

reply to post by RSF77

Originally posted by RSF77
I am not a believer, but I'm just going to bypass all the assumptions I have to make in order to even ask a few questions. In any case its about time for a good old god discussion, so I'll play.

Happy to "play" along.

Can the bible tell me why god was so obsessed with the lives and actions of primitive men, specifically a few individuals,

Because God is a racist and segregationist silly. God loves you, ONLY if you love his Son. Guess who that is.

ISAIAH 55:8-9
"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways MY WAYS, saith the LORD.
For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are MY WAYS higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."

and appears to show a total lack of interest with the now more technically developed and impressive humankind? I would assume that when one of his creatures gains the ability to destroy the Earth, would god not do more than he did when we were still chucking spears for the most part.

oh, God is far from done with this world. Read the last book in the Bible; Revelations, for further details. Or the book of Daniel, or Isaiah, or Jeremiah or, well you get the picture. Just because you don't know where God is talking about the modern age, doesn't mean it isn't in the Bible.

An omnipotent god would have already known what was going to happen. The only way for this to occur is if he controls what happens and we have no free will,

Oh free will is very much present. YOU get to decide where you choose to live for eternity, be it Heaven or Hell. As for this world and the future plans/governments/nations/future, who said these were ours to begin with to impose our will on? God's will must be imposed upon the Universe, but not on individuals.

If God's will was not imposed on the universe, where do you think the electrons circling around atoms would fly off to. You think gravity would still work? What about your heart beating without you telling it too? Face it, you need God's will on all things. But you do have the choice to pick your eternal home. Choose wisely.

not only that, he is the cause for all the suffering in world. Is god not completely omnipotent, but just enough so that he is not responsible for what his creations do?

2 CORINTHIANS 4:4
"In whom the GOD OF THIS WORLD hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them."

Satan is the ruler or"god" of this present world, not the God of the Bible. Why you think things are so bad? Although God does jump in from time to time to punish men for their sin. War and natural disasters are some of God's favorite punishments for sin, be it individual or national.

Job 37:9-13
"Out of the south cometh the WHIRLWIND: and cold out of the north.
By the breath of God frost is given: and the breadth of the waters is straitened.
Also by watering he wearieth the thick cloud: he scattereth his bright cloud:
And it is turned round about by his counsels: that they may do whatsoever he commandeth them upon the face of the world in the earth."
He causeth it to come, whether for correction, or for his land, or for mercy." many more....

How can god, in his omnipotence, show negative human emotions like anger and wrath? A perfect being would not display imperfect qualities.

Going back to your original quote about assuming, you are embarrassingly assuming a "perfect being" would not display NEGATIVE qualities. You have two (2) assumptions in one sentence that are horribly in err.

God does get angry and even tells us too as well.

EPHESIANS 4:26
"Be ye angry, AND SIN NOT: let not the sun go down upon your wrath:"

God shows great wrath and rightly so. I guess your one of them parents that doesn't beat your children huh? Read my sig ↓

If God is love, then God must also hate. If he is kind, then he most certainly have anger. If he is merciful, then by default he must also show wrath. For you can not be one of these adjectives without displaying the other. Example: You can not show mercy unless you have also shown wrath in the past.

These equal attributes of God I am talking about are summed up in one word, a word no one seems to know, nor understand. God is perfectly balanced, which is called:

HOLY.

God is Holy, and these "imperfect qualities" you attribute to God are called HOLY in the Bible. But you may know more than God and the Bible, so you choose to "follow your own path" or "decide for yourself".

Good luck. Next?

reply to post by KJV1611


I'll take a stab, im bored

Can you explain Chirsts teachings in a few sentences, in your own words, without quoting the book?

reply to post by Lazarus Short

Originally posted by Lazarus Short
Now, I have a serious question for our host, KJV1611, as follows:

This should be good....

I was doing some more work this afternoon on my book. It's theme is that God's relationship to Israel was like (and I say again, LIKE) a marriage.

WAS a marriage, and will be again

JEREMIAH 3:14
"Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I am MARRIED unto you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion:

They will "turn back" just as God asked them to, and they will be married again. In the future of course, not right now.

I was listing all the passages in the books of Moses having to do with marriage, and got to Leviticus 26, where the blessings for obedience and the cursings for disobedience are listed (note that the cursings section is far longer).

It always is. Don't you just love how God works? Just do what he said and all is well. Disobey, and the world falls apart!

In the cursings section, I noted that God said over and over that He would punish the people "seven times more" for their sins. I underlined,and found He had said it four times, each time in a different way. Mmmmmm...what could it mean? Knowing that many things in the OT are prophetic,

Stopping here I completely agree with what you have said thus far. But your next few statements are diving off into speculation and opinion , ALTHOUGH, based on scripture. But you know as well as I, what follows is by no way, "date setting". We shall proceed with utmost caution.

I calculated 4 X 7 = 28. Twenty-eight periods of time? What kinds of periods? The same section mentions the land "enjoying her sabbaths" while the people are in exile in the land of their enemies.

So my question is this - are we talking about the seven-year sabbath year cycle, or the fifty-one-year Jubilee cycle???

I have studied some of Clarance Larkin's charts on this subject, as well as Peter Ruckman's and Hal Lindsey. As for the answer, beats me!

Now, I know that the Jubilee is not mentioned in this passage, but if it is that, then 4 X 7 X 51 = 1428 years. Further, we know that Israel began to be punished by God shortly after the "wedding" at Sinai, that is, after the whole golden calf episode. Now if we look to the crossing of the Jordan River forty years later as a sort of reset, then that year 2488 + 1428 = 3916 - within the lifetime of Jesus! If the chronology I have before me is correct, that would be eleven years before the Crucifixion. What are your thoughts?

This could be accurate, and may show yet another prophecy detailing Jesus Chirst's first coming. But as it is, there is already 44+ prophecies dealing with this and over 500 yet to be fulfilled dealing with Christ's second coming.

Here's my official reply:
The meat of your question appears to deal with these verses found after all the "seven" curses being proclaimed by God:

Leviticus 26:33-35
"And I will scatter you among the heathen, and will draw out a sword after you: and your land shall be desolate, and your cities waste.
Then shall the land enjoy her sabbaths, as long as it lieth desolate, and ye be in your enemies' land; even then shall the land rest, and enjoy her sabbaths.
As long as it lieth desolate it shall rest; because it did not rest in your sabbaths, when ye dwelt upon it."

All these curses happened as found recorded later in the Bible in 1,2 Kings and 1, 2 Chronicles. as well as in the prophet books.

I believe these curses are still in effect BECAUSE the Jews rejected their messieh (Jesus Christ) and thus the seven curses roll on...UNTIL ↓↓↓

Leviticus 26:40-42
40 If they shall confess their iniquity, and the iniquity of their fathers, with their trespass which they trespassed against me, and that also they have walked contrary unto me;
41 And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity:
42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.

This will happen and God will have HIS CHOSEN people back. Now as for these "seven curses" we keep reading about in this chapter, can you think of another book in the Bible where "seven" curses appear in four different forms just like in Leviticus 26? This may ring a bell:

SEVEN seals
SEVEN trumpets
SEVEN bowls
SEVEN golden vials

Here are seven horrible wraiths/plagues/anger/judgments of God being sent against ISRAEL and the world during the Great tribulation, or the TIME OF JACOBS TROUBLE. Now compare these 4 sevens to the 4 sevens found below ↓

LEVITICUS 26
18 And if ye will not yet for all this hearken unto me, then I will punish you SEVEN times more for your sins.
21 And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; I will bring SEVEN times more plagues upon you according to your sins.
24 Then will I also walk contrary unto you, and will punish you yet SEVEN times for your sins.
28 Then I will walk contrary unto you also in fury; and I, even I, will chastise you SEVEN times for your sins.

You are somewhat close my friend on finding the hidden riches in the Bible. Continue to read and believe what you find in God's book and he will show you wonderous things. But also remember the below verse:

Leviticus 26:44
"And yet for all that, when they be in the land of their enemies, I will not cast them away, neither will I abhor them, to destroy them utterly, and to break my covenant with them: for I am the LORD their God."

Israel was God's chosen people, and they will be again after the tribulation found in the book of Revelations:

God will one day mark his people with a mark on their foreheads (the anti-christ will imitate this)
God will send 144,000 missionaries to his people throughout the world during the tribulation
God will protect his people in the wilderness (most likely found in Petra, southern Jordon)
And God will return for his people and save them from the armies of the United Nations. This is called the Second coming of Jesus Christ.

So historically these four sevens found in Leviticus happened already through out the Jews history. But prophetically these "four sevens" will happen in the future during the great tribulation.

That's my take on this, what say ye? I was right, this was a good question